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BS: No more Kalymnos posts
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Subject: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Roger the Skiffler Date: 01 Jun 08 - 05:34 AM English friends in Kalymnos have told me that my Postcards on this website have been read locally and have caused offence by people not understanding my English exaggeration and sense of humour. As I wrote the posts to share my love of Greece and Greek island life and encourage others on this website to come and experience it for themselves, based on my own observations and talking to ex-pats of various nationalities, it has horrified me that I have upset anyone. No-one asked me to write them or encouraged me, I have no purpose other than to share my experiences in a humourous way, in the style of Brian Church in Athens News and other English writers on Greece. I am particularly upset that people assume that my Greek friends George and Irene had anything to do with it, they have been the subjects of my humour as much as anyone and I apologise if anything I have written has offended. However, to avoid any more upset I will not be sharing my Greek experiences with you in the future. RtS |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Micca Date: 01 Jun 08 - 05:58 AM Well, I, for one, am saddened by both the loss of your "postcards" and your gently humourous tales of "culture clash" and your adventures in Kalymnos have made me feel inclined to visit and expierence the place. I would hesitate now for fear of giving offence. I am sure than many of your "fans" would be happy to receive your musings by private circulation e-mail if you decided to use that route, but I am certainly much saddened that anyone took offence at your gentle humour and obvious love of the place and the people. Micca |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Morticia Date: 01 Jun 08 - 06:19 AM I am so sorry to hear this Rog, you know how much I have loved your postcards from Greece. To me, they were much as Gerald Durrell might have written in My Family and Other ANimals and I find it hard to believe anyone could think such fond and gentle tweaks could be offensive. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: maeve Date: 01 Jun 08 - 06:34 AM They were beautifully written and full of love and respect for the people and place. I shall miss them. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: catspaw49 Date: 01 Jun 08 - 08:55 AM Aw geez Roger.......I can appreciate the situation but feel so sorry for you. Like Micca and Terri and maeve, I will miss them. Sometimes it just is beyond my limited thought power to imagine how some stuff can be so misconstrued. Sorry my friend. We know you would never want to harm an it angers me when I realize how anyone could think your posts were anything but the wonderful "postcards" they really were. Why do I really want to say, "Fuck 'em if they can't take a joke?" Much love ..... and btw, I believe you are an answer in the "Mudcatter Quiz #3" Spaw |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: John MacKenzie Date: 01 Jun 08 - 11:35 AM "Fuck 'em if they can't take a joke?" What Spaw said. G (Mind you it's happened to me on here, some dick head with no sense of humour sends you an abusive PM, in response to a tongue in cheek post.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Amos Date: 01 Jun 08 - 11:37 AM I protest, Roger. You should not allow this suppression by sentiment. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: katlaughing Date: 01 Jun 08 - 12:08 PM No, no, and no! What the others have said, ten-fold. Private group email? Please consider it. I shall miss them terribly. I don't see much chance of my ever being able to travel that far and so enjoyed my armchair travel with you very much! I already have a private yahoo group put together for Art's computer. If you'd like to use it, just let me know, okay? My sympathies on how you must feel. I wonder they don't understand how honourable you are and would never knowingly harm. And, what Spaw said, too...maybe they all need slightly thicker skins.:-< luvyakat |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: katlaughing Date: 01 Jun 08 - 12:11 PM One more thought...perhaps someone should make sure all offended parties read this or, maybe not due to certain things said. Maybe we should start a thread extending a hand of friendship to one and all in Kalymnos with a wish to exchange cultural identities, etc.? Perhaps something like that might mend a few fences for you/us/them? |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Little Hawk Date: 01 Jun 08 - 12:21 PM The world seems to be full of people nowadays who are desperately searching for some excuse, any excuse, to be "offended"...and other people (like lawyers and the mass media) just panting to elaborate on their hurt feelings and thereby make a quick buck. It's becoming just ridiculous. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: meself Date: 01 Jun 08 - 12:46 PM Really, I'm sure it's not at all helpful to Roger for any of us to make dismissive comments about the people who were offended on the same public forum that the 'offending' posts appeared on. These are people whom he clearly respects and is fond of, and it can't help his relations with them to have his 'internet friends' making unflattering insinuations about them. There is nothing new about this situation - writers frequently, if not always, run into this kind of trouble when they write about their local community. Why do you think Homer had to leave Ithaca? (Okay, I just made that up). Maybe a non-Greek example would be better: why do you think Shakespeare had to leave Stratford? |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Megan L Date: 01 Jun 08 - 12:55 PM Extend the hand of friendship? I think not, none could be that cruel to these poor folks. It would mean having to introduce them to Chongo and Jack and they are the respectable members how the heck would we ever explain Little Hawk and Peace. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: John MacKenzie Date: 01 Jun 08 - 12:58 PM I'm sure the original post by Roger was made with the full knowledge and expectation of it receiving comments. G |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Little Hawk Date: 01 Jun 08 - 01:00 PM There was an author named Stephen Leacock who wrote a lot of humorous books and stories based on my hometown of Orillia. This would have been in the very early 1900s, I think. In those stories he lampooned many of the notable individuals in the town of his day, only thinly camouflaging their real identities. Naturally, he stretched the truth some to make better stories, but I'm sure he had much good material to work with. You would in any small town. Although Leacock is much loved now and although his books were very popular in Canada in his own time as well as now, I'm sure he was resented greatly by a number of his fellow Orillians who saw themselves and their town being made sport of in his funny stories. I bet he was roundly detested by a fair number of his contemporaries for using them as grist in his humour machine. So it goes... Mr Leacock is now seen as Orillia's favorite son, and his house has been preserved as a tourist attraction. It's in a beautiful setting down on Lake Couchiching, and there is a modern visitor centre as well where you can buy any and all the books he ever wrote and gaze upon a bust of the esteemed gentleman. Leacock got the last laugh. ;-) |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: katlaughing Date: 01 Jun 08 - 01:12 PM I've read one of his about your town, LH, and loved it! MeganL...LOL! |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: gnu Date: 01 Jun 08 - 01:20 PM Hmmm... oh.... yeah, kat! Thicken their skins if they can't take a joke eh! Best I could do. But, I do understand. Unfortunate as it is. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Little Hawk Date: 01 Jun 08 - 01:21 PM Chongo says that he is willing to go to Kalymnos anytime to meet the locals, have a few drinks, shake a few hands, and put this controversy to rest. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: fat B****rd Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:24 PM I'm sorry to read this, Thimbles. Your annual snaps and chat from Kalymnos have brightened many a dreary hour chez B****rd. Take care and my best to Sheila. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Megan L Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:25 PM Thats whit they are afraid o :) |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Little Hawk Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:34 PM Chongo's kind of tied up now with the APP (American Primate Party) and the 2008 presidential election, but he should be free at some point to visit Kalymnos, so hang on to that thought. Perhaps after the inauguration... |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Little Hawk Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:38 PM And he also plans a presidential tour of the Orkney Isles and the wilds of Scotland. Be prepared, Megan. It will be unforgettable. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Megan L Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:48 PM Unforgivable mair like lad still we kin tak him tae Lairg they hiv Sheep there |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: John MacKenzie Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:51 PM I don't share! |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Little Hawk Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:54 PM Oh, good. He does like mutton. Do you really talk in that fashion over there, Megan? If so...how the heck do you understand each other? Have you seen the Star Trek with an all-Scottish crew video? It's hilarious. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Megan L Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:56 PM Weel lad it helps when we aw spik proper like but we hae tae slum it some times fur the ferry loupers and white settlers |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: John MacKenzie Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:57 PM Ur you pu'in' ma laig pal? Ah dinnae ken whit ye mean when ye speir whit wey we a' talk like. It isnae us yins whit talks funny pal, it's your lot. SEE! G |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: gnu Date: 01 Jun 08 - 03:59 PM Ye should tour, LH... Megan needs the points. >;-) |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Peace Date: 01 Jun 08 - 04:01 PM "Homer had to leave Ithaca" I didn't know he lived in New York State. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Little Hawk Date: 01 Jun 08 - 04:06 PM If he had...he would definitely have left. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: John MacKenzie Date: 01 Jun 08 - 04:07 PM He was getting away from Marge |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Peace Date: 01 Jun 08 - 04:08 PM Cultural misunderstandings can be painful for everyone. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Marilyn Date: 01 Jun 08 - 05:15 PM So sorry the postcards will stop - I've really enjoyed reading them although never posted to say so before. It's difficult to see how they could have caused offence as I thought they were very clearly affectionate but I guess that might not come over in translation. If you do decide to have a private email group would you please post here to let us know how to join? |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Roger the Skiffler Date: 02 Jun 08 - 08:51 AM No private e-mails. I'm calling a halt. Thanks for support but that's all folks. Rts |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Ron Davies Date: 02 Jun 08 - 08:52 PM It's a shame. They must be hypersensitive to have sensed a patronizing attitude where there was none. We'll really miss your stories. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Marilyn Date: 03 Jun 08 - 08:27 AM I realised after I had posted that, if the people are offended by the postcards they would be equally offended by private emails on the same subject so I think you're right Rts not to carry on. Shame, though... |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: Morticia Date: 03 Jun 08 - 01:37 PM Well I'm sure everyone will respect your judgement on this, Rog, sensitivity is in the eye of the beholder, I guess.Certainly will miss the stories though. |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: katlaughing Date: 03 Jun 08 - 02:42 PM Same here. It seems a shame, but understandable. I hope they do come to realise it is not in your nature to have meant to cause offence. Thanks for the memories.:-) |
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Subject: RE: BS: No more Kalymnos posts From: GUEST,Dimitri Date: 13 Jun 08 - 01:52 AM Lack of or wrong information turns out to be a capital sin these days... Despite the "laywerese" at the first post of this thread, readers should be informed that Roger's posts were never considered of wrong intend, just misled and misinformed. And sometimes serially BSted... I can understand the feeling: Being away from the rat-race on a Greek island, in a nice place with a cold drink in hand and a curtain of stars above, talking the night away. It¢s a magical feeling, a relief and something you want to get back to again and again. I've done this many times too. But we should be be frank here, many of us have age, some have experience, some have both, why bury our heads in the sand? When you're describing a place and what a nice (or bad) time you had there is one thing, and when you're talking about mice in businesses or creeping crawlies that pester diners and how everybody else is jealous of the one and only self-acclaimed cultural center in the Aegean so much that do nothing all day but try to find ways to hurt them proffesionally is another... Especially when you have NO FIRST-HAND EXPERIENCE on these judgments and you're simply passing on "information" from others. There IS a fine line between this and gossip and one should be careful not to cross it. Of course all bad things happen everywhere else in Emporios except for THAT ONE particular place. When you claim (and talk guests about it to death!) cultural superiority, you have to support this claim with action. Starting a local tabloid as a business practice is no such thing. @Roger: You give this thread¢s readers the impression that “the locals have protested”. This is not true. The locals have absolutely nothing to do with you, writing a diary is totally your business and nobody else¢s. You were protested by a pair of English people who were upset by the fact that personal info of theirs was revealed in these posts. This was NEVER mentioned here... And if you are “particularly shocked” by the fact that your friends are logically suspected as your source, why do you quote them on so many occasions in your posts? By God, this is where you spend your time, “your spiritual home” in your own words! @catspaw49: I will pass this great cultural contribution of yours to the old lady who after working for 30 years to transform a barren mountain to a beautiful garden, was repeatedly called a "witch" simply because somebody is not able to be as loving and creative as that. I am sure she will appreciate this kind of humour and learn from you... I am so tantalized by writing this... I've been online one way or another since 1989 and always considered the 'Net the second best thing in life. The way it brings people close and constitutes the one, fair and really working common place, etc. I never thought i'd use it for something like this... |
