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Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean
DigiTrad:
CRYING
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Subject: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: GUEST,PSzymeczek Date: 12 Nov 06 - 04:42 PM I love Don, but this song was written by Joe Melson and Roy Orbison. Orbison recorded it way back in '61. Chech All Music Guide online |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 12 Nov 06 - 04:47 PM No shit. There are so many shit sites that do not check their sources, and so many lazy *&&%$#@ out there who ascribe the authorship of a song to the person who recorded it. The 'net is filled with that kind of misinformation. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: PSzymeczek Date: 12 Nov 06 - 04:50 PM Just helpin' Mudcat get it right! |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Jeri Date: 12 Nov 06 - 04:54 PM He's right. The Roy Orbison hit is in the DT as "copyright Don McClean." |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 12 Nov 06 - 04:55 PM Sure enough. I just messaged the site you liked to and passed on the info. Hope it is corrected pretty damned quick. Thank you for pointing it out. (I too am a McLean fan, but songwriters deserve better than they get on the internet, especially when it comes to authorship.) |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: GUEST Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:05 PM Is it possible that Don McLean has purchased the copyright from Orbison's estate? Stranger things have happened. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: PSzymeczek Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:08 PM He'd also have to pay Joe Melson's estate. Is he even dead? BTW, Jeri, I'm "she". :-) |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:12 PM Also, I was not slagging Mudcat. My remark was a rference to so damned many sites that have writers' lyrics and the lyrics get attributed to some guy or gal who did the song. That PISSES ME OFF, just in case I wasn't clear earlier. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Jeri Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:16 PM Re I'm "she": thanks - I couldn't tell from "P", so I picked a pronoun. ;-) From Don McClean's site - it looks like an error that's been perpetuated. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: GUEST,Don Meixner Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:19 PM Bruce this problem came to my attention when we were clearing songs for our bands last CD. The Harry Fox agency had Tommy Makem listed as the copyholder of several songs that were clearly public domain. I'd assume many, many, times over that Fox had this screwed up long before I'd accuse Tommy of trying to get the rights to songs he didn't write. Don |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:24 PM Crying Co-writer: Joe Melson Artists: Roy Orbison (1961), k.d. lang & Roy Orbison, Del Shannon, Lisa Carter, Sheila G. White, Glen Campbell, Jay & The Americans, Don McLean, Limelighters, Waylon Jennings, Lettermen, Starlight Orchestra, Ronnie Milsap, Arlene Harden, Gene Pitney, Narvel Felts, Susie Stevens, Gerald Joling, Dion That is from www.nashvillesongwritersfoundation.com/fame/orbison.html and I figger they might know somethin'! |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:26 PM Don, I was not at all suggesting that McLean was trying to cop a credit for the song. It was something that was on a site somewhere and someone with the best intentions found that site, posted the lyrics and the attribution. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Jeri Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:26 PM Orbison/Melson are who McClean's site credits. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:28 PM And Don M, nowhere here have I suggested that any of this had anything to do with Don. Nor would I. I'm outta here. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Jeri Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:35 PM Don M, I understood what you said. It's just a possible reason the song was mis-credited. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: GUEST,DonMeixner Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:37 PM I'm sorry I wasn't clear Bruce. I assumed you were frustrated with a screwed system and were making that clear. I never thought you were suggesting that Don McLean or anyone else was grabbing for copyrights. It wasn't so long ago that my brother in law told me I should hear Neal Young's new song. It sounded like something I'd like. He dropped the vinyl and out pops "Four Strong Winds". No matter how hard I tried to explain to him that the song was nearly 40 years old and written by another Canadian he refused to believe me. With mental giants around like my brother in law it is easy to see how such confusions happen. Don |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:47 PM I hear you Don. My anger was not aimed at you. Songwriters have a hard enough time of it without their credit for the song being taken by someone who can't be arsed to find out who the writer is. Someone once said that "and infinite number of monkeys with an infinite number of typewriters would eventuall write the Complete Works of Shakespeare." Well, the internet proves that's not true. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: DonMeixner Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:49 PM But soft! What light throgh.w;; kjjfu jsy ndsjua kkahgrd llal;ajfj. Damn. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:51 PM LOL |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Jeri Date: 12 Nov 06 - 05:58 PM How many times do we hear "I like '[title]' by '[singer]'"? I think people are so used to singers writing their own songs they don't bother to check. What's really amazing is how many people down the line - some of whom are pros and should know better - just pass on the mistake. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: bobad Date: 12 Nov 06 - 09:06 PM The one misattribution I hear the most is that Fred Neil's "Everybody's Talking" was written by Harry Nilsson - and I always make it a point (sometimes stridently) to correct that. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Jeremiah McCaw Date: 13 Nov 06 - 07:32 PM "The Harry Fox agency had Tommy Makem listed as the copyholder of several songs that were clearly public domain." Complicating matters even further is that a performer can quite legitimately copyright their own arrangement of a public domain song, which is likely the Makem case. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Leadfingers Date: 13 Nov 06 - 08:11 PM One of MY Hobby Horses !! People who attribute a song to who they have heard sing it with NO regard to who may have actually written it ! TOO many examples I know of to post !! |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 13 Nov 06 - 08:19 PM Yeah, mine too. |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: GUEST,Joe Offer, at the Women's Center Date: 13 Nov 06 - 08:37 PM The lyrics are here (click) in the Digital Tradition - attributed to Don McLean. Any corrections to the lyrics, or are they OK? I'll post an attribution correction notice later. Information I have is that words and music were by Roy Orbison and Joe Melson, 1961. It was recorded by Jay and the Americans in 1966, and by Don McLean in 1981. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 14 Nov 06 - 10:16 AM Authorship is correct, Joe.Melson and Orbison. Artists [who recorded the song]: Roy Orbison (1961), k.d. lang & Roy Orbison, Del Shannon, Lisa Carter, Sheila G. White, Glen Campbell, Jay & The Americans, Don McLean, Limelighters, Waylon Jennings, Lettermen, Starlight Orchestra, Ronnie Milsap, Arlene Harden, Gene Pitney, Narvel Felts, Susie Stevens, Gerald Joling, Dion That is from www.nashvillesongwritersfoundation.com/fame/orbison.html |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Jim Dixon Date: 19 Nov 06 - 03:42 PM It depends on what the meaning of "by" is. Regarding the attribution problem, it reminds me of a time I had a dialogue something like this:
ME: ––––– recorded it but he didn't write it. GUEST: I didn't say he DID write it. ME: And I didn't say you DID say he wrote it. Anyhow, it illustrates the problem. Some people, when they use the word "by" mean "written by." Other people mean "recorded by" or "performed by." I don't think there is a dictionary out there that can resolve the question. We just have to accept the fact that "by" (alone) is ambiguous. p.s.: I just used the Mudcat forum search for the phrase "I didn't say" and got 642 hits! And "I never said" gets 378 hits! What does that tell you about the quality of communication at Mudcat? |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Peace Date: 19 Nov 06 - 04:38 PM Only about half of the folks who get the phrase "I didn't say" respond with "I never said"? |
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Subject: RE: Origins: Crying Credited to Don McLean From: Seamus Kennedy Date: 20 Nov 06 - 12:09 PM Bruce and Don, I had this problem 30 years ago before the Internet. I misattributed some songs on my recordings, because the search facilities that we have nowadays weren't available; so I asked around - other musicians, radio DJs, etc., in the hopes of getting the information. I got a couple wrong, e.g. I attributed Adam McNaughtan's Oor Hamlet (the 3-minute Hamlet) as Anon, but when I discovered my error later, I rectified the situation by paying royalties to Adam. Nowadays, though, with the Internet, there's litle excuse for getting it wrong, but it can happen. One thing that happens to me as I perform around the country, is that people will come up and hand me a cassette or a CD with no writer information saying, "Here's a song you should do." I'll ask who is it, and invariably they reply, "Oh, I don't know, some guy I heard on the radio." Try tracking the author down from that. Seamus |
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