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BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child
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Subject: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: JohnInKansas Date: 02 Dec 07 - 07:30 AM A really great deal for a limited time. Get yourself a $200 (US) laptop for only $399. (A kid somewhere gets one just like yours, included in the price.) Offer expires 31 December 2007. OLPC XO-1 Review [quoting bits and pieces] It has taken more than two years, but the One Laptop Per Child initiative has finally released its much-anticipated laptop: the OLPC XO-1. The XO-1 costs $200 each to donate, but for a limited time—until December 31, 2007—people can avail themselves of the "Give One, Get One" promotion to give a $399 donation ($200 of which is tax-deductible): One laptop goes to a disadvantaged child in a developing nation, while OLPC gives you another one as a thank-you gift of sorts. … … … The OLPC XO-1 is intriguing blend of opposites. On the one hand it contains technology that would barely be called sufficient in today's terms (sub-500-MHz processor, only 256MB of RAM, 1GB of flash storage), though that is more than enough for the ultimate recipient of the notebook, a child in a developing country who has never used a computer before. On the other hand, it includes features found in a notebook worth $2,000 or more. It's encased in a rugged exterior that is splash-, drop-, and hot/cold-resistant. It has an LED backlit screen; it's compatible with 802.11b/g Wi-Fi; and it also offers 802.11s "mesh networking"—a type of peer-to-peer ad hoc networking that requires zero configuration. And it uses so little power that an external hand generator or a solar panel can power the system. … … … The XO-1 is designed and built to work in any environment where you find children, including a one-room school with wooden desks, the dirt floor of a mud brick hut, or a sunlit soybean field. The antennas on either side of the screen double as the laptop's screen latches, so children can swing the XO-1 around its built-in handle with abandon. A drop from child height is unlikely to break the impact-resistant plastic case. Those same antennas cover the three USB ports and headphone and microphone jacks, so all ports are protected. The three-panel touch pad is capacitive in the center (touch-sensitive like most touch pads), while the three panels together are resistive: You can use a nonconducting stylus, even a wooden stick (the unit doesn't come with a stylus), to draw or to move the cursor. The keyboard has a lot of new symbols on it, including a row of buttons representing the neighborhood, classroom, and individual. These buttons modify the GUI so that you see the world in general (over Wi-Fi or mesh networks), local users (if you are in a classroom environment with an OLPC XS school server), or the activities you are working on now or in the past. … … … As part of the "Give One, Get One" promotion, donors will receive one-year subscription to T-Mobile's HotSpot Wi-Fi network, so you can use your XO-1 in Starbucks cafés and airports around the country. Also, if you just want to donate $200 (or more) per laptop and not receive the gift XO-1, OLPC will put the entire sum toward the $200 cost per unit to supply laptops to children. Your entire contribution in this case is 100 percent tax-deductible—depending of course on your local and federal tax laws. [end quotes] The original target was a "Hundred Dollar Laptop" and some may remember hearing about the program a year or two ago under that headline. The "full review" at the link is pretty much favorable, - enough to cause the editor who provided the link I followed to the article and who has been "somewhat negative" about this project previously to offer something resembling an "apology." The reviewer says his 9-year old daughter really liked it. Not something most adults, or kids past about 12 years old, among us would find very useful, although some "competing" designs are mentioned that one could consider if "really cheap" is a driving requirement. Unfortunately, getting these devices into the hands of the kids that might benefit still requires action by the beaurocrats in the target countries; but at least the machines are no longer just vaporware. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Dec 07 - 08:37 AM Well, I know where a million or two could go... :-P Also see |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Newport Boy Date: 02 Dec 07 - 08:46 AM It sounds like a good idea, but as with so many aid projects, it's been conceived from the donor end and not the user end. From the Guardian this week (full report here: OLPC - the Guardian ) QUOTE Speaking to the BBC, Nigeria's education minister, Dr Igwe Aja-Nwachuku, made the not unreasonable point that there are more pressing needs in Nigeria's impoverished schools: "What is the sense of introducing One Laptop Per Child when they don't have seats to sit down and learn; when they don't have uniforms to go to school in; where they don't have facilities?" ENDQUOTE Phil |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Sorcha Date: 02 Dec 07 - 08:47 AM I don't get it. They don't have food, medicine, clothes or shelter, but they gotta have a lap top? |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Dec 07 - 09:04 AM They need EDUKAYSHUN! |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Liz the Squeak Date: 02 Dec 07 - 09:46 AM Well look at it in the long term. They have no desks so they'll have to use them on their scantily clad laps. The heat from the laptops (providing there is actually a power source to run them) will toast their little testicles and render them infertile. This will result in fewer babies being born in the future, which in turn will put less pressure on housing and food production and thus leave more for everyone else. And all for $400. Pen and paper anyone? LTS |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Newport Boy Date: 02 Dec 07 - 10:45 AM I'd prefer to discuss this seriously. The basic idea may have had some sense, but laptops are not the primary need in education in developing countries. Even as a free gift, they probably don't represent best value. I support a charity working in Ethiopia, mainly in the town of Nekemte and the surrounding area. In 2002 I visited a primary school at Hora Dimtu in the Didessa valley. As a result of the visit we provided the materials to rebuild 2 classrooms - timber frame and mud-brick walls with gavanised roofs. The materials cost was £907 - less than $500. Hora Dimtu is about 1km from the nearest 4WD track, and 12 km from any road. The village on the main road had no electricity or telephone (it's possible that the mobile network may have reached that far by now). The school has 4 classrooms with between 40 and 80 kids in each class. There are no desks, tables or chairs - the teacher stands. The kids (age range 6 to 16) sit on poles and work on their knees. Most use slates for writing - they last longer than paper. The main needs are reading books and textbooks - laptops are a distant dream. The only feasible method of charging laptop batteries would be solar. The local community could never afford laptops and solar chargers for something which would mainly replace textbooks and paper. Printers would be totally impracticable, and 'on-line' in this sort of area refers only to the washing. To give an idea of the value of money in such areas, Nekemte Hospital is the only hospital in a district with a population of 600,000. In 2002 its maintenance budget was about £1000 and its drugs budget £250. Given the choice, the local community would prefer to double the drugs budget rather than give 2 kids a computer. OK - outburst over. I do feel strongly about inappropriate 'aid' for developing countries, and this example stirs me more than most now that half the production is to go to developed countries. Phil |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Riginslinger Date: 02 Dec 07 - 10:55 AM ...(providing there is actually a power source to run them)... I think it's important to mention--I looked, but didn't see it up above--that they are designed so that the batteries can be recharged by little solar panels and hand cranks, so they will actually work where there is no power source at all. I see this as one of the very good ideas the technology community has come up with. |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Sorcha Date: 02 Dec 07 - 11:03 AM A 'good idea' maybe, but what Newport said. How can they learn anything from anywhere if they don't have food and medicine to stay well???? |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Riginslinger Date: 02 Dec 07 - 02:20 PM Well, of course, there's that! |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: JohnInKansas Date: 02 Dec 07 - 03:00 PM The argument that this is a "bad idea" because it's not appropriate everywhere is a pretty poor one, if there are a reasonable number of places where it can be used with good results. One of the core notions has been that in places where there are shortages of educational materials, this device could provide access to online materials - local or from broader sources. In areas where communication between schools and parents is difficult, and especially where the parents may not see the value of their kids' education, this device can, if used that way, provide an "intrusion" of better information, and demonstration of things "knowingness" can do to help - in the children's homes. Those moaning about no power quite obviously didn't read the review - even a quick scan - before finding fault. Resources in the places where use might be beneficial have been considered, and even if the device isn't "perfect" for every place where one might end up, it at least is an available resource that local and national educators and managers can use, if they see some benefit and if they choose to use them. Nobody knows yet whether this will be a tremendous success or just another well-meant flop; but the people producing the thing have the best of intentions, and appear ready to work with the places where there might be interest, to do what suits the users. As a side bar note, they have pretty well demonstrated that they can't build a high performance computer suitable for adult use in developed countries for twelve and a half cents as we'd like. They did try very hard to get to minimum possible cost with minimal necessary functions, both consistent with production in reasonable quantities. This is a rock bottom design, potentially useful only within limited societies and by the specific groups of people for whom it may be appropriate. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Mrs.Duck Date: 02 Dec 07 - 03:35 PM You can't even buy one laptop for $400 here so I say its a bargain!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: JohnInKansas Date: 02 Dec 07 - 05:12 PM Newport Boy rants: this example stirs me more than most now that half the production is to go to developed countries. What the po' boy doesn't see (because he apparently didn't read the review) is that the offer of "buy one for a kid, get one for yourself" is only good until the end of the current month. After that, there is no plan ever to permit individuals to "buy their own" and all production goes to the donor supported program recipients. This is a "special offer" - compared in the review to PBS giving you a $75 DVD set for your "$200 Benefactor Contribution" - solely for the purpose of getting a "Fast-Start" on as many donations as possible, up front, to get together enough in cash donations to get the real distribution program started. Another somewhat "critical point" is that this is not a "consumer product," and once it's delivered there is a very brief "sort of support" so that after no more than 30 days you're entirely on your own for keeping the thing working and finding the best ways to use it. This is exactly the situation the kid out in the bush will face, deliberately and artificially imposed on the semi-civilized donor who might get one. This might be viewed as a way to get a small but significant number of units into "test use" among people who have other sophisticated means of communication - i.e. assembling the pool of a thousand angry customers to provide immediate feedback on what might be improved. Altogether a rather clever, if slightly sneaky, dirtylittleplan I'd say. So far as any known plans are concerned, if you don't get one by the end of the month, they will NEVER AGAIN be for sale to individuals. That could, of course, change if future "pledge drives" are found necessary; but the current deliverables amount only to a very small diversion of production for advertising to get the program kicked off. There are at least a couple of "ultra-low-cost" (commercial) computers planned (currently vaporware) or available at about the same $400 range1, that you can/could buy and that will (maybe) continue to be available for future purchase, but the features and purposes are quite different. The OLPC is targeted for children "up to age 12" and their families, and the commercial ones mostly would be more suited to kids "beginning at age 12" or later. Those others might be better for the "Rudd Plan" cited by Foolestroupe. The OLPC unit probably would not accomplish much there, due to the older age of the children targeted and the generally higher literacy(?) and public/social awareness(?) in the target population. 1 Guess What! They're mentioned in the linked review article. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Newport Boy Date: 02 Dec 07 - 06:24 PM Thanks JiK. I think 'rant' is a fairly strong word - I acknowledged it was an outburst. I have read most announcements and reviews concerning this product since it was first announced. Initially, I felt that it was a worthwhile idea (and I still think something along these lines might work) but now I don't think the original idea of "One Laptop per Child" can happen. Or even anything approaching it. There may be some limited success among the more developed parts of some of these countries, but the poorest won't be reached. On the question of the 'local and national educators and managers' deciding to use them, this was the point I highlighted from the Nigerian Education Minister. He sees other requirements as a much higher priority in education. This is also true of our partners in Ethiopia. There may be countries where a different view is taken, and if so, I wish the project well. My detailed experience is in Ethiopia, but I have also travelled in Tanzania, Malawi, Zambia and South Africa. Apart from one school in Malawi (in an area where passing tourists regularly contribute to the school budget) the situation I observed is similar to Ethiopia. I can't be sure about the system elsewhere, but in Ethiopia school resources are funded by the local community. A $200 purchase per child in most areas is pie in the sky, as would be $25 per child. As I say, I'm not against the project per se. The original idea was that these computers would be very cheap, and that third world governments would be able to buy them and supply them to their children. The original 'Hundred Dollar Laptop' sounds very cheap to our ears, but it isn't in terms of the per child education budget in most of these places. Bill Gates is putting a lot of money into finding a way to eliminate malaria. A sum of the same scale might fund this project. Faced with a choice between the two, I suspect the Education Minister would choose the elimination of malaria. I really don't want to too pessimistic, but I think the project needs massive funding from outside the third world if it to succeed in its laudable aims. A recent BBC report (here: OLPC Nigeria ) shows the positives and negatives on a trial in Nigeria. And I believe the only firm substantial order so far has come from Uruguay. Phil |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: JohnInKansas Date: 02 Dec 07 - 06:47 PM Phil - I hoped you wouldn't take offense at the "rant." I didn't mean it too seriously. It does remain with the countries who might benefit from the OLPC to make the choice, sign the contract, and to implement a bit of "system structure" to enable extensive use. I believe I saw something about Nigeria(?) had signed an agreement, but the price went up; so a change of heart may not be too unreasonable. If the original agreement was publicised politically, there may also be a need to "politic" the change in plans(?). Every nation has it's "some things first" priorities, and I don't think I've seen anything about anyone being pressured to ignore critical needs just to get these in place - beyond perhaps a bit of "enthusiastic advertising." The people who've worked up this device probably aren't qualified to show people how to improve crop yields, drain the swamps, and make vacines, so they had to try something else that they knew how to do. Even if they couldn't help with the most critical need I don't think they can be faulted for working to help somewhere else. They've made a start - - - maybe. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Riginslinger Date: 02 Dec 07 - 06:53 PM John - I agree completely. The computer people are trying to help in a way they know how. Actually, if they could get some cooperation, the laptops might help a great deal in the long run. |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: SINSULL Date: 02 Dec 07 - 06:57 PM Once these children have a laptop, they have access to the world. Give a man a fish and feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and feed him for life. I saw a documentary on the program and it was fascinating to see how children who did not have electricity were on the web searching within hours of being introduced to a computer. Imagine the ideas they will come away with - like how to build a windmill and generate electricity to pump water or cook a meal? Maybe they will learn how not to get AIDS when the subject is either taboo or looked on as divine retribution. Maybe one or two will even manage to form online relationships with people worldwide who might take an interest in their village and offer help? Or maybe they will just see that there is a huge world of possibilities out there. |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Riginslinger Date: 02 Dec 07 - 07:27 PM Yeah, just think how limited the world is that they are able to see now. |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Sorcha Date: 02 Dec 07 - 07:29 PM I too wish them well, but I am a pessimist at heart. When some of these governments, (or the 'rebels' against the government) destroy and or poison food supplies etc. I'm not holding out much hope for electronics. |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: JohnInKansas Date: 02 Dec 07 - 08:33 PM It's just like the latest research on stem cells. Scientists make an anouncement. New media trumpet "all the problems are solved." Scientists beg for restraint. News media trumpet "they lied to us." (Original articles that I saw, before the media ran off with it were complete and told no lies. The conclusion is that news reporters can't read - with any comprehension of "technical" stuff.) This computer is something that is now available, through a lot of effort from a few people, over a long period of time. The "company" that produced it has been around for a couple of years, but the concept and early work goes back more than five years that I know of. They now have a visible product, but it still requires appropriate marketing if the product is to survive and have a chance to help. Used appropriately, in places where it's suitable and with appropriate supporting systems (technical, political, and educational), it has the potential to help some. Used irresponsibly, or turned into a political "issue" to support other agendas, it probably won't amount to much. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: GUEST,282RA Date: 02 Dec 07 - 10:53 PM The program is necessary. The computer is the main form of communication these days--especially internationally. Having their children literate in how to use and communicate using a computer is one of the best things a developing nation can do for itself because no nation today can call itself developed that isn't computer-literate. It's only one step in that direction but it's big one and a necessary one. It's pointless to argue that such and such a people don't have enough desks or chairs or uniforms. You're talking about people so isolated that many people don't know their plights. Such people need computers more than anyone because it provides a vital link to the outside which is where they have to turn for things anyway since they obviously do not have the internal means to solve their shortages. The beauty of laptops is that they don't require tables and chairs and desks and uniforms. They don't even require electricity. That is exactly what makes them a godsend to these children. To refuse it to them on the grounds that there's too many shortages is nothing other than utterly bizarre, backwards thinking. The laptops don't replace schools but they go a long way towards helping kids who otherwise would have no schooling at all. |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 03 Dec 07 - 02:39 AM Look, I already TOLD you goys - contact Kevin Rudd... |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: GUEST,PMB Date: 03 Dec 07 - 05:04 AM ...Nigeria's education minister, Dr Igwe Aja-Nwachuku..."What is the sense of introducing One Laptop Per Child when they don't have seats to sit down and learn; when they don't have uniforms to go to school in; where they don't have facilities?" You missed out that the Nigerian government is signed up to a rival, more expensive, scheme with Intel, a multibillion dollar international megacorp, in which the children use the computers in a far less open- ended way. It is possible, if not probable, that given Nigeria's recent history, certain key opinions have been influenced by assistance with expenses. As for kids needing uniforms to learn..... I also think that there's some misleading stereotyping going on in some of the posts. Nigeria's population are not rich (though the country should be, but the profits from the oil economy have been siphoned off by oil firms from the developed world, with the assistance of local officials whose expenses have been defrayed), but neither are most of them indigent. Denying them access to computers until books have been provided would cut them off from the fastest area of growth of educational resources, and lock them into a second- class, outdated model of learning. Whether the OLPC is a better way of achieving this than the use of secondhand, but perfectly serviceable, computers cast off by the rich is another question. |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Newport Boy Date: 03 Dec 07 - 05:07 AM Just picking up a few points from the last few messages. John and I seem to have negotiated a middle ground - I agree it's a worthwhile effort, and it's probably what people with these skills can best contribute. I'm certainly not suggesting that anyone "refuse it to them on the grounds that there's too many shortages". My point is that we're not offering to give these computers - the whole idea of the project is that the third world governments buy them for their kids. This is where I feel the concept fails - at least for most countries. A very few figures to illustrate. All statistics from the CIA Factbook (except Uruguay purchase of OLPC) Uruguay population 3.46 million; 0-14 yrs: 794,000 Life expectancy at birth 75.93 yrs Annual budget expenditure $5.67 billion = $1638 per person GDP per person $10,900 Telephone system: fully digital. 756,000 internet users (22%) Ethiopia population 76 million; 0-14 yrs: 33.2 million Life expectancy at birth 49.23 yrs Annual budget expenditure $3.201 billion = $42.2 per person GDP per person $1,000 Telephone system: 'Adequate for government use'. 164,000 internet users (0.2%) The budget and GDP figures are at exchange rates, which is what counts in purchasing from abroad. Uruguay has ordered 100,000 OLPC and intends to order a further 300,000 to provide all kids. This is about 50% of the 0-14 population. At a cost of $150 each (assuming that costs go down as production increases) this is $60 million or about 0.1% of 1 year's budget. The phone system is such that most may have internet access. Ethiopia, on the same basis, would need to provide 16 million OPLC at a cost of $2.4 billion or about 75% of 1 year's budget. Very few would be able to have internet access. Uruguay is relatively wealthy, and can afford this. For Ethiopia, and other similar countries, there is no chance of this happening. There are other far more important priorities for their budget. Unless there is a major injection of cash from the first world, this scheme will be restricted to a relatively small number of 'second world' countries. I'm not knocking the idea, but I've learned to be realistic about achievable outcomes in developing countries, even though I'm an optimist at heart. Phil |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: SINSULL Date: 03 Dec 07 - 02:38 PM Internet access is provided via satellite, not the phone system - at least that what 60 Minutes showed last night. |
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Subject: RE: BS: OLPC: One Laptop Per Child From: Newport Boy Date: 03 Dec 07 - 03:16 PM I didn't see the 60 Minutes programme, but I assume it showed the Nigerian trial? The satellite access was provided free for the trial, and the provider quoted $350 per month for the 128kbs connection and an installation cost of $2500. The accompanying photograph shows a petrol generator to power the satellite link. Since it's only a 1 watt radio, this is probably economical to run, but in my Ethiopian example, the nearest filling station is 45km away. The village has no transport. I'm sorry, but I still can't see how this will help the poorest counties. Uruguay, yes - Nigeria, possibly - if the oil revenues are used to benefit the people, rather than first world shareholders. Ethiopia and similar, no. The trail for 60 Minutes included the following: "Lesley Stahl reports about MIT's Professor Nicholas Negroponte's determination to get a laptop into the laps of children in Third World countries. The professor has since realized his goal is more of a dream, but it's one he's not quite ready to give up on." This is what I've been saying - I hope he doesn't give up entirely, but I think the emphasis has to change. Even with the lowest cost technology, we would need billions of dollars to provide for the majority of kids in Africa. This cash needs to be raised. Bear in mind that 0.2% internet users in Ethiopia - these are government, businesses in Addis Ababa, and a few academic institutions in other towns. Our contact in Nekemte has a moderately reliable e-mail connection, as long as we don't send attachments much over 250k. A satellite internet service for the town would cost more than the hospital budget. Phil |
