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Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'

DigiTrad:
A GRAZING MACE
AMAZING GRACE
AMAZING GRASS
AMAZING PRESS
MIORBHAIL GRA\IS (AMAZING GRACE)


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Genie 12 Sep 02 - 10:42 PM
Genie 12 Sep 02 - 10:47 PM
Bobert 12 Sep 02 - 10:54 PM
wysiwyg 12 Sep 02 - 11:04 PM
GUEST,Guest 12 Sep 02 - 11:08 PM
Genie 12 Sep 02 - 11:14 PM
GUEST,Guest (former member) 12 Sep 02 - 11:17 PM
wysiwyg 12 Sep 02 - 11:21 PM
GUEST,guest 12 Sep 02 - 11:28 PM
Sorcha 12 Sep 02 - 11:29 PM
Genie 12 Sep 02 - 11:47 PM
GUEST,guest 12 Sep 02 - 11:50 PM
EBarnacle1 13 Sep 02 - 10:39 AM
McGrath of Harlow 13 Sep 02 - 11:06 AM
Wesley S 13 Sep 02 - 11:58 AM
Genie 14 Sep 02 - 12:25 AM
GUEST,Andy Barnes 14 Sep 02 - 08:32 PM
Genie 14 Sep 02 - 09:35 PM
GUEST 27 May 04 - 11:32 PM
Mooh 27 May 04 - 11:40 PM
GUEST,ozmacca 27 May 04 - 11:57 PM
greg stephens 28 May 04 - 07:18 AM
Mooh 28 May 04 - 08:51 AM
masato sakurai 28 May 04 - 09:04 AM
Flash Company 28 May 04 - 10:03 AM
TS 28 May 04 - 04:28 PM
GUEST,jaze 28 May 04 - 09:27 PM
Bill Hahn//\\ 29 May 04 - 09:07 PM
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Subject: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: Genie
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 10:42 PM

My thread title is, of necessity, a kind of shorthand.

Since someone brought up the question of why Amazing Grace has become linked with bagpipes, I'd like to address the question of how/why this beautiful song is beginning to be overused as a funeral song.

In actuality, the song is sung at weddings, church services, campfires, and in a lot of contexts. But the radio and TV medica -- in their usual monkey-see, monkey-do manner -- have begun to play a short clip of bagpipes playing the first few measures of "Amazing Grace" every time they cover a funeral (especially a military one or one for public servants like police or firefighters).

My guess is that at every one of those media-covered funerals there were other songs played or sung -- "Abide With Me," "Rock Of Ages," "In The Garden," "His Eye Is On The Sparrow," "In The Sweet By and By," or other hymns, or maybe some secular songs.

As I said, though, the current mass media are terribly uninventive -- total copycats. (If one newscaster misuses a word or comes up with an idiotic phrase, you can bet there will be dozens of them copying it the next day.) So the use of that "first line of Amazing Grace" (on bagpipes, of course) has almost become de rigeur, it seems when the news media cover memorial services.

I must admit that I'm even a bit perturbed at Tom Paxton for his allusion to "Amazing Grace" as a funeral song in his wonderful tribute to the NYC firefighters ("The Bravest), because it contributes to the ruination of one of my favorite hymns.

I actually do not think it's entirely too late to salvage the song yet. As I said, folks still do sing it in other contexts.

But it will not take too many more repetitions of that funeral-cum-Amazing Grace-on-bagpipes type of news clip to pound the last nail into the coffin (so to speak) of this song.

Mainly, I'm just venting. But I'd be interested in you folks' thoughts on the subject.

Genie


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: Genie
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 10:47 PM

What showed up as an asterisk on my screen in the thread title was supposed to be a "does not equal" sign.


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: Bobert
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 10:54 PM

Well, all have to add to this thread is if you ever get sick of hearing this song all ya' gotta do is hear Mississippi Fred McDowell's version... Now, this is a different story, indeed...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: wysiwyg
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:04 PM

I think it has become identified with funerals for several very good reasons, though they do not make it a "funeral" song. Funeral music is often chosen according to whatever the deceased's favorite hymn was, and it IS a lot of people's favorite. So as the population ages we will hear it done more and more often.

Also, it is one of few that many people can sing without having the words in front of them-- best-memorized verses, and plenty of them. Makes a group feel like they are all together, to be able to sing like that, and so many non-Christians know it to from the singing of Joan Baez and others.

And it's so singable.

These all make it a safe bet for use in large public events where a hymnal for each would be impossible.

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:08 PM

Bagpipes are used by fire and police departments everywhere at funerals. The bagpipes I understand, since some of the largest fire and police departments had large numbers of Irishmen (The Emerald Society in New York, etc.).
Here in Canada, many Scots are in these organizations, and bagpipe bands are common with them as well. Amazing Grace is always played at their funerals on bagpipes.
Genie, just when Amazing Grace came into the picture as a "required" tune at fire and police funerals, I, too, would like to know. I am sure other tunes were used before. Perhaps just its overwhelming popularity is the reason.


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: Genie
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:14 PM

Folks, just to clarify my point, it is not the use of "Amazing Grace" at people's memorial services that distresses me. (As has been pointed out, there are a lot of reasons for having it done at funerals -- just as there are for having it done in church and at weddings and campfires.)

What bothers me is the news media's insistence on playing, not just "Amazing Grace," but exactly the same 3 or 4 measures of the song, everytime they portray a funeral. That is what is likely to get the song relegated to the status of "funeral song."

Genie


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: GUEST,Guest (former member)
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:17 PM

WYSIWYG, I think Genie was wondering why it is played on bagpipes. It is not sung when the pipes are playing it at the funerals, at least not at the ones held here. Usually it is a lone piper from the band, not the entire group. During the church service, it may also be sung as a requested hymn, as you indicate.


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: wysiwyg
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:21 PM

I don't think she's wondering anything; I think as she said, she's venting.

~S~


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:28 PM

I don't think you can blame the media. They are merely covering what has become a recognizable fixture at these funerals. Anything beyond the first few notes gets edited out by the staff putting the newscast together.


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: Sorcha
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:29 PM

My question--how and why did it become known as the "Fallen Heroes" song? I DO NOT want it played at my funeral.......play Red Haired Boy instead!! I hate the song and have been sick of it for years. I also hate/have been sick of Rugged Cross, In the Garden and Wings of a Dove. Eon't even THINK of doing one of them at my service or I will rise up and haunt you all for generations!!


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: Genie
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:47 PM

guest, the media like to tell us that they are simply reporting the trends they observe. But it works both ways. What they choose to report can also reinforce, distort, and/or exacerbate the phenomena being reported.

I'll wager that when they cover a funeral where "Amazing Grace" and 5 other songs were played, they choose to play a clip of "Amazing Grace," even if the other songs are pretty well known.

Actually, folks, yes, I am venting. But I'm on the verge of organizing a letter-writing campaign to encourage the radio and TV stations to cut it out, for the sake of sparing that song from an undeserved fate.


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Subject: RE: BS: 'Amazing Grace' * 'funeral song'
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 12 Sep 02 - 11:50 PM

How about Great Spackled Bird? There ought to be a parody out there with that name.
There are a couple of parodies of Amazing Grace in the DT, but there should also be one about the gal, Amazin' Grace.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: EBarnacle1
Date: 13 Sep 02 - 10:39 AM

The one time I had any input on a post-9/11 event, I got them to play "Flowers of the Forest," instead.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 Sep 02 - 11:06 AM

Why does anyone get up in the air about this kind of thing? What people have at their funeral is their business. What does it matter if the media choose to use something that is common to a lot of these funerals rather than what is distinctive about them?

I'm reminded of "Brpwn boots - I arsk you. Fancy going to a funeral in brown boots." As if that kind of thimng is what matters.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: Wesley S
Date: 13 Sep 02 - 11:58 AM

These things feed on themselves. People request AG because every time they turn on the TV they hear AG at a funeral. And most people aren't that original to think of something different. Or at least the next-of-kin can't think of anything else at a time like that. It just goes to show you that it's a good idea to have some ideas about your own funeral written down before you go. That way there can be no mistake about what you want.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: Genie
Date: 14 Sep 02 - 12:25 AM

McGrath, my question for the media is this: Is "Amazing Grace" the most common funeral song in the US? There are many hymns (e.g., "Abide With Me," "Rock Of Ages," "I'll Fly Away," "Nearer, My God, To Thee," "In The Sweet By And By," and "Will The Circle Be Unbroken") which specifically refer to death and are commonly played at funerals. I am not at all sure that "Amazing Grace" is the one most often played -- unless that phenomenon is a product of the media's obsession with it as a "memorial service hymn."

If you had asked me in 1980 to name the 5 most common funeral hymns, "Amazing Grace" would not have come to my mind.

And for military funerals, whatever happened to "Eternal Father, Strong To Save?" It used to be pretty standard fare for those.

Right on, Sorcha! LOL!

guest, there IS a song about the gal, "Amazin' Grace (How Sweet She Was!"). Who sang that -- Arlo Guthrie?

Genie


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: GUEST,Andy Barnes
Date: 14 Sep 02 - 08:32 PM

The meaning of a song is the perception of the listner. I have heard and sung Amazing Grace in many various locations including bars, tents and toilets where the acoustics really resound ( who remembers the "Acoustic Bog Society" of 20 odd years ago (UK)!!). As a song Amazing Grace has the strengh to withstand any use or even abuse from either singer, venue or purpose and if it's effect, when heard, is to make people reflect, remember or just smile - who are we to question - Amazing Grace was sung before many of us were born and will probably be sung after many of us are gone - the song will remain.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: Genie
Date: 14 Sep 02 - 09:35 PM

guest, you asked about "Great Spackled Bird?" Is that a song about a plasterer who takes revenge on a parrot? *BG*


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: GUEST
Date: 27 May 04 - 11:32 PM

Amazing Grace started playing at military funerals since the civil war the Irish played it on the bagpipes when they lost a comrade they played amazing grace because they were proud of what they were fighting for.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: Mooh
Date: 27 May 04 - 11:40 PM

The overuse of Amazing Grace at funerals may have as much to do with the fact that many folks just aren't familiar with funeral music in general, and aren't aware of resources to help educate themselves.

Any decent hymn book will have tunes indexed under several catagories, and it's not a bad place to start looking.

Peace, Mooh.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: GUEST,ozmacca
Date: 27 May 04 - 11:57 PM

Maybe it's just plain ignorance (or wishful thinking), but I can't remember ever hearing THAT tune in Scotland before the LP from the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards pipe band back in the early 70's, although it may well have been popular for yonks before that in the USA as a hymn. Since then it certainly seems to have become compulsory for every piper, or any news or movie item anywhere where a piper might be lurking in the scenery, but I, for one, certainly don't want it played at my funeral.... Not after having heard some of the parodies to it over the years since the Greys did it to death.....


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: greg stephens
Date: 28 May 04 - 07:18 AM

I am very intrigued by the claim that Amazing Grace was played by Irish pipers in America at funerals from the civil war on. This sounds like another bit of the old "Celtic" industry, discreetly adjusting the past to fit with a post-1970 world-view.
    I am quite willing to be proved wrong, but I just have a feeling that its use as a funereal pipe-tune is an extremely recent phenomenon (quite possibly influenced by the Sottish record mentioned by Ozmacca).. If anyone has any evidence that the custom dates back to 1865 or whenever, lets hear it.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: Mooh
Date: 28 May 04 - 08:51 AM

Greg...I wouldn't be surprised either. There is so much which is revisionist and anachronistic about "trad" and "celtic" music and culture that it's hard to know what to believe.

Peace, Mooh.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: masato sakurai
Date: 28 May 04 - 09:04 AM

See the previous thread: Is 'Amazing Grace' a Celtic song?


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: Flash Company
Date: 28 May 04 - 10:03 AM

Greg Stephens- Was the Sottish record 'What shall we do with the drunken piper?'

FC


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: TS
Date: 28 May 04 - 04:28 PM

Why are we getting bent over this?...I dont think you can blame it on the media. I am a Canadian Forces member and I will be proud to know that Amazing Grace and Flowers of the Forest will be played during my service of Remembrance. It has become a tradition and who really needs a cause for the birth of a tradition....it is a tradition and thats fun and dandy......Slainte!


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: GUEST,jaze
Date: 28 May 04 - 09:27 PM

On my daughter's first birthday {16th) after she died, we were gathered at her grave with friends. There was someone playing a bagpipe over the hill. Someone went and asked him to come over and play a song. He played "Happy Birthday" and then "Amazing Grace". It was perfect... and beautiful. So now whenever I hear Amazing Grace on bagpipes, I have a fond memory.


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Subject: RE: Amazing Grace * 'funeral song'
From: Bill Hahn//\\
Date: 29 May 04 - 09:07 PM

I admit to not having read the entire thread. Just let me say that I find that piece the most meaningful and beautiful piece of I have ever heard.   In fact, a personal note, I had the title enscribed on my late wife's headstone---".....one with Amazing Grace".

The only other piece that I can think of that moves me as much is the late Kate Wolf's song (originally written for a wedding) that is used for weddings and funerals---Give Yourself To Love.


Bill Hahn


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