 sj |
||
|
||
BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long
|
|
|
Subject: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: Janie Date: 10 Jan 14 - 09:06 PM Stealing a quote from Spaw on the thread about the WV water emergency that no one gives a f*ck about because it about West Virginia. Spawser pointed a finger at not only the coal industry, which was a bit misdirected in this instance, but also at himself and ourselves, which is not at all misdirected. Something I ponder often is how culpable I am for all the environmental and social ills at which I am often outraged. I thoroughly understand that corporations without consciences and big money politics are the big players, but they are only successful because we individuals, especially in 1st world countries, want what we want, and are unwilling to either pay full price for what we want or to do without what we want if the full price can be shifted elsewhere. All of us sitting at our computers are a case in point. I want and believe I need my computer. I read articles and feel outraged and/or guilty about the environmental impact and the toxic deaths and maimings related to the realities of "recycling" modern electronic devices in third world countries. Doesn't change my behavior, however. I am not prepared to either give up the technological conveniences for the sake of the environment or mankind, nor am I prepared to insist on paying enough for the same conveniences to cover the costs of responsible recycling. I want my plastics, heavy metals, etc., and I want them enough, and have the resources to afford to turn a blind eye to the global realities of the choices I make. Guilty feelings are cheap. I'm not actually very high tech or a large consumer. On my third cell phone, a flip phone, since my first cell phone in the mid 1990's. Also on only my 3rd computer. Took the other two to my progressive county landfill and dropped them off where I was told. The reality is, the county doesn't really know if the computers get taken down and recyled responsibly, or if they end up in a recycle dump in a third world country where some 8 year old kid ends up dead or disabled from unsafe handling of toxic metal components. thinking about all the finger-pointing that goes on in the world. Wonder how the world might change if all of us, me included, focused less on what others do that is harmful, and more on what we as individuals do that is harmful. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: GUEST,michaelr Date: 10 Jan 14 - 09:26 PM Agreed, Janie, that's something that most of us are guilty of to some degree. I try to reduce my footprint, my use of resources and services. The advantage we have is being aware of the problem(s), so it's on our minds at least part of the time. Anyone who pays taxes to a government supports in a way actions and policies that are abhorrent to many of us. It sickened me to know that my taxes were used by W to bomb innocent people in the Middle East. There are many more examples. Like the man said, "Waddayagonnado?" The golden rule still applies... |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: GUEST Date: 10 Jan 14 - 09:35 PM Until such time as corporate boards receive the same end as those they destroy in their quest for money, nowt will change. Just Blather, That's All. With apologies to Hernando Téllez. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: Janie Date: 10 Jan 14 - 10:08 PM Corporate boards respond (or perhaps react is more accurate) in the present day world to what profits and to what doesn't profit. Pendulums swing. Currently the corporate pendulum lists toward extreme models of Capitalism that do not take into account the long term capital benefits of some measure of societal responsibility. As a consumer of goods and services, I have choices. My choices matter, whether I see that or not. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: michaelr Date: 10 Jan 14 - 10:38 PM Janie, I'm curious: What was going to be the complete thread title? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: gnu Date: 10 Jan 14 - 10:58 PM From the other thread.... FUCK THE GAWDAMNED COAL INDUSTRY INDUSTRY AND FUCK ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT FOR WAY TOO LONG |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 10 Jan 14 - 10:59 PM I was wondering the same thing. I didn't make sense of all of it, and the context. GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: Bill D Date: 10 Jan 14 - 11:09 PM W. Virginia has had WAY too many 'incidents' in the last few years. When the $$$$ to be made are way more than the fines, there is little deterrence. This one ought to bring some serious reaction... besides capitals in Mudcat thread. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: Gurney Date: 10 Jan 14 - 11:20 PM On recycling: The thing about modern tech that taps my tank is that it isn't worth repairing. My last cell-phone broke the spring that makes it a 'flip,' and at two years old the speaker was already failing. so, all it needed was a spring and a speaker, and the repair quote was three times the price of a repacement phone! OK, so I sold it on TradeMe and told the truth, so someone wanted it, and someone recycled some of it, but I still ended up with another phone, the speaker of which is already not as clear as it was originally. I suppose this is what happens when you are a 'consumer.' |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: MGM·Lion Date: 11 Jan 14 - 01:53 AM MichaelR ~~ Janie was surely copying (& politely editing!) Spaw's "FUCK ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT FOR WAY TOO LONG" in great big huge red letters on the WV Chemical Spill thread. ~M~ Writing from UK. Can't remember how I got into these far-off threads... but sorry to hear of all these probs in WV. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*K ALL OF US FOR RELYING ON THE SHIT F From: GUEST Date: 11 Jan 14 - 02:08 AM 'Corporate boards respond (or perhaps react is more accurate) in the present day world to what profits and to what doesn't profit.' I am aware of that. It changes nowt about what I said. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on the shit f From: catspaw49 Date: 11 Jan 14 - 06:54 AM I was with you Bill in your first two sentences but after that.......sorry. Yeah, it is often about the $$$ but is this the one that will get some action? I doubt it. I had those same thoughts 45 years ago and it seems nothing ever truly gets a serious reaction. If you look back over the "disasters" in WVa, there have been many chances to get the right things done just as there are here. It never happens. I am now reasonably sure nothing will happen in my lifetime. Many times I have not done what all I could and other times I've given it my all but things continue to go just the same way.....towards the money. Now we've added fracking. We all knew way back when it was doable but a lousy method to get energy, but when money talked your water caught fire and your crops and cattle died. Janie makes a great case about what we can do personally and we can also actively write and petition but that will never be enough. But we do what we can and try to appease ourselves. ***sigh*** Sorry. Wish I had something good to say about this.......... Spaw |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on the shit f From: Janie Date: 11 Jan 14 - 11:27 AM MtheGM, that is exactly what I did. Should have thought to remove the caps and appreciate whichever mudelf changed it. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Stilly River Sage Date: 11 Jan 14 - 12:19 PM I tweaked the title so you can get the gist of the message. I had a couple of more characters I could add. This sounds like a horrible thing to live through - how many people won't get the message and will be seriously injured or killed? How long will it take the cleanse the system before people can resume use? This is a more explosive (news/health-wise) version of what I think a lot of people fear who use water wells in gas field fracking areas. SRS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Janie Date: 11 Jan 14 - 01:06 PM I agree Stilly. See the other thread for more news. My purpose in starting this thread was not about the the Chemical spill on the Elk River, but regarding my thoughts on the impact on discussions, here on Mudcat and many, many other places, that go nowhere because they are mostly about finger pointing and an insistence on dichotomous debate, which I rarely think is useful. I'm a better listener than communicator. I think my brain and thought processes are perhaps a bit different and I often realize too late that people don't automatically understand where I am coming from. For the most part, neither others nor I have the patience to wade through to clarity - and it has little entertainment value. Probably should not have started this thread. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: kendall Date: 11 Jan 14 - 07:36 PM The golden rule has been slightly modified. It now says: Those who have the gold make the rules. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Bobert Date: 11 Jan 14 - 08:25 PM I rarely post here anymore because of what Janie said in her 1:06 post... Just gets tiresome and the same people act out the same way... Really not much "discussion" at all... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: GUEST,ollaimh Date: 11 Jan 14 - 10:51 PM American voters care more about stopping gay marriage or free choice in reproduction or "free enterprize" to do anything, and they are paying the price. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: GUEST Date: 12 Jan 14 - 09:51 AM Great post Janie. You've given me a lot to think about this morning. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: maeve Date: 12 Jan 14 - 10:36 AM Janie- "thinking about all the finger-pointing that goes on in the world. Wonder how the world might change if all of us, me included, focused less on what others do that is harmful, and more on what we as individuals do that is harmful. " Yes. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Big Al Whittle Date: 03 Feb 14 - 01:50 PM well its all very interesting, but I disagree. its all a bit Thomas Aquinas - we're all up to the oxters in sin. and its our fault everythings shitty. The greater powers, well they always told us to behave ourselves..... I say to Janie. Indulge your self sweetie. Buy a big cream cake, put your favourite record on and dance around naked with Bobert. You know it makes sense , |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: GUEST,Stim Date: 03 Feb 14 - 02:26 PM It was good that you started the thread, Janie. You brought people's attention to the subject, and that's what a great communicator does. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Jack the Sailor Date: 03 Feb 14 - 03:29 PM Is it OK if I blame Whittle for putting that image in my head? Is it OK for Janie? What about P-Vine? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: gnu Date: 03 Feb 14 - 03:50 PM I blame Big Al for all of it. Everything. Including Prince Harry's Thingywhotsit. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: GUEST,Ed T Date: 03 Feb 14 - 05:04 PM I recall a local fisherman complaining at a meeting about a plannec oil development project off the coast where he fished. A person stood up and asked him what type of vehicle he drove to the meeting and how energy efficientvit was . It turned out he drove his $50 k truck that consumed under 10 miles per gallon. The guy said " it's interesting that you say you care about your environment but your behavious indicates you don't give a damn about the enviroment of thevfolksv who live nearvthesource of the oil that fuels your gas guzzler that you likely don't have a need for" |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Richard Bridge Date: 03 Feb 14 - 06:53 PM Shit? Ain't smoked any since 1973. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Janie Date: 04 Feb 14 - 02:33 AM There is a difference between blame and responsibility. Blame tends to be either/or - yes/but and to be purely about power and deflection. Responsibility tends to be about yes/and and has greater potential, individually and collectively to be about garnering power for positive change rather than about simply becoming powerful or trying to feel powerful. Holding oneself responsible in no way implies holding others less responsible, regardless of the degree to which one fulfills one's own responsibility. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Janie Date: 04 Feb 14 - 02:49 AM And guilt has a function. I suppose blame does also. In acknowledging the choices I make that cause harm, and even blaming myself when I realize there are other choices I could make that wouldn't harm me but would be quite inconvenient, I do not let others, particularly larger and more powerful entities off the hook. I do think it useful to recognize that when I am inclined to "rage against the machine" that I am also part of the machine. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: Big Al Whittle Date: 04 Feb 14 - 04:19 AM Personally Janie, I'd say ...go for the cream cake and the dansette every time. Yes we could have thrown ourselves in front of the tanks bound for Vietnam and Afghanistan, but we didn't...we are little people. we had families who relied on us. And now we're little old people. Go and get that cream cake and if you hear a knock on the door, it'll be me in my birthday with Glen Miller's greatest hits. Time to forgive.....ourselves. Do not go gentle into that good night...let's party! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: GUEST,mg Date: 04 Feb 14 - 01:22 PM I think what we need to do with our electronics is to send them to people who can reuse them, not strip them etc...Africa is desparate for the old cell phones, wires, plugs, converters etc we have in landfills and basements. One solar charger can keep a woman employed and able to feed her family by charging others' cell phones. Those brilliant boys are having to reinvent electronics from scrapheaps when we could give them the basic components...Africa is full of sunshine. Bangladesh is full of water at least at times. America is full of stuff..clothing, bedding, toys, shoes..with no place to go. Sri Lanka..when I worked in a chemistry department..was considered by chemistry professors to produce the world's best chemists. Afganistan is sitting on mounts of emeralds and precious and semiprecious stones. A country in Africa that starts with M...forget which one..is desperately poor and sits on foundations of marble. The dustiest sandiest countries, such as Jordan, have amazing sand for glass and ceramics. If people have safe passage here and there and if they have clean water and if they do not have overly restrictive laws they will, by themselves, figure out by camel caravan and rowboat and oxcart how to get stuff from point A to point B. Safety is paramount...thank a veteran if you have it in you. There are inventions coming out by the thousands every day. Some will give us free electricity, which means free transportation overland at least..There are ships returning to wind and solar power that can get goods from here to there. All is not lost. The Catholic church has had a pope considering birth control and one (murdered) who was all for it..overpopulation is the big problem and it is reversing in most places. Trees will grow back if left alone. Problems can be reversed. There are all sorts of people doing all sorts of things, consuming far fewer resources...one resource that we can spread is hope. Another is information. I see the world as dismal in many respects but I also see how it can be fixed and is being fixed in many places. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: F*k all of us for relying on shit 4 too long From: GUEST Date: 04 Feb 14 - 11:46 PM Go away Al - you are interfering with my struggle to envision being a legend in my own mind *grin*. I'll still pass on the cream cake, but show up with a bottle of a good Spanish Red.... |
