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BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...

Bobert 12 Dec 11 - 09:48 PM
Stilly River Sage 12 Dec 11 - 10:09 PM
Little Hawk 13 Dec 11 - 12:00 AM
Jack the Sailor 13 Dec 11 - 02:02 AM
Little Hawk 13 Dec 11 - 02:58 AM
GUEST,Wesley S 13 Dec 11 - 08:59 AM
SINSULL 13 Dec 11 - 09:14 AM
Jeri 13 Dec 11 - 09:34 AM
Little Hawk 13 Dec 11 - 09:35 AM
Rapparee 13 Dec 11 - 10:13 AM
Richard Bridge 13 Dec 11 - 10:34 AM
Little Hawk 13 Dec 11 - 11:49 AM
akenaton 13 Dec 11 - 01:45 PM
Jack the Sailor 13 Dec 11 - 02:03 PM
Bobert 13 Dec 11 - 02:08 PM
GUEST,Chongo Chimp 13 Dec 11 - 02:09 PM
Amos 13 Dec 11 - 02:34 PM
DougR 13 Dec 11 - 04:27 PM
Bobert 13 Dec 11 - 05:15 PM
GUEST,Chongo Chimp 13 Dec 11 - 06:17 PM
gnu 13 Dec 11 - 06:41 PM
GUEST,999 13 Dec 11 - 07:27 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 14 Dec 11 - 02:03 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 14 Dec 11 - 02:43 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 14 Dec 11 - 02:50 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 14 Dec 11 - 03:15 AM
Richard Bridge 14 Dec 11 - 03:40 AM
Greg F. 14 Dec 11 - 10:22 AM
frogprince 14 Dec 11 - 11:13 AM
Bobert 14 Dec 11 - 12:15 PM
GUEST,Bluesman 14 Dec 11 - 12:47 PM
Little Hawk 14 Dec 11 - 01:03 PM
Bobert 14 Dec 11 - 01:13 PM
Jack the Sailor 14 Dec 11 - 01:17 PM
GUEST,999 14 Dec 11 - 04:32 PM
Bobert 14 Dec 11 - 05:13 PM
akenaton 14 Dec 11 - 05:26 PM
Little Hawk 14 Dec 11 - 06:28 PM
Jack the Sailor 14 Dec 11 - 06:46 PM
GUEST,999 14 Dec 11 - 07:05 PM
Jack the Sailor 14 Dec 11 - 08:33 PM
GUEST,999 14 Dec 11 - 08:43 PM
Bobert 14 Dec 11 - 08:53 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 14 Dec 11 - 09:45 PM
Bobert 14 Dec 11 - 09:47 PM
Jack the Sailor 14 Dec 11 - 09:52 PM
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GUEST,Guest from Sanity 14 Dec 11 - 10:10 PM
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GUEST,Guest from Sanity 14 Dec 11 - 10:13 PM
Don Firth 14 Dec 11 - 10:21 PM
Bobert 14 Dec 11 - 10:21 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 14 Dec 11 - 10:25 PM
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Jack the Sailor 14 Dec 11 - 11:11 PM
Little Hawk 14 Dec 11 - 11:21 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 15 Dec 11 - 12:33 AM
Don Firth 15 Dec 11 - 01:02 AM
Bobert 15 Dec 11 - 07:59 AM
Little Hawk 15 Dec 11 - 12:04 PM
Jack the Sailor 15 Dec 11 - 12:04 PM
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Little Hawk 15 Dec 11 - 12:19 PM
Little Hawk 15 Dec 11 - 12:27 PM
GUEST,999 15 Dec 11 - 02:09 PM
Don Firth 15 Dec 11 - 03:00 PM
Jack the Sailor 15 Dec 11 - 03:01 PM
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Jack the Sailor 15 Dec 11 - 03:11 PM
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GUEST,Guest from Sanity 15 Dec 11 - 04:09 PM
number 6 15 Dec 11 - 04:56 PM
Don Firth 15 Dec 11 - 05:05 PM
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Jack the Sailor 15 Dec 11 - 05:13 PM
Jack the Sailor 15 Dec 11 - 05:26 PM
Jack the Sailor 15 Dec 11 - 05:31 PM
Bobert 15 Dec 11 - 05:41 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 15 Dec 11 - 05:46 PM
number 6 15 Dec 11 - 05:52 PM
Little Hawk 15 Dec 11 - 05:58 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 15 Dec 11 - 06:19 PM
GUEST,999 15 Dec 11 - 06:21 PM
Jack the Sailor 15 Dec 11 - 06:22 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 15 Dec 11 - 06:28 PM
Jack the Sailor 15 Dec 11 - 06:32 PM
Don Firth 15 Dec 11 - 06:48 PM
akenaton 15 Dec 11 - 06:51 PM
Little Hawk 15 Dec 11 - 06:51 PM
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akenaton 15 Dec 11 - 06:57 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 15 Dec 11 - 06:59 PM
Stringsinger 15 Dec 11 - 07:04 PM
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GUEST,TIA 15 Dec 11 - 11:42 PM
Songwronger 15 Dec 11 - 11:54 PM
Little Hawk 16 Dec 11 - 12:01 AM
number 6 16 Dec 11 - 12:03 AM
Jack the Sailor 16 Dec 11 - 12:08 AM
Little Hawk 16 Dec 11 - 12:28 AM
number 6 16 Dec 11 - 12:30 AM
Jack the Sailor 16 Dec 11 - 12:37 AM
number 6 16 Dec 11 - 12:46 AM
GUEST,999 16 Dec 11 - 05:35 AM
akenaton 16 Dec 11 - 05:54 AM
GUEST,999 16 Dec 11 - 06:17 AM
Little Hawk 16 Dec 11 - 11:56 AM
Jack the Sailor 16 Dec 11 - 12:07 PM
GUEST,999 16 Dec 11 - 01:21 PM
Little Hawk 16 Dec 11 - 03:20 PM
Stringsinger 16 Dec 11 - 03:26 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 16 Dec 11 - 04:34 PM
GUEST,999 16 Dec 11 - 04:52 PM
Greg F. 16 Dec 11 - 04:52 PM
Jack the Sailor 16 Dec 11 - 05:19 PM
akenaton 16 Dec 11 - 05:32 PM
Greg F. 16 Dec 11 - 06:15 PM
Jack the Sailor 16 Dec 11 - 06:24 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 16 Dec 11 - 08:02 PM
Bobert 16 Dec 11 - 08:47 PM
Don Firth 16 Dec 11 - 08:51 PM
Janie 16 Dec 11 - 09:49 PM
Bobert 16 Dec 11 - 11:22 PM
Little Hawk 16 Dec 11 - 11:26 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 16 Dec 11 - 11:27 PM
Jack the Sailor 17 Dec 11 - 12:02 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 17 Dec 11 - 12:14 AM
Little Hawk 17 Dec 11 - 01:33 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 17 Dec 11 - 03:53 AM
Bobert 17 Dec 11 - 09:58 AM
Greg F. 17 Dec 11 - 12:18 PM
Jack the Sailor 17 Dec 11 - 12:50 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 17 Dec 11 - 12:52 PM
Don Firth 17 Dec 11 - 03:07 PM
Little Hawk 17 Dec 11 - 05:59 PM
Don Firth 17 Dec 11 - 06:53 PM
Don Firth 17 Dec 11 - 07:41 PM
Don Firth 17 Dec 11 - 07:49 PM
akenaton 17 Dec 11 - 07:57 PM
Don Firth 17 Dec 11 - 08:27 PM
Little Hawk 17 Dec 11 - 09:12 PM
Don Firth 17 Dec 11 - 09:26 PM
Little Hawk 17 Dec 11 - 09:37 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 17 Dec 11 - 10:07 PM
Jack the Sailor 17 Dec 11 - 10:57 PM
Don Firth 17 Dec 11 - 11:05 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 18 Dec 11 - 12:53 AM
Jack the Sailor 18 Dec 11 - 12:55 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 18 Dec 11 - 01:09 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 18 Dec 11 - 01:15 AM
Jack the Sailor 18 Dec 11 - 01:37 AM
akenaton 18 Dec 11 - 06:16 AM
Greg F. 18 Dec 11 - 12:05 PM
Bobert 18 Dec 11 - 12:37 PM
akenaton 18 Dec 11 - 04:41 PM
Don Firth 18 Dec 11 - 05:09 PM
Bobert 18 Dec 11 - 05:27 PM
akenaton 18 Dec 11 - 05:34 PM
Don Firth 18 Dec 11 - 05:47 PM
Don Firth 18 Dec 11 - 05:50 PM
GUEST,999 19 Dec 11 - 09:33 AM
Greg F. 19 Dec 11 - 11:54 AM
Little Hawk 20 Dec 11 - 12:57 AM
Jack the Sailor 20 Dec 11 - 04:07 AM
Bobert 20 Dec 11 - 10:50 AM
Little Hawk 20 Dec 11 - 10:59 AM
Jack the Sailor 20 Dec 11 - 11:16 AM
Little Hawk 20 Dec 11 - 11:20 AM
Bobert 20 Dec 11 - 12:02 PM
Jack the Sailor 20 Dec 11 - 01:10 PM
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akenaton 20 Dec 11 - 02:56 PM
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akenaton 20 Dec 11 - 03:31 PM
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number 6 20 Dec 11 - 04:25 PM
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Subject: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 12 Dec 11 - 09:48 PM

Well, well, well...

Seems that the ObamaHateBrigaders here in the Mudpit just can't find enough places to spew their hate so they are now polluting threads that have nothing to do with politic so I figured they needed their own hate thread...

Hate away... Burn a few crosses... Knock yourselves out... Have at it... Fire away...

Bye...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 12 Dec 11 - 10:09 PM

Ammo to start the ball rolling. Really STUPID people who listen (no doubt) to Faux News. No reading newspapers, no listening to NPR. Pure hatred and Ignorance with a capital I. Is that what this thread is about, Bobert? (I predict it won't last long, but your mileage may vary.)

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 12:00 AM

This isn't fair. There is no Official Chongo Haters Thread. There is also no official Sarah Palin Haters Thread. Why should only Obama get one of his own? Huh? You people prejudiced against apes and hockey moms? Is that it?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 02:02 AM

You know you can start your own?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 02:58 AM

Sure, but I don't have any particular desire to start a thread about hating some specific political figure, so I'm leaving it to others to do so...and suggesting (as a form of satire) that there is an "equal opportunity" principle involved in them doing so.

Now, there have actually been many past threads on this forum which were really very clearly devoted to hating various people in politics, such as:

George Bush! (definitely THE 'hated' leader of them ALL on Mudcat to date)
Sarah Palin (not too far behind "Dubya" in the "hated" ranks)
Dick Cheney
Rush Limbaugh
John McCain
Newt Gingrich
Margaret Thatcher
Ronald Reagan
Tony Blair
and so on, and so on...

But none of them were plainly labelled as the Official (fill in the name) Haters Thread. In all honesty, they probably should have been labelled as such, but they weren't.

But Obama gets an OFFICIAL one, because he's...what? Special?

I'm just suggesting (tongue in cheek, mind you) that all the enthusiastic political haters out there get it off their chests, be honest, and clearly indicate their real intent by titling their "hate" threads the same way as the Obama thread. They should admit that they HATE their political enemies just as much as their political foes on this forum do.

Supporters of Mr Obama think that it's pretty despicable for people to hate him....but they don't find it despicable when they hate their own political enemies, do they? They enjoy it, they think it's fun, they feel justified in their hatred. They are deeply annoyed by people who hate from the opposite point of view, however.

*****

I'd like to add on a serious note that I don't hate Barack Obama. I don't hate George Bush. I don't hate Margaret Thatcher. I don't feel it would do me or anyone else any good if I hated them. But I do deplore some of their political actions and most of the policies enacted by their respective administrations. What I most deplore about Obama's administration is that he almost seems like just the continuation OF George Bush to me...only in Democratic Party garb. He's still fighting foreign wars, and for the same purposes Bush did: oil and empire.

This does not mean I am obliged to hate him. I disagree with most of what he's doing, that's all. I disagreed with Bush at least as much, probably even more.

I wish Obama had turned out to be more like what I hoped he'd be around the time he got elected, but he hasn't. That doesn't make me hate him. It's just disappointing, that's all. I bet the Republicans could disappoint me even MORE if they got the chance.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Wesley S
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 08:59 AM

OK - That does it. I'm starting the OFFICIAL Little Hawk haters thread. And remember it's the OFFICIAL one. It will be moderated so that there's no thread drift. No copycats either please!

Getting back to Obama - Are you sure just one thread will be enough Bobert?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: SINSULL
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 09:14 AM

Do you hate him enough to vote for ole Newt?????


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jeri
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 09:34 AM

Bobert, what a wonderful thing to do. There isn't enough hate, anger, and just plain contention here at Mudcat these days.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 09:35 AM

One thread will DEFINITELY not be enough, Wesley! Remember, Obama is a presently serving president of the USA, and there's almost an unlimited hatred for such people at any given time.

It works that way with Canadian prime ministers too, although at a somewhat more muted level, I think. ;-D You'd be surprised how many people hate the one we have now (Stephen Harper). Or maybe you wouldn't.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 10:13 AM

I don't know any of these people well enough to hate them. If I did I'd just drop a brick on their head(s) and be done with it. In fact, I can't say I know anybody well enough to hate them, although I might hate what they do.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 10:34 AM

If it gets all of the usual suspects in the same place - well I can think of a consequence.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 11:49 AM

Same here, Rap.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 01:45 PM

The guy is just not up to the job, very few in politics today are!

That does not mean that he is "hated"
The word is overused on Mudcat....anyone expressing an opinon contrary to the norm here is described as a "hater" of one sort or another.....Its a form of Fascism really, an attempt to bully others into remaining silent.

Sorry Bob, but thats how I see it pal. Tho' you are not anywhere near the worst offender.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 02:03 PM

Bobert

Maybe LH has a point. Should you have called it what it seems to be becoming? The pooh flinging thread?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 02:08 PM

Well, well, well... It's still here???

This thread came as a result of one insensitive person who is filled with hate for Obama using my "Bobert's Stoner Christmas Story" thread as a vehicle to cut & past right winged hate...

BTW, I don't hate this person... I don't hate anyone... I don't even hate Chongz tho he has given me every reason to do so...

I do hate stupid policies that hurt my fellow eathlings... Yes, I do hate them... Just not people... Even the worse of the worst...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Chongo Chimp
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 02:09 PM

KREE-GAH!!!!!!! There are them awful hate words again!

- Chongo


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Amos
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 02:34 PM

Insensitivity, dull-wittedness, fixed-idea-blindness, and general black-bag-over-the-head curmudgeonlyness will always be with us, always thrashing and lashing and desperately searching for targets for their bountiful bitter supply of blame and shame.

The number of distortions, slants, vilificationd du jour, and blind-hearted blathering of which such souls are capable approaches infinity, even as their capability for discrimination and evaluation of actual importances and data analysis approaches zero.

'Twas ever thus.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: DougR
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 04:27 PM

I don't hate Obama. I hope he is not re-elected, but I don't hate him.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 05:15 PM

DOUGIE!!!

I knew this thread would lure you away from the bridge table... Good seein', ahhhhh, hearin' from you, ol' friend...

B;~)


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Chongo Chimp
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 06:17 PM

I am gettin' a little worried here that Obama might edge me out. Is it possible that more people hate him than hate me? If so, what do I do about it? This calls for a stiff shot of whisky...or two...and some burnin' of the midnight oil till I get it all figgered out.

Where did I go wrong? At what point did I slip up?

- Chongo


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: gnu
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 06:41 PM

"You'd be surprised how many people hate the one we have now (Stephen Harper)."

What's not to hate?

Oh, I see China is now buying up our potash mines... as well as the oil sands.

Stock market... depression... what comes next? Any guesses?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 13 Dec 11 - 07:27 PM

Stephen Harper cares more about his hair than he does about this country.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 02:03 AM

Hate who??..Just because he's been a shitty president?.....talkin' 'bout George W.......you thought I was talkin' 'bout 'Ba-Wacko'??

What I find absolutely COMICAL, is that his devotees get more upset than the Catholics were at Sinnead O'Connor for baggin' on the Pope!!..or Muslims for baggin' on their flavor of the cleric D'jour!....and what adds insult to injury.....IS THEY THINK THEY ARE NORMAL!!!!...and should be taken seriously!!!!
LMAO.....ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!...
....
.........and can't understand why NOBODY IS!!!!....AH-HA-HA.....get the floor ready..I'm a-comin'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

klgbaigu


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 02:43 AM

These are ACTUAL recordings of speeches.....just the setting is changed!

Part One

Part Two..This one is perfect!

Can you spot devotees???...just like.....(naw, I won't say it).

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 02:50 AM

Part Three

Part Four.....and you think I'm a hater???...probably to the next link..and her ILK!!!
Stay tuned!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 03:15 AM

..I changed my mind....

...and one more........

Not quite 'hate'...but beauty,...... as well as ugly, is in the eye of the beholder!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 03:40 AM

Early for the first cuckoo.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 10:22 AM

Stephen Harper cares more about his hair than he does about this country.

Are he and Rick Perry related, do you think, Bruce?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: frogprince
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 11:13 AM

One line from the political discussion in Tim Hortons this morning:
"If Obama is reelected, we won't be sitting here having discussions like this; it won't be allowed".
Where would anyone even start to respond to a line like that, and is there any point in trying?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 12:15 PM

Can't argue with crazy people, f-prince...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Bluesman
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 12:47 PM

Breaking news. "President Obama signals end of US war in Iraq by claiming it as 'an extraordinary chapter in history'."

Roughly translates to an admission that just like Vietnam, this war was also lost.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 01:03 PM

It was an extraordinarily stupid chapter in history, a clear case of unilateral aggression in a war of choice by a great power against a small power, justified by outright lies regarding supposed "weapons of mass destruction". (Bush accomplished that. Obama inherited it.)

I think that a similar war is being planned against Iran, and for one simple reason: they have not yet surrendered their sovereignty or their oil to foreign control (by the USA/UK/Israeli Axis).


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 01:13 PM

Bingo, LH...

The weird part about this is that the oil consuming super powers have telegraphed their intentions and then we wonder why Iran is trying to get a nuke??? If I were them I'd be looking for a big stick, too...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 01:17 PM

G W Bush, designed Iran's nuclear strategy. He set up the Axis of Evil, Invaded the one other one with no nukes and sent aid to the one with nukes. Iran looked at the other two and said, which would we rather be?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 04:32 PM

"The weird part about this is that the oil consuming super powers have telegraphed their intentions and then we wonder why Iran is trying to get a nuke???"

Well, y'all are gonna have to make up yer minds. Up until now the word apound here is that Iran wants atomic material to make electricity. Now Iran wants a nuclear weapon.

Which is it?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 05:13 PM

Well, Brucie... I think Iran would be nuts to not want a nuke... I mean, some folks say that Iran wants a nuke to nuke Israel??? There is no logic whats so ever in that argument... Israel would and could destroy every Iranian in a matter of hours if it wanted to... Iran ain't that stupid...

No, Iran just doesn't want to get nuked and the best way to prevent that from happening is to have something to throw back...

Basic survival logic...

Other than that Iran is a very messed up country in terms of leadership... Very messed up...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 05:26 PM

" American combat troops in Iraq may be heading to the exits -- or not -- but the U.S. government's enormously expensive intervention there is hardly coming to an end.

In a telling sign of how dangerous and chaotic Iraq remains more than eight years after President George W. Bush launched the war against Saddam Hussein, U.S. diplomats, military advisers and other officials are planning to fall back to the gargantuan embassy in Baghdad -- a heavily fortified, self-contained compound the size of Vatican City.

The embassy compound is by far the largest the world has ever seen, at one and a half square miles, big enough for 94 football fields. It cost three quarters of a billion dollars to build (coming in about $150 million over budget). Inside its high walls, guard towers and machine-gun emplacements lie not just the embassy itself, but more than 20 other buildings, including residential quarters, a gym and swimming pool, commercial facilities, a power station and a water-treatment plant.

Yet the embassy is turning out to be too small for the swelling retinue of gunmen, gardeners and other workers the State Department considers necessary to provide security and "life support" for the sizable group of diplomats, military advisers and other executive branch officials who will be taking shelter there once the troops withdraw from the country.

The number of personnel under the authority of the U.S. ambassador to Iraq will swell from 8,000 to about 16,000 as the troop presence is drawn down, a State Department official told The Huffington Post. "About 10 percent would be core programmatic staff, 10 percent management and aviation, 30 percent life support contractors -- and 50 percent security," he said."

So much for the US"getting out of Iraq".....Mr Obama, who opposed the war in opposition, today called American involvement "a victory".
Dont it jest make ya sick good ole boys?
How can you support this man?....because everyone else is even worse?
If so, you get the government and president that you richly deserve.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 06:28 PM

I don't know which of the two it is, 999. I have no idea. What I mean is, it's totally obvious that Iran wants nuclear power for generating electricity...that goes without saying...but I don't know if they also want it to build nuclear bombs. I have no way of knowing about that one way or another.

But I do agree with Bobert that the Iranians would have to be crazy NOT to want a few nukes. It is literally the only possible way they can protect themselves from another "pre-emptive" attack by the USA, Israel...or by both of them together. Such an attack will not be launched if the Iranians are known to have nuclear weapons and effective delivery systems for those weapons.

The basic rule of survival for smaller powers now, if they are imperilled by longterm conflict with greater powers (such as Pakistan vis-a-vis India)(or North Korea vis-a-vis the USA and its allies) is: Get yourself some nuclear weapons ASAP and let everyone know you have them...and will use them if attacked.

That is the only way to prevent the greater power from using its conventional weapons to bomb you, invade you, and conquer you...as Saddam Hussein and the Afghans have found out in recent times.

Nothing else will save you from the inevitable once you have been targeted. You have basically 2 choices.

1. Surrender and simply let the USA in to do whatever it wants and let the USA replace your own government with its client (puppet) government.

or....

2. Get some nukes.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 06:46 PM

Bobert is right. They don't want the bomb for offense.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 07:05 PM

"Bobert is right. They don't want the bomb for offense."

It's nice to have your assurance on that. However, have you looked at Iran's leadership? Those fookers are crazier than the Americans, although the US will eventually catch up to them in human rights abuses, imo.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 08:33 PM

And yet Bebe makes them all look like Sunday School teachers.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 08:43 PM

Bebe ??


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 08:53 PM

Yeah, Iran's leaders are a bunch of fruitcakes but they aren't stupid fruitcakes... Just fruitcakes...

I think the best thing that Israel could do is just give the fruitcakes a couple of nukes so the fruitcakes would get twisted in knots thinking, "What the hell was that about?"... That will keep them busy for years...

LOL...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 09:45 PM

Well, if that ain't double sided hypocrisy!!!
I guess it's one thing to HATE Bush, or Iran...and that's OK with you...but call Obama a shitty President, and suddenly 'Hatred' is the accusation that becomes a dirty word!!
Hatred is Hatred...and not really an integral, component of good music!
You guys are a fucking riot!

Like I said before...'We don't have a POLITICAL problem..we have a MORAL problem'......

..and politics, by its nature, is full of shit!

.....it's just what LIE appeals to your 'better interests(?)'

Snakes!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 09:47 PM

I love it!!!

More GfinS posts to ignore!!!

Just post some good music 'cause no one reads your **** anymore... Sorry...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 09:52 PM

I think that in THIS thread EVERYONE should use RANDOM capitalized words.

AND way to much PUNCTUATION!!!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 09:58 PM

Yup, lots of SCREAMING and punctuation???!!!***''''...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 10:10 PM

Yeah, but your hatred of everything not Democratic Party is fucking you up!...and making you a hypocrite!!!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 10:11 PM

Gotta LOVE those PROGRESSIVES!!!!*****!!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 10:13 PM

Amos is progressive....and we've been around and around on Obama...even back in the primaries.

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 10:21 PM

Its hemorroids are acting up again. . . .

Correction.

The hemorroid is back!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 10:21 PM

LOL...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 10:25 PM

Hemorrhoids, like the truth can be a pain in the ass!..

Depending on where you think!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 10:49 PM

My across-the-street neighbor's yappie little Yorkshire terrier uses a lot of capitals and can't punctuate worth a damn either. As a result, I'm kinda familiar with entities with that level of intelligence.

Whenever it gets too annoying, you just scoop it up and throw it back over the hedge.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 11:11 PM

We are in the yorkie's yard now!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 11:21 PM

I don't hate Bush and I don't hate Iran. I have had moments when I felt like I hated this person or that country or whatever...but I do my best to let go of such a negative feeling as soon as I can, because it's not healthy. Hatred, in any case, is driven by fear. The Democrats and the Republicans are constantly living in fear that the other party will win the next election. That makes them hate each other. As long as they fear each other, they will inevitably hate each other, and that doesn't make for a healthy nation.

And that's one of the reasons I would prefer that ALL political parties ceased to exist from this day forward. It's not just a problem in the USA, it's a problem in every partisan system across the world...whether it be multi-party or (in a few cases) just one party. Political parties are organized gangs that seek to dominate turf and to receive the material rewards they can get through that domination. Gangs are not public benefactors. They're in it for themselves.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 12:33 AM

I almost agree wholeheartedly. The problem is, both parties are so corrupt, that subscribing to their 'talking points of view' damages your perception of reality...which, of course, interferes with the best you can do musically....which, of course, is a unifier, if you can touch the heart and souls of mankind. Politics only capitalizes on the fears...and they are mostly built on lies, deception and fraud.
Do you really want that in your music??? Aren't we TIRED of music that misses the mark?...and says nothing, to nurture the hearts and souls??

But this is America...you can be as plastic, shallow, and tasteless as you want..and get away with it....for a while!

Personally, hypocrisy bores me!...and is of NO substance!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 01:02 AM

(Gad! Now it's trying to hump my leg!!)


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 07:59 AM

Reminds me of the guy in the band who won't tune and when asked to tune SCREAMS at the rest of the band that it is they who are out of tune...

Now back to some of that down-home, sticky-bud, 100% USDA Choice Obama hatred...

B;~)


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 12:04 PM

What a grand sense of entitlement the little clique that has formed here has... ;-)

Without the despised "outsider" to make jokes about, though, they'd lose their sense of cohesion. Thus, the outsider serves as a kind of unifying purpose for them, rather the way Sarah Palin would. Or Rush Limbaugh.

They should be grateful! ;-) He has brought them an illusory sense of both unity and superiority. As long as that illusion persists, the joke parade will roll on and on, like Marie Antoinette making witty little remarks to her distinguished dinner guests about the unwashed mob demonstrating in the streets.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 12:04 PM

http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/wed-december-14-2011-melody-barnes?xrs=share_copy

Balls of the week


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 12:10 PM

I haven't the faintest idea where it came from, but I just had an idea for a Disney animated movie.

The Yapping Yorkie and the Dissing Dachshund.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 12:19 PM

Here's a delightful little Dachshund video for everyone's enjoyment:


Dachshund at play


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 12:27 PM

And heres......

A Corgi!


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 02:09 PM

Hate to say this, but some of you are looking like bullies putting down a loud-mouthed git. I skip his posts when they look like rants because I have no pockets to put them in. I fail to see why the rest of you won't/can't do the same.

The rants aren't worth reading, generally, so why read them? And then why exacerbate it all by adding snide remarks that make YOU look like dolts, too?

I don't get it.

We are for the most part aware that Obama inherited a crap economy from George. People who can't accept that are not worth your time. So why waste time on them?

It's fair to question some of Obama's decisions just as it's fair to question ANY politician's decisions. Those people work for you. Start acting like employers, not serfs. And while yer all at it, start looking for good people to vote for in the coming election.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 03:00 PM

Going back to the original post, this thread is intended to provide a place for Obama-haters to spew their venom where they are not cluttering up threads on which people are attempting to have a serious discussion of the issues. Judging from the thread title, I don't believe this thread is intended for serious discussion. Those threads are elsewhere.

The real bullies here are the "loud-mouthed gits" whose whole purpose in posting on this forum is to derail any attempt at serious discussion of the real issues. Keeping the "loud-mouthed gits" busy on this thread may give intelligent and informed folks at least a slim chance of exchanging ideas and viewpoints on other threads without the constant interruptions of the yapping dogs whose whole purpose is to disrupt the discussion, vent their spleens, and attempt to prop up their pitiful egos.

In short, the point of this thread is Feed the Troll. Keep it busy here so that the adults can get on with adult business.

Words to live by:   If you can't stand the heat, don't sit on the barbecue.

Don Firth

P. S. (Damn! I think I just gave the game away!)


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 03:01 PM

Thank you Bobert for starting this thread. It gives us a chance to clear without dragging people who don't want to be into the fray!

Apparently 999 want to be in the fray. So this makes him fair game.

999

If you hated to say it you wouldn't. I don't at all hate to say that I really really do not give a yorkie's fart what I am doing looks like to you. But I will say this. If the person who is too rude even to specify a gender didn't want to be treated as that person is treated. She wouldn't constantly be picking fights. So I fail to see, if you are as above the fray as you seem to think you are why you don't bugger off and mind your own business.

You think I look like a dolt. The points you are making make you look like a condescending Arse hole. Are your uninformed lectures (you said you don't read the rants right?) any better than snide remarks?

I don't get it. I don't care that you don't get it. You don't have to read this thread any more than you have to read the rants.

"We are for the most part aware that Obama inherited a crap economy from George. People who can't accept that are not worth your time. So why waste time on them?" Don't tell me how to spend my time. If you do not like this thread. find something else to do.


"It's fair to question some of Obama's decisions just as it's fair to question ANY politician's decisions."

What in the HELL does fair questioning have to do with this thread or the people it was started for?

"Those people work for you. Start acting like employers, not serfs. And while yer all at it, start looking for good people to vote for in the coming election. "

Tell you what buddy. F off and do that yourself and save your advice for people who need it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 03:03 PM

"not cluttering up threads on which people are attempting to have a serious discussion of the issues."

Or threads where people want to talk about, for example, 40 year old Christmas memories.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 03:11 PM

They just want attention and distraction. I see no harm in those who have the time and inclination giving it here. If only the mean spirited lecturers would either play along or go away.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 03:19 PM

9 (if I may be so bold as to address you by your first name), I generally agree with your posts. But this time, I think you misinterpreted what this thread is all about.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 03:20 PM

AND what the gits are all about.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 03:27 PM

Health Reform helping young adults!


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 04:09 PM

As I sai8d before, some of you are full blown hypocrites!..That's what politics will to to you!....You say you're NOT reading the posts...but keep commenting on them!!! LOL!!

So much disconnect, so little time!
So now, the little band of the 'Professor Posse' is spouting their HATRED for anyone who criticizes a crappy president...but it is OK when they do it to the 'other' party!..What a bunch of blatantly ignorant crackpots!

..and all that, I haven't even criticized the President on this thread..but rather the nutcase devotees!...and the still don't get it!

Oh well, gotta' get back downstairs to the studio.
If I keep reading some of these posts, from the mental midgets, it might interfere with some serious practice!

BTW, Little Hawk has it 'correcto mundo'!.....but then nobody has accused him of being as stupid as...umm..never mind, I won't name them..they/we all know who they are!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: number 6
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 04:56 PM

Rachel Maddow Criticizes Obama on Prolonged Detention

biLL


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:05 PM

Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! (Belch!) Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! (Cough!) Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! Yap! (Wheeze!) Yap! Yap! (Cough! Cough! Cough!).......

"Aw, to hell with it! I'll go down to my studio and play with myself.....!"


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:07 PM

Oh oh, Number6, you mean Rachel Maddow is an Obama hater, too???...just because she criticized the Grand Poo-bah Messiah????

Watch out!..The three professors are going to label you, like they do me...instead of taking a harder look at their 'Divine Master'!!!...and their own biased bullshit!

Great video, 6!!!!
Let's hear the spin on this one!!!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:13 PM

http://sites.google.com/site/barackobamajokes/


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:26 PM

"Today marks 100 days of President Obama being in office, which is a big deal because 100 days is when his warranty runs out. We couldn't return him now even if we wanted to." --Jimmy Kimmel

"President Barack Obama told his Cabinet yesterday to insure that every taxpayer dollar is spent wisely. But there was one embarrassing moment when he had to explain to the Cabinet what a taxpayer was." --Jay Leno

"President Obama should get a big refund this year because he has a lot of dependents. AIG, Citibank, Morgan Stanley -- all dependents." --Jay Leno

"Barack Obama's daughters are very smart. They told him they will take the same responsibility for the dog that he is taking for the economy. That way, if the dog leaves a mess in the White House, it'll be cleaned up by future generations." --Jay Leno

"Well, the wait is over. The Obamas have chosen a new White House dog. It is a Portuguese water dog named Bo. Very cute dog. Their first choice was a wheaten terrier, but it was arrested for tax evasion." --Jimmy Fallon

"President Obama made a surprise visit to Iraq this week where he declared it is time for Iraqis to take responsibility for their country. Said Iraqis, 'You guys first.'" --Seth Meyers

"So they gave the Queen an iPod. I remember when British Prime Minister Gordon Brown was here, the Obamas gave him a DVD box set. So, it looks like they're saving the big gift, the Nintendo, for the Pope." --Jay Leno

"As you know by now, the government is now taking an active role in the auto business. President Obama offering hope, change, and 0 percent financing." --Jay Leno

"It's a great day for our president, Barack Obama, who got to meet the Queen of England today. She very regally gave him a photograph of her, and he gave her an iPod! That's quite an unusual gift from the President. Usually he gives out about $150 million." --Craig Ferguson

"President Obama, by the way, is, I think, making his first presidential European trip. And while he's there in Europe, he plans to fire the CEO's of BMW and Volkswagen." --David Letterman


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:31 PM

GOP agenda


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:41 PM

And the beat goes on....

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:46 PM

Care to comment on 'number 6's' video, ol' chaps???
Go ahead...give 'er a spin!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: number 6
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:52 PM

The U.S.A. is being launched into a precarious Orwellian world of fear and paranoia and yes spin under the Obama administration .... Hey kids, this isn't Bush's watch anymore.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:58 PM

Very interesting video indeed. The screws keep turning tighter in the UK and the USA...no matter who gets elected. That's not a coincidence, it's an observable trend with a conscious purpose on the part of the forces who are behind it, and those forces are way bigger than a single man such as Barack Obama.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:19 PM

DEAD ON, Little Hawk, and Number 6!!!
The 'Professors' must be having a 'conference' how to either ignore the issue, or come up with different accusations ...but to NO avail...they are caught with their pants down...and standing on EACH OTHERS dicks.
(I was going to say, 'Their dicks', but I wouldn't want to flatter them!)

The 'President' is nothing more than the bankster's public relations, front man...and that goes for BOTH fucking parties!..Jeez, how much evidence to you need?????

(this should be interesting!)

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:21 PM

So, once again I ask: Who is there to vote for in the next election?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:22 PM

No No No

Its Yap yap YAP Yap Yap!!!?? Yap yap YAP Yap Yap!!!?? Yap yap YAP Yap Yap!!!?? Yap yap YAP Yap Yap!!!?? Yap yap YAP Yap Yap!!!?? Yap yap YAP Yap Yap!!!??


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:28 PM

I WAS going to ask if Jack could do better than that.....but come to think of it......he CAN'T!!

...(then again, you might stop yapping if you told the other idiots to get off your dick!)

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:32 PM

Good question 999.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:48 PM

Good one, Jack!

Therein lies the problem!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:51 PM

Maybe there is a god?
Certainly hope so for your sake Jack.....how can you be content with the "least worst?"


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:51 PM

A choice between 2 different sets of figureheads placed in front of a single ruling military-financial Oligarchy is, in fact, no real choice at all. And that's the way it was planned, folks. The 2 sets of figureheads are the way the Oligarchy keeps you distracted by endlessly fighting with each other, and your traditional partisan loyalties, loves, and hatreds will only serve to maintain the dominance of the single system that already has you down. That's a far more clever form of dictatorship than Orwell envisioned. It's better camouflaged. Yes, it's quite clever, and it's just as dangerous in the long run as the one Orwell had in mind. Is it intent on conquering the entire world? You betcha.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:55 PM

Okay, Ake, Little Hawk, from your great stores of wisedom, let's hear your solution.

Practical and specific, please.

Okay. We're waiting. . . .

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:57 PM

I think that this IS what Orwell envisaged Hawk!

This is what I have been on about for years on this forum, what is behind my views on social and political issues.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:59 PM

Don's post, replying to Jack's post is clear that he is suicidal, and proud of it!

Look at all the blathering going on, by those who can't justify Number 6's link!!.....This is bordering on the absolute absurd!

You'd think that they could at least CONSIDER that they may have been REAL fucking WRONG!.................(but then 'Considering' requires thinking......not real adaptable by hung over, star-struck parrots!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Stringsinger
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 07:04 PM

Hatred is a strong word that entails an attitude which is not useful.
Don't waste your time with it.

Obama is a disappointment to be criticized, ineffectual but not someone to be hated. He is at the mercy of Wall Street supporters, a black man who could be assaulted at any time by those who hate him. Strike hate from your vocabulary.

This is a sad day for our country and for the Presidency.

"Occupy" is showing us that we can't depend on leadership in Washington, we have to be the leaders and the followers.

Corporate Oligarchic ownership of the government is our utmost problem creating wars, exploitation, poverty, ignorance, and police brutality.

The GOP offers nothing that will solve these problems, posturing old white men without conscience, all morally impaired to the point of impotence.

We are living at a time of historic upheaval, new beginnings and the dissolution of the old government and a model for a new one. If you want to see true democracy, attend an Occupy General Assembly.

2011 will be remembered as a historic time where oppressed people will rise up and remake countries that will aid them in their needs.

I am hopeful.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 08:57 PM

The Rachel Maddow commentary that 6 linked to comes from May, 2009. A lot has happened in the intervening TWO AND A HALF YEARS.

Bad idea. Obama was wrestling with the Guantanamo detainee problem:

Many of the detainees were captured undergoing terrorism training in al Qaeda camps, but hadn't actually had a chance to do anything yet. Before you go off half-cocked at Obama, let's hear what YOU would do with them?

The matter of preventive detention is very much up in the air. It ran into a Constitutional brick wall. The Bill of Rights, Sixth Amendment:
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.
So—perspireth not. Obama couldn't push this through without violating both the Constitution and his Oath of Office.

Obama is not ideal. I, and the other "loony liberals" here, never said he was, contrary to what our resident Yorkshire terrier keeps yapping. But at this point, the cartoon that Jack linked to is very much to the point. Obama is much the best of a pretty sorry collection of candidates.

Here's a thought:   the Democratic Party still has to hold a convention before the next election. Obama (or any incumbant President) is usually assumed to be the candidate, but that's not guaranteed. And among those Democratic Party members who are somewhat disappointed with what Obama has accomplished (been allowed by and obstructionist Congress), there are some mutterings about—

Hillary Clinton.

(And if you don't think that lady has balls, you haven't been paying attention!)

Now, THAT could get interesting. . . .

Oh, Jeez!! I'm sorry. I went and wrote up a serious post. This should definitely be moved somewhere more appropriate!

Professor Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 11:42 PM

I am going to make a LENGTHY post, with lot's of capitals and, random punctuation BECAUSE you are hypcrites who.....just don't get it...!!!! (winking) because you ARE, blinded by the Oblabbo MESSIAH, who, can ONLY read, off, of a teleprompter, but I know WAY better than all of YOU libruls, and now I will POST a link to a YOUTUBE video to make it look like I HAVE, any interest in, music instead of just a DESPERATE need to be, the, center, of , attention. OOOPS did I say THAT, out loud.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Songwronger
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 11:54 PM

Here's a nice bit of Obama hate:

I recently was able to have an in-depth conversation with three educated young black people. I began by talking about how the banks were stealing our money by the tens of trillions of dollars. From there I moved on to talk about Obama. I concluded by demonstrating that Obama was a race traitor.

He has troops in 12 nations plus proxies in Iran and Syria killing people. He has allowed Al Qaeda to take over Libya and kill thousands of Africans. Africans have been beheaded. Thousands of unarmed Africans have been shot and buried in mass graves. Obama has done more harm to Africans than any other President. Obama is friends with Ugandan President Museveni who along with his neighbors in Burundi had sent troops to kill Somalians for America. Museveni rented out his soldiers to a British firm so they could claim carbon tax credits against their taxes back in England. The soldiers evicted 20,000 Ugandan farmers and had to kill lots of people to take their farms which now belong to white men with money. Obama is killing Africans in six nations. Obama has sent troops overtly into South Sudan, Uganda, the Central African Republic and the Democratic Republic of the Congo to kill Africans. Dr Steve Pieczenik who was Assistant Secretary of State for 3 Presidents said Obama has covertly sent troops into Chad and Niger to kill Africans guilty of resisting the NATO take over of Africa.

Goes on and on.

http://vidrebel.wordpress.com/2011/12/15/is-obama-a-traitor-to-the-human-race/


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 12:01 AM

In answer to your question, Don...a question I have answered before, by the way....I would echo everything that Stringsinger said in his last post.

Political parties are not the way out of this crisis of bad government and corrupt financial games, because they've been bought out by the people who are in charge of those financial games.

Individual people in ALL countries across this entire world are going to have to accomplish social change themselves by unified action. Their political parties and governments are not going to do it for them. You cannot expect a gang of crooks to take charge of cleaning up a town they run. They won't. The townspeople have to do it themselves by not cooperating with and endorsing the gang of crooks any longer.

My argument is not with Obama. He's a figurehead, in my opinion...just as Bush was before him. He's a far smarter man than Bush, and he's a brilliant speaker, but he's still just a figurehead.

John F. Kennedy could have consented to be just a figurehead, once in office. He and Bobby decided otherwise, and they both died young.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: number 6
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 12:03 AM

I agree Stringsinger ... Hate is a strong word and should not be taken into context regarding this thread .... it should be retitled.

That video (yes, it was from 9 years ago) I posted not only indicates that the current president speaks with somewhat of a forked tongue but also indicates where the "Indefinite Detention" Bill comes from.The White House said it would not veto the controversial National Defense Authorization Act. That act cannot be blamed on the the GOP or the previous administration.

The president whether Democrat or Republican is a servant to the 'machine' (the Corporate Oligarchi) not the people.

"Occupy" is showing us that we can't depend on leadership in Washington, we have to be the leaders and the followers. Unfortunately I think the machine has pretty well stopped this movement. For now

999 asks "who is there to vote for in the next election" .... my answer is do what 999 usually does in the Canadian elections ....be honest to yourself and cast a spoilt ballot and try to carry on and encourage others to fight the war against the machine.

biLL


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 12:08 AM

TIA All that crap you quoted was spewing from some jerk with a free blogging account.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 12:28 AM

He was the blogger whose proper name should be "Straw Man" (an imaginary figure erected strictly for the purpose of being the supposed enemy you wish you had so that he would fit the definition of "enemy" that you most desire...meaining: very stupid or very bad or even insane).

As such, he serves the same purpose for the blathering crowd here that "liberals" (more straw men) serve for the blathering crowd on Fox TV...a fictional excuse invented to hurl abuse at just to make yourself feel good.

I myself AM "liberal". Extremely so. I am liberal to the point of being downright radical...and that makes it uncomfortable for marshmallow liberals such as Phil Ochs was referring to in that sarcastic old song of his: "Love Me, I'm a Liberal"

Marshmallow liberals will happily support a marshmallow party that betrays them the moment it's elected (meaning the Democrats in the USA or New Labour in the UK or the Liberals in Canada)...because it ISN'T really liberal at all. It's a bribed creature of the Corporate Order, and it will betray genuine liberalism once it's in office. On the other end of the spectrum you've got conservative parties that will do basically the same thing once elected, only they don't even pretend they're not going to! They are bloody well proud of being fascists. The marshmallow liberals serve the fascist cause while congratulating themselves for not being fascist...a clear case of either sheer stupidity and unawareness...or gross hypocrisy.

I won't vote for outright fascists (the political Right).
I won't vote for closet fascists (the political Left).

I will seek other methods of dealing with the situation, and we have seen the beginnings of those other methods in the nonpartisan political protest movements that are emerging around the world, such as the Occupy movement. It's a start. A start is better than nothing at all.

You may be sure that the powers that be will find every way possible of crushing any such movement that seeks genuine change. That means that those in the movement must be very creative and imaginative and innovative and flexible in their tactics, and not provide the powers that be with an easy (static) target. A bunch of tents in a park is a pretty easy static target. All you need to shut it down is a court order, a compliant media, and a bunch of well-armed police.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: number 6
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 12:30 AM

here's a tidbit regarding the NDAA bill about to be made law (for those that might be interested)

NDAA Set To Become Law

And with that ... I'm outta this thread.

biLL


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 12:37 AM

bILL,

this is not a thread for the feint of heart.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: number 6
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 12:46 AM

back ... for a sec

I know Jack ... :)

now .... adios, before I get crushed in some sort of mad onslaught

biLL


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 05:35 AM

Good posts, Bill.

It's difficult not to see Obama's withdrawal of his promise to veto the legislation as the act of a traitor. I don't know that that is the act of a traitor; rather, it may be the last gasp of a man who will not be elected to a second term. When HAS he kept his word.

What is of interest to me is who or what convinced him to change his mind?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 05:54 AM

Perhaps he never intended to keep his word.
Perhaps he understands the political system better than we do.

When Mr Obama was elected, he was seen by almost all of this forum as a means of "change", some here tried to point out that "change" within the present political system is impossible whilst we remain divided by "race", "religion","gender politics",the distribution of "wealth" etc, etc, all the straw men that Little Hawk was talking about.
The faction who masquerade as liberals, yet act like Fascists in defense of their chosen straw men, are the real impediment to "change" in our society.
The whole apparatus requires to be dismantled, but we will never summon up the energy for such a task, while we remain divided by issues which are peripheral to our purpose in the next couple of decades.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 06:17 AM

True enough, Ake. Thing is, we do not have decades.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 11:56 AM

Yeah. Well, given my age, I can reasonably expect to be around for maybe...20 more years? Maybe a bit less? Maybe a bit more? My parents have both passed away in the last few years, and they were, respectively, 20 years and 25 years older than me...so that's why I figure I've probably got about 20 years left.

A lot can happen in those 20 years. What I've seen already happen in the world has not been too good...if it's politics one is talking about or ecology or the financial structure. They all appear to be coming apart at the seams.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 12:07 PM

I supported Obama because he represented a change from GW Bush. In many satisfying ways he has been.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 01:21 PM

Jack, I think most people posting to this thread supported Obama when he ran against the Republicans after the Bush/Cheney regime. I expect his broken promises have changed a few minds. Now he looks little better than his predecessors to many. Sad but true, I think. America's Republic is going down the tubes, its Constitution is becoming a joke because it is losing its power to protect average people from lawlessness--because when the Constitution becomes a hindrance, hell, just change it with an Executive Order. When lawlessness starts at the top, where do people turn?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 03:20 PM

What 999 said.

I was delighted to see Obama elected in 2008, and I was delighted to see the end of the Bush presidency.

I am extremely disappointed with what has happened since. Would it have been any better with McCaine? Nope. It might even have been worse, but we'll never know for sure about that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Stringsinger
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 03:26 PM

Democracy is now in the hands of the Occupy Movement. You can see it at work at the General Assemblies.

Both political parties have made themselves irrelevant to the needs of the people.

Obama is a paper tiger and those in the GOP are corrupt clowns.

Harry Reid voted for the NDAA and Pelosi is defending it.

We are looking at an American Spring.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 04:34 PM

trings: "Democracy is now in the hands of the Occupy Movement. You can see it at work at the General Assemblies."

OH NO!!!

"Both political parties have made themselves irrelevant to the needs of the people."

OH YES!!


"Obama is a paper tiger and those in the GOP are corrupt clowns."

They are interchangable!

"Harry Reid voted for the NDAA and Pelosi is defending it."

"..And Joe Biden wrote the 'Patriot Act...in 1995-96"

"We are looking at an American Spring."

You mean, after the siege of winter??....When the 'opposition resources are depleated?

..Well, at least the blinders are coming off...............FINALLY!!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 04:52 PM

Jesus Christ on a crutch. GfS, could you type a paragraph with that coherency in normal type face and spacing? Good observations which you then throw out the window by taking a swipe at someone else facing the same feelings/thoughts as many of yours. We got a serious fuckin' problem here and back and forth bitchin' ain't gonna solve it. IMO!


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Greg F.
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 04:52 PM

Yet it still remains true, however disappointed folks may be in Prez Obama's performance ( and believe me, I am ) it would have been to several powers of ten WORSE had he not been elected & it had gone to the Republican tea-potty assholes.

And yes, I've been as tired as anyone of "the lesser of two evils" since way before Eugene McCarthy - but there you have it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 05:19 PM

Now he looks little better than his predecessors to many.

That is ridiculous. If he doesn't look better than Bush, in every measure most thinking people care about. It is a matter of perception and propaganda, not fact.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 05:32 PM

The only difference between you and the Tea Party Greg, is your straw man of choice.

Try looking at them as your brothers and sisters....Isn't it just possible that you may be wrong about one tiny thing?

Or would that be losing face?....that's what the parties want you to think.
They call it divide and rule.
In the great scheme of things, your opinion or my opinion, count for exactly zilch, but when we get together we kill the bastards.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Greg F.
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 06:15 PM

The Tea Potty mindless, ignorant-and-proud-of-it, delusional, lets all live in a fact-free, "Christian"[sic}environment assholes may be YOUR "brothers & Sisters", Pharoah, but they sure as shit ain't mine.

You're welcome to 'em. In spades.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 06:24 PM

The thing about the tea party is that they may or may not be intelligent. But any intelligence they may have is completely overcome by their hatred.

The tea partiers I know stood by and cheered at the debt ceiling show down. Which is ironic. Enlightened self interest are the watch words of the Ayn Randians. But that debackle cost the country far more in interest and financial credibility than it could ever hope to save.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 08:02 PM

I think what may have thrown you off was my 'S' on 'Strings' didn't appear on screen. What I did was c/p Stringsinger's post, and threw in a comment after his sentences. Other than that, I don't know what you meant.
Let's try again:

Strings: "Democracy is now in the hands of the Occupy Movement. You can see it at work at the General Assemblies."

OH NO!!!

"Both political parties have made themselves irrelevant to the needs of the people."

OH YES!!


"Obama is a paper tiger and those in the GOP are corrupt clowns."

They are interchangeable!

"Harry Reid voted for the NDAA and Pelosi is defending it."

"..And Joe Biden wrote the 'Patriot Act...in 1995-96"

"We are looking at an American Spring."

You mean, after the siege of winter??....When the 'opposition resources are depleted?

..Well, at least the blinders are coming off...............FINALLY!!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 08:47 PM

Ol' hillbilly lovin' it...

Keep serving up that 100% USDA inspected hate.... Music to my eyes... Keeps it off the other threads...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 08:51 PM

The blinders have never been on, oh Lord of the Ding-a-lings.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Janie
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 09:49 PM

Lovely thread. So original.

Insightful conversation.

People really listening, considering, even allowing the validity of differing points of view.

No one arrogantly asserting they have a corner on the market on "truth."

Many voices with fresh perspectives joining in.

Reminds me of the elegant functionality of the US Congress.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 11:22 PM

My point, Janie...

I started this thread as a joke???

I'm stayin' the heck out...

Have at it, folks.... Eventually the knotheads will have had enough...

B;~)


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 11:26 PM

The title of this thread is an attention-getter that draws contentious posters like flies to shit. If that's what it was intended for, it is succeeding admirably.

It resultes in the kind of discussion in which all the arguers will congratulate themselves on getting their opponents to reveal how utterly foolish they are... ;-D

Thus it satisfies almost everyone's emotional needs. I predict it will go on for a long, long time.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 11:27 PM

Janie: "People really listening, considering, even allowing the validity of differing points of view.
No one arrogantly asserting they have a corner on the market on "truth."
Many voices with fresh perspectives joining in.
Reminds me of the elegant functionality of the US Congress."

Maybe they really DO represent the people!...just kidding!

As far as Bobert is concerned, he still doesn't have much to say about 'Number 6's' link!.....and even still yet, NO ONE on this thread has even said they 'hated' Obama..in fact, quite the contrary...and still, the REAL haters, have been the ones ACCUSING other posters of 'hating, bigotry, prejudice," etc. etc.

Don: "The blinders have never been on, oh Lord of the Ding-a-lings."

Well, I think that blind people didn't need them anyway!...only those who were DECEIVED by blind people!!!!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 12:02 AM

"I'm disillusioned by the people who are disillusioned by Obama, quite honestly, I am.

Democrats eat their own. Democrats find the singular issues and go, "Well, I didn't get everything I wanted."

I'm a firm believer in sticking by and sticking up for the people whom you've elected.

If (Obama) was a Republican running, because Republicans are better at this, they'd be selling him as the guy who stopped 400,000 jobs a month from leaving the country.

They'd be selling him as the guy who saved the auto industry.

If they had the beliefs, they'd be selling him as the guy who got rid of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell," who got Osama bin Laden.

You could be selling this as a very successful three years."

- George Clooney

http://randyreport.blogspot.com/2011/12/george-clooney-on-selling-obama.html


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 12:14 AM

"http://randyreport.blogspot.com/2011/12/....george-clooney-on-selling-obama.html" ????

I always thought he was 'For Sale'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wink!
GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 01:33 AM

George Clooney's views are understandable from his point of view...he obviously still believes in the validity of the USA's 2-party system. I don't. I think that both of those parties have been bought out long ago by the same banking/corporate/military/health insurance Oligarchy.

So do several other posters on this thread.

It isn't disillusionment with solely Mr Obama that I feel, but disillusionment with the entire existing partisan system whose real purpose is to divide and conquer the American public and serve their corporate masters and expand the American military-industrial empire.

They are engaging in classic imperialism.

The only 2 presidential candidates who honestly and directly opposed that policy of imperialism in 2008 were:

1. Dennis Kucinich (D)
2. Ron Paul (R)

Both of them opposed America's imperial wars and made no excuses to justify them.

Those 2 candidates were the only two who stood up and spoke the real truth about American foreign policy, and they were mostly ignored and marginalized by the mainstream media AND by their respective parties. Neither one of them had a chance of being chosen by their party to run for the presidency, precisely because they were honest enough to tell the truth about what's going on, and to stand up for the Constitution.

Kucinich made the other Democratic candidates look so wishy-washy in their feeble approach to questioning America's foreign wars that the media decided to shut him out of the later televised debates on a ridiculous technicality. Obama could not have looked very credible on US war policy had Kucinich been allowed to continue speaking out at the Democratic Party debates.

As for Ron Paul (who has significant Republican support among the rank and file)...all the other Republican candidates were so troubled by his anti-war comments that they would start laughing nervously when he spoke as though he'd said something totally bizarre and ridiculous, when it was THEY who were posturing in a bizarre and ridiculous fashion and beating the drums of war...just like they have continued to do in regards to Iran.

Once it was clear that Kucinich and Ron Paul would be effectively shut out of the electoral process, the only thing I had left to hope for was that Obama might turn out to be a peacemaker, not a warmaker.

Those hopes have been dashed. He's another corporate servant and warmaker...like Bush before him...like McCain, had McCain been elected. And that tells me one simple thing:

Those who reach the Oval Office now are all figureheads. All except for Dennis Kucinich and Ron Paul, and you won't get to see either of them elected president. People who tell the truth and defend the Constitution don't get to be president of the USA in these imperial times. No chance. Their parties won't let them. The corporates won't fund them. The mainstream media won't give them coverage, except to make fun of them now and then. It's a fixed game.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 03:53 AM

Little Hawk,...... I love ya'!

Before I came on, just now, I was in the studio, and was coming to a 'winding down'....figured, ..instead of hittin' the sack..'aw shit, check out Mudcat, first... See if there was any 'thinking progress' going on....(I was warming up for some witty sarcasm, mixed a hint to an insight)....and lo and behold, another REALIST/INDEPENDENT/NON-APOLOGETIC post from Little Hawk!....

...then I wondered..........do you think that the partisan loving freaks NEED a 'party' to 'tell them WHAT to think', and they cling onto that for dear life.....because they fear independent thinking?.....
Ever thought, "Gee, it sorta retards the perception circuits, and it's like trying to go through life with half your discernment tied behind your back.....or trying to flat-pick, without an opposed thumb."

I've even wondered, maybe..maybe, when you ask them to look into a subject/topic...and they refuse to answer..maybe its not really, because they're stupid, and uninformed....maybe its because having to consider and THINK about what is really going on TERRIFIES them...because they're "neat little package of 'reality perception, delivered to your door, from the party" would have to give way, to bigger thought, and with it, FREEDOM of thought....and they are afraid of being lost in the unknown"......

Great post, Little Hawk.......Paul/Kucinich....hmmm....something to think about, huh?

Regards,

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 09:58 AM

Ron Paul is a modern day Lyndon LaRouche...

If it weren't for his stand on war these Paul-heads wouldn't have any use for him... The rest of his ideas are wacko-LaRouche ideas that would destroy this country if put into effect...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Greg F.
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 12:18 PM

George Clooney's views are understandable...

I'd be more interested in Rosemary Clooney's views.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 12:50 PM

George is her nephew.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 12:52 PM

Well, this morning they passed another 1000 page plus bill.....and NOBODY has read it! Now, it's off to Obama to sign. That's REAL representation!...also, they put off the tax break for another two months.....I guess they think that 'uncertainty' is a stimulus for people making business decisions.

Don't you just LOVE what is going on????

Greg F: "I'd be more interested in Rosemary Clooney's views"

Even if she was reminiscing about getting laid to have wonderful children??....with her own husband, nonetheless??

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 03:07 PM

The Republican Congress tied the payroll tax bill to the Keystone XL pipeline, which has garnered a lot of opposition because the pipeline goes passes over the Ogallala aquafer, which runs under eight states, from South Dakota to northern Texas.

If there were to be an oil spill in this area, it would pollute this aquafer--and that could spell the end of agriculture in the United States' farm belt.

This is a sop to the oil companies and has nothing to do with the payroll tax bill. To put the two together as the Republican Congress has done is sheer blackmail, and no matter WHAT Obama does, the Right Wing will take it as an opportunity to shit on him.

If he signs it, he has caved in to Big Oil.

If he vetoes it, he is against the American worker.

Typical. This is the kind of crap Obama has had to put up with since the beginning.

And people like GfS are too blinded by their own hatred of Obama (not to mention their political ignorance) to realize how THEY are being played.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 05:59 PM

GfS does not hate Obama, Don, as has been made abundantly clear in numerous of GfS's posts, but you choose to ignore that, because it doesn't suit your argument.

What GfS hates is the corrupt system of lobbying and bribery that has co-opted Obama's party and the other party (the Republicans). It is that system which YOU are being played by, and you are too blinded by your one-dimensional partisan hatred of ONLY the Republicans and the political Right...which is preventing YOU from waking up to the entire overall situation that has corrupted BOTH parties beyond redemption.

Obama is one of 2 things at this point:

1. A compliant servant of that corrupt system.

or

2. A helpless victim of it.

Either way, it's the imperial system itself that is the problem, not Mr Obama. He's just temporary, same as Bush was.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 06:53 PM

Litttle Hawk, you haven't been paying attention. As an exercise in self-education, go back over some of GfS's posts and read what he says about Obama, and the nasty, snotty things he calls him.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 07:41 PM

Also, Little Hawk, I agree with your second point. Obama's a helpless victim of the system. If you read what I posted about the Keystone pipeline rider, that's the way the Right Wing has been playing it right from the start of Obama's administration. Slap that kind of condition on every bill he tries to get enacted.

Right, the system, the desires of the corporations backed up by the force of the government, is something Mussolini would recognize and approve of. Something has to change, or this country's had the course. Many of the folks in the Occupy movement are aware of this, don't like it one bit, and are determined to do something about it.

Hopeful. We'll have to see how it plays out. But that's why I'm actively involved, not just sitting around bitching about what a failure Barack Obama is. Obama isn't the failure. The system is.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 07:49 PM

And as far my "partisan hatred of the Republicans" is concerned, both you and GfS are bloody wrong about this. I've been politically aware for most of my life, and I could see something like this coming down the pike when Ronald Reagan started systematically dismantling the reforms that FDR instituted in the 1930s.

Both you and GfS have to curb your predilition for making denigrating assumptions about other peoples' prejudices when, in actually, they are speaking from a base of well-grounded knowledge.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 07:57 PM

Exactly what are you doing to change the system Don?
As far as I can see you are in the business of trying to repair the system, not dismantle it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 08:27 PM

Whatever it takes, Ake. I'm partaking in the local (West Coast) Occupy movement's meetings and caucuses, but not so much the on-site demonstrations due to my own physical limitations (wheelchair). Discussing things, particularly, what are the long-term goals?

A number of things are on the table, particularly making sure everyone has a clear idea of how the system is supposed to work. There are a lot of damned smart people involved in this.

This is a work in progress, Ake. So far, storming the Winter Palace is not on the agenda (but it isn't ruled out, either).

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 09:12 PM

We share many common understandings about the political situation, Don. I agree that the Reagan era of deregulation was the real beginning of the present great political/financial mess we find ourselves in.

But I don't think GfS hates Obama on any kind of personal basis. I think GfS hates the present corrupt political order.

Sure, in the heat of the moment GfS has said some snotty things now and then about Obama...just as you or I may have said snotty things now and then about George Bush or Dick Cheney or some other politician. (And GfS has attacked them too.)

GfS has also, however, clearly stated in plain words that he/she does not hate Obama...in posts on this thread. So have other posters who often heavily criticize Obama.

It's disingenous for someone to insist that GfS "hates" Obama when GfS clearly says that that is not the case. What it indicates is simply the desire of the first poster that GfS should hate Obama...since that would render GfS into someone the first poster doesn't have to have any respect for or actually ever listen to seriously.

It's wish fulfillment.

People tend to do that a lot when they continually disagree with another person about politics. They keep downgrading the value and intelligence of the other person in their own mind to the point that the other person becomes a mere stereotype of the beast that lurks in their own anxiety closet.

I don't see that as helping anyone. And I think most of us are guilty of it now and then...when we get carried away with our negative emotional reactions to things other posters say.

It's pretty clear, though, that we are all very troubled by the huge influence of lobbyists and bankers on government. Maybe we should focus on that instead of trying to prove that someone else here "hates" Obama. (or Gays) (or Blacks) Etc...


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 09:26 PM

Little Hawk, pray tell me:

Why do you keep lecturing me when GfS says far worse things about me than I do about him? And if GfS doesn't hate Obama, then why all the hate-filled names and epithets he calls him?

Sorry, but YOUR biases are showing, even through the veil of your attempts at "detachment."

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 09:37 PM

I just said, Don, " I think most of us are guilty of it now and then...when we get carried away with our negative emotional reactions to things other posters say."

"us" is a word that includes me, you, AND GfS.

We all have to watch out and catch ourselves when we're doing it, okay? Or we don't HAVE to....but I think it would be beneficial if we did. ;-)

I basically know GfS better than I know you. I've had telephone conversations with GfS, and I have a very different view of him from the one that bounces around in some people's heads here. That's why you'll often find me defending GfS from what I regard as unrealistic personal attacks.

We're all biased in various ways. Our biases arise out of our past experiences and familiarities. I'm not afraid to admit that I'm biased, but I'm quite willing to take a questioning look at those biases.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 10:07 PM

I don't hate Obama..or homosexuals, or Democrats, Don, bobbert, or anyone else on here..OK??..I hope you can read, because if you insist on putting words in my mouth(or page) I will probably call you a few snotty things..AGAIN, because you have relentlessly misquoted me and painted me as someone I am NOT...but who the Democrats would label, according to their stupid talking points!

OK???????

Now, as far as the Keystone pipeline, if you would have been actually reading my posts, instead of gleaning them for something to bitch about, you might have read SEVERAL times that I told you what the banksters/globalists were about to do, in regards to having us drill oil here, in America...and reneging on Kissinger's rap to the Saudis, in 1979....(Once AGAIN, turning you onto shit BEFORE it actually happens!!)....and unlike a few Bozos on here, and in the 'news' media, I'm not getting my info from a sleigh being pulled by eight flying pigs, and waiting for Elvis to step out, and deliver a message from party headquarters!...(besides, I'm not with the party..I'm with the band, Officer.)

Now, that wasn't TOO snotty was it???....but it DOES have more info, than most the crap-ass accusatory name calling that goes on here, trying to discredit people who DO have their finger on the pulse, trying to turn you onto REALITY!

I'll be happy to fill you in on the pipeline stuff.....AND, it WILL go through....either by a theater production of 'deadlocked politicians' or a sly vote. The Democrats will let it happen...and the Republicans will push it....Oh, and Obama will probably sign it. The 'news' will make it appear as a compromise, in which, the 'apparent opposition' reluctantly gave in, as a 'trade off' for another bit of happy horse-shit, custom made, to make you FEEL good!

Then everybody will squabble about that part of the bullshit!

Jeez! Get a fucking clue!

Nicey nicey, now......,

LH, you got it dialed in!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 10:57 PM

It is clear that GfS ACTS as if hates Obama and Don Firth and Bobert. If it does not want to admit that it is honestly expressing it's feelings, does it make any difference?

Don, Don't take lh to seriously he has a long history of excusing and sucking up to the worst trolls and trouble makers on this forum.

GfS's focus is on pissing people off lh is going to excuse and deny any bad behavior. That is just their natures.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 11:05 PM

Got it, Jack.

At least it keeps them here, with less time for them to clutter up serious discussions by knowledgible people.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 12:53 AM

May I re-iterate??.........You are displaying a perfect example of this!

..and in light of the two previous posts, I guess you are inviting people to 'Let's Be Small!'

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 12:55 AM

That's one link I won't be clicking.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 01:09 AM

..and in YOUR case, it wouldn't matter, anyway.

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 01:15 AM

Jack: "It is clear that GfS ACTS as if hates Obama and Don Firth and Bobert. If it does not want to admit that it is honestly expressing it's feelings, does it make any difference?

Don, Don't take lh to seriously he has a long history of excusing and sucking up to the worst trolls and trouble makers on this forum.

GfS's focus is on pissing people off lh is going to excuse and deny any bad behavior. That is just their natures."


...~HIC~~**

GfS

--[mudelf slaps forehead] It's Saturday night late and a few of you appear to be impaired. Step away from the monitor, turn off the computer. If personal attacks persist, this thread won't. Play nice.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 01:37 AM

This IS the Hater's thread elf. Anyone who would be offended should have better sense than to open it. Not that I am talking about you kind person. An adult presence is always welcome. But I like to think of this thread as a steam vent that keeps the pressure from building up elsewhere.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 06:16 AM

You dont get anything more hateful, than to label another "a non person"


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 12:05 PM

Could have called him a Tea-Potty Republican - MUCH worse.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 12:37 PM

Hate is hate is hate...

I saw it up close in the 60s civil rights movement...

Haters always deny their hate... That is a constant...

Proclamations and testimonials can't change that...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 04:41 PM

The UK papers today, are full of articles on Ron Paul. So far, he seems to have escaped any serious vituperation from the Mudcat "liberals".....Is there a reason for this? He seems to me to be that rarest of creatures, a sincere, honest and thoughtful politician.

A Paul/Palin ticket, if this were possible under the US electoral system, would give you guys one last chance of survival in the real world.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 05:09 PM

A magnificent jest, Ake!!!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 05:27 PM

Paul's domestic agenda would take the US back to the 1890s... This isn't because I hate Ron Paul because I don't... But his ideas are blatantly hateful...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 05:34 PM

Do you think he is a threat bobert....seriously?


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 05:47 PM

Just about everything I've heard from Ron Paul sounds like warmed-over Ayn Rand. And I know one helluva lot about Ayn Rand, because I was a devotee in the late 50s and early 60s. I read everything she wrote, fiction and non-fiction, and took the twenty lecture "Basic Principles of Objectivism" course that Nathaniel Brandon offered on tape—

And then I took a look at the real world and grew up quick!

The Libertarian Party, with which Ron Paul has been associated, was started by a bunch of Ayn Rand's disciples, and Paul is an advocate of the economic principles of Ludwig von Mises—which is what got the U. S. and much of the rest of the world into the mess it's in right now. With Ron Paul, it would be more of the same, and it would most assuredly get much worse.

Sarah Palin does have the advantage of providing comic relief—if there would be anything left for anyone to laugh about.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 05:50 PM

By the way, this is not a matter of "hating" Ron Paul. It's a matter of observation and rational thought.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST,999
Date: 19 Dec 11 - 09:33 AM

Hate? Not me. Basically, I don't like anybody very much.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Greg F.
Date: 19 Dec 11 - 11:54 AM

Paul's domestic agenda would take the US back to the 1890s

Make that 1690's.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 12:57 AM

Okay....I'll bite.

What is his domestic agenda?

I like his foreign policy agenda just fine.

I heard he wanted to abolish the Federal Reserve Bank and the IRS. I'd be in favor of doing both those things.

What else does he want to do?

I think he IS a sincere, honest, and thoughtful politician, as Ake posted...but I happen to disagree with his specific views on socialism (which he seems utterly opposed to). And...I utterly DETEST the philosophy of Ayn Rand in almost every way possible. Explain to me how he thinks the same way Ayn Rand does. My opinion is that Ayn Rand would be quite fond of the Federal Reserve Bank and would also be enthusiastic about fighting American wars in the Middle East to secure USA oil interests. Am I wrong about that? Let's hear some actual information about policy rather than powerful assertions of existing emotional bias.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 04:07 AM

lh he is such an Ayn Fan, he named his son after her.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 10:50 AM

Okay, now I'll bite, LH...

What good could come out of getting rid of the Fed??? I mean, other than some mistakes that individuals have made that work for the Fed do you understand what the Fed does??? I mean, really... Do you???

And I'd like to hear you ideas on how we raise the money we need to even have a government that doesn't further burden a working class that is being squeezed harder than any time since the 1930s...

Value added taxes are regressive... Sales taxes are regressive...

50% of American families are living on $26,200 or less... The poverty rate for a family of 4 is $22,400... Do the math before you provide US with your answer on how to produce the revenues... You might also Google up "Medicaid" and see how many of our indigent older folks are in nursing homes with Medicaid money... And then Google up Section 8 housing and see how many working poor have a roof over their heads because of those funds... This is what Don refers to as the "real world"...

Waiting on the LH/Paul Plan...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 10:59 AM

It's a complex subject, Bobert. I went to Wickipedia last night and started reading up just to find out what Ron Paul actually does stand for (I figured it was no use asking people here)...and it's very interesting. I'm only about 1/3 of the way through it at this point.

On a quick scan, though, I'd say that I disagree with about 5% of what he says...and I agree with the other 95%!

That's pretty impressive. I've never met anyone yet that I agree with about everything...except for maybe Lynn Miles...and I only met her for a couple of minutes once. ;-D

I'll have to do a bunch more reading yet.

I think rather than hurling invective against Ron Paul just because you've already decided he's sooooo awful....actually read some of his statements...listen to some videos on Youtube. It could be quite thought-provoking. He has some darn good ideas.

Dennis Kucinich is still my man...and you KNOW he's liberal, Bobert. But Ron Paul has some very good ideas too. Kucinich made a video once about what the banks have done to American society...he's no fan of the Fed either.

Anyway, like I said...got a lot of reading to do. I'll get back from it eventually.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 11:16 AM

>>>I think rather than hurling invective against Ron Paul just because you've already decided he's sooooo awful....actually read some of his statements...listen to some videos on Youtube. It could be quite thought-provoking. He has some darn good ideas.<<<

I think that rather than accusing people of willful ignorance you should shut the hell up and tend to the knitting in your own country. There is plenty there to keep you busy.   

Especially after having said this.... "And...I utterly DETEST the philosophy of Ayn Rand in almost every way possible."

Ayn Rand is a big influence on Ron Paul.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjwuGHPilwI


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 11:20 AM

We're all free to think as we please, Jack.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 12:02 PM

Well, LH, the two biggies for Paul are taxes and the Fed...

Your alternatives???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 01:10 PM

Yes. And if you accuse people of willful ignorance with your sum total of information on the topic being 1/3 of a Wiki article, people feel free to point out that you are being a jackass.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 02:40 PM

The bottom line is that only someone suffering from a severe case of split personalities can be a supporter of Kucinich and Paul... These 2 people are 180 degrees from each other on who best should make the rules and run the show... Paul would vote for the corporations and Kucinich would vote for the government...

That's the choice... I can't believe that anyone would expect intelligent people to believe that ya'll (LH and GfinS) have any interest in Dennis Kucinich while professing to be Paul supporters...

It's schizophrenic...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 02:56 PM

But you guys keep voting for "more of the same".....dont you realise that there is nothing left in the locker?

It is past time to start looking at alternatives for the rest of this centuary, the model which served some in the West so well is broken and cannot be repair, we have exploited all the people and stolen all the resources.
We need to educate ourselves away from a society based on greed and money.
Humanity, which is enslaved to the capitalist model, is becomming unsustainable.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 03:16 PM

More of the same is better than Ron Paul, Ake... Paul is the Koch brother's wet-dream... He would shut down every part of the government that dares to implement and enforce rules on the crooks, polluters, cheaters, corporate hoods, child oppressors, labor union busters, minimum wage haters, New Deal haters, Social Security haters, etc, etc...

But hey??? We wouldn't have any wars and we could legally smoke pot in Paul's "Mad Max After the Thunderdome" world...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: akenaton
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 03:31 PM

But the the things you mention Bob, are all obselete.
The future will be about survival, self sufficiency, responsibility for yourself and your family.

I think we wont be able to afford technology, we must prepare ourselves For the future. Ron Paul seems to realise that. No government will provide a living for us, it was only a game called skinning the poor.....the great unwashed have become a burden


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 03:56 PM

Not if I can help it, Ake...

Ayn Rand ain't gonna dial up that world without a fight... I don't want to see 1/2 the population homeless, starving and eating one another...

If that's your kinda perfect world then you are one sick person...

BTW, here's the right wing perfect world: Everything is privatized down the sidewalk and the air you breath and other than the upper couple % of the population everyone else makes $3.00 and hour and is expected to be "responsible" for everything on that $3.00 and hour...

If that's your world view, keep it to yourself...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: number 6
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 04:25 PM

"the majority of the social problems which plague the human species at this time are not the sole result of some institutional corruption, scarcity, a political policy, a flaw of "human nature" or other commonly held assumptions of causality, but rather poverty, corruption, homelessness, war, starvation and the like appear to be the "symptoms" born out of an outdated socioeconomic structure."

.... The Zeitgeist Movement

biLL


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 04:37 PM

Exactly, biLL...

In this case it is Reaganomics... No rules on the big boys and lots of rules on everyone else...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 04:39 PM

Yes, yes, yes, the system is broken, the wolves are in the hen house, the crooks own the government. We KNOW, already. NOBODY IS ARGUING WITH ANYONE ELSE ABOUT THAT!!!!! Been there, done that. We all want to fix it, and are working to do so.

Knowing all that, we still have to vote for someone. Given the choice between voting for an owned politician who hates women, gay people, the environment, minorities, and wants to give ALL the money to fat cats, and an owned politician who supports women's rights, gay rights, minority rights, environmental sustainability, and who want to support the middle class and poor folks, I'll choose the Democrat every time.

Please note: This does not mean I'm a Democrat, or that I'm an Obama fan, or that I think that ALL the really big problems will be solved by having a Democrat in office instead of a Republican. But there are lots of big issues that are different than the corporate ownership of the government that still need to be attended to.

Little Hawk and GfS don't seem to be able to tell the difference between "somewhat evil and somewhat good" and "completely evil". But then, they don't seem intelligent or capable enough to do anything other than make the same comments over and over and over and over again, so I shouldn't be surprised that they are so ethically challenged. They are, after all, a raving bigot (GfS) and a person who doesn't recognize bigotry when he sees it (LH).


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: John P
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 04:41 PM

Oops, that last was cookieless me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 04:52 PM

Ron Paul when asked if he would allow people to die on the street outside of a hospital said "Yes"... And without hesitation... I'm not giving it to more inhumanity... We've seen 3 decades of more and more inhumanity, more poverty, less opportunity, a massive redistribution of wealth to the top... Ron Paul couldn't give a flyin' fig about those things... Tough beans is his attitude and those who support him...

They think it's all about "personal responsibility"... Well, part of "personal responsibility" is fighting cheaters and crooks... That's the part that these folks don't get... So the fight is on... Pick a side... Ron "Wet-dream of the Koch Brothers" Paul v. the 99%...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 05:12 PM

Little Hawk, Ayn Rand didn't have much of a foreign policy. Her current followers may (there are websites), but I haven't kept up with them. As far as securing U. S. oil interests, I think she would have preferred to stay out of that mess and drill for oil here at home.

In fact, her environmental policy (on top of a whole bunch of other things that pushed me away from her views) was stated explicitly in an essay in her non-fiction book Capitalism: the Unknown Ideal. She explained the title of this book by claimed that the U. S. never had a genuine Capitalist system because it had always been shackled by government regulation; not entirely true, especially in the late 1800s and prior to the Great Depression. She also, I might mention, favored child labor.

In the essay on the environmental movement, she detailed all of the wonderful things the Industrial Revolution had brought about, and said that (I'm paraphrasing here because, although I have the book around someplace, I haven't read it since 1972, which is when I decided that she was much too far out into Right Field for me to stomach anymore) "These environmentalist hippies should seek out the smokiest smoke stack they can find and fall down on their knees and give thanks for all the wonderful benefits these 'polluting' factories have provided them with!"

At which point, I gagged and threw the book against the wall!

And she was strenuously opposed to foreign aid, or any other kind of "welfare."

The following is a quote from an article in a recent AlterNet Headlines newsletter on Ayn Rand and some of the current effects of her writings:
In 1966, Ronald Reagan wrote in a personal letter, "Am an admirer of Ayn Rand." Today, Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI) credits Rand for inspiring him to go into politics, and Sen. Ron Johnson (R-WI) calls Atlas Shrugged his "foundation book." Rep. Ron Paul (R-TX) says Ayn Rand had a major influence on him, and his son Sen. Rand* Paul (R-KY) is an even bigger fan. A short list of other Rand fans includes Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas; Christopher Cox, chairman of the Security and Exchange Commission in George W. Bush's second administration; and former South Carolina governor Mark Sanford.
An article from AlterNet Headlines on Ayn Rand:    CLICKY

*You will note that he admires Ayn Rand to the extent that he named his son after her. Not my interpolation. HE said so! Although Rand Paul now denies it, saying it's short for "Randall."

This is not "emotional bias," Little Hawk, this is from the fact that much of Ron Paul's policies come right out of the fifty-plus page speech delivered by John Galt toward the end of Atlas Shrugged (which, of course, is Ayn Rand letting it all hang out!).

Perhaps, rather than speaking from your emotional, you should read some Ayn Rand yourself and see just how Ron Paul's views compare with hers.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 05:27 PM

Exactly, Don...

Ayn Rand is really the influence behind Reaganomics... And Reaganomics is 100% what Ron Paul is all about... Let people die in the street and bow down the corporate pigs and their polluting smoke stacks...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 06:45 PM

I have to agree with what John P. said above. We've heard the same old "the fix is in!" and "we're helpless before the corrupt Powers That Be" kvetching and whining that has been going on post after post, thread after thread.

Give it a rest, you guys!
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."
—Anthropologist Margaret Mead.

"History is made by those who show up"
—Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli.
So if you aren't going to help, then get out of the way!!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 07:21 PM

Like we said back in the 60s, "you're either part of the problem or part of the solution..."

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Janie
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 07:22 PM

Get off it, Bruce. You like me well enough:>)


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 10:35 PM

Still waiting for the justifications of Paul's desire to kill off the the IRS and the Fed...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 21 Dec 11 - 03:24 PM

According to Ayn Rand,
The proper functions of a government fall into three broad categories, all of them involving the issues of physical force and the protection of men's rights: the police, to protect men from criminals—the armed services, to protect men from foreign invaders—the law courts, to settle disputes among men according to objective laws.
Functions beyond that, such as regulating money, or—God forbid!—regulating the behavior of business and industry, such as labor laws, safety regulations, anti-monopoly laws, and all that, are examples of government interfering with the proper functioning of a free country.

She doesn't say how the police force, the courts, and the military are to be paid for. But she was a great advocate of "fee for service," as in if the police catch a footpad breaking into your house, they send you a bill. I suppose the same thing holds for fire departments. Or if the military puts down an invader who intends to enslave us, the Pentagon then sends a bill for your share of the expense. So no IRS is necessary. . . .

Who maintains things like streets and bridges? She couldn't possibly have overlooked things like that! Could she!??

A lot of what Ayn Rand said sounds good at first, but when you start examining it and asking questions, it crumbles before serious scrutiny.

But—so sayeth Ron Paul's spiritual guru. And that of the Tea Party.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Bobert
Date: 21 Dec 11 - 08:01 PM

Wonder why the Republicans only hate the Fed when there's a Democrat in office... Of course, Greenspan got a pass during Clinton's days because Greenspan had been appointed by a Republican...

Normal...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: Don Firth
Date: 21 Dec 11 - 10:32 PM

And Alan Greenspan had been a member of Ayn Rand's inner circle.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Official Obama Haters Thread...
From: catspaw49
Date: 10 Mar 12 - 12:48 PM

Well now here's a few Obama haters. Go to the website linked and click on "videos" at the top of the screen. See that green house there labeled Bill Maher march 9, 2012.....click that.

HBO Bill Maher....click here then click on VIDEOS at the top of the page

Spaw


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