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Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:12:11 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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John:Oddly, I got both the version en clair, and the scrambled text at the end of  this email.  Trust me when I say that the university would never censor "fuck" even though it  might see your email originally as spam -- and THEN would encode/scramble it.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Date: Monday, March 14, 2005 4:12 pm
Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters> CLIFF ABRAMS
> Some browsers, email programs, etc. have
> "child-filters". Check to see if you have one, and
> turn it off. AOL is notorious for this. Look in
> "Preferences". It may be somewhere else on your hard
> drive, depending upon your operating system. Search
> for "filter"-- or similar. Good luck.
>
> MEHLBERG
> No, there is no filtering on my end.  I own my own my last name
> MEHLBERG.COM and there is no filtering on my server.
> I often send myself much bawdier material than what I posted to
> ballad-l today and there is no delay.
>
> As a test, I am sending this email twice with the same text
> except the first will contain misspelled bawdy words and the next
> sent 5 seconds later will contain spelled out bawdy words.
> The delay between the two emails will tell us the "lag time"
> of bawdry.
>
> fkuc siht mtheorfcukre fkuc tnees gdo dmande
> ccoksukcre fkucs wrhoe hosuewvies  btchi
>
>
>
> .
>

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Subject: Stout's Iowa
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:16:00 -0800
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Folks:Dolores' trolling has turned up the following important and rare book:        6950874148 - Folklore from Iowa by Stout, 1936, $14.99 (ends
Mar-19-05 08:56:33 PST)There are  no fewer than 112 folksongs in this volume -- including Child ballads, American ballads, etc. -- collected prior to 1930.Ed

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 01:48:11 -0600
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<<This phrase comes from its use by musicians for a particular dance tune
popular throughout the English-speaking world.I am currently collecting such things - like arse-over-anna for the
varsovienna
Circassian Circle ... Circumcissional Circle
Virginia Reel .... Vagina Reel>>Sheebeg Shemore ... She Begged for More
Banish Misfortune ... Vanish Me Foreskin<<I will attempt to get the exact tune they sing it to.......>>Do, please!Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 02:17:54 -0600
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> I used to work in Chicago, in a department store,
> I used to work in Chicago, I did, but I don't anymore.
> A lady came in and asked for some cake,
> I asked her what kind she'd adore --
> "Layer," she said, so layer I did.
> I don't work there anymore.It was recorded in the late 1940s by Larry Vincent, proprietor of Pearl
Records. He said he wrote it, but John Mehlberg has pointed out collections
well before his publication of the disc.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Going No Mail?
From: Debra Cowan <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:08:45 -0500
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Hey Kidz,Any way to go no mail on this list? Can I just send an email that says:set ballad-l nomailEnquiring minds want to know.Debra--******************************
Debra Cowan - Singer
website: http://www.DebraCowan.com
USA BOOKINGS: (508) 662-9746,
SNAIL-MAIL: P.O. Box 1335, Westborough, MA 01581
UK BOOKINGS: Vivienne Bloomfield   http://www.otheragency.co.uk
RECORDINGS/SALES: Falling Mountain Music (540) 877-2505
http://www.fallingmountain.com
******************************

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Subject: Re: Going No Mail?
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:14:39 -0500
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That should work.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of Debra Cowan
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 9:09 AM
To: [unmask]
Subject: Going No Mail?Hey Kidz,Any way to go no mail on this list? Can I just send an email that says:set ballad-l nomailEnquiring minds want to know.Debra--******************************
Debra Cowan - Singer
website: http://www.DebraCowan.com
USA BOOKINGS: (508) 662-9746,
SNAIL-MAIL: P.O. Box 1335, Westborough, MA 01581
UK BOOKINGS: Vivienne Bloomfield   http://www.otheragency.co.uk
RECORDINGS/SALES: Falling Mountain Music (540) 877-2505
http://www.fallingmountain.com
******************************

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Subject: Notes and Queries in Gutenberg Project
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
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Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 15:26:40 EST
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Subject: Re: Notes and Queries in Gutenberg Project
From: Steve Roud <[unmask]>
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Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 00:23:28 -0000
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Subject: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Educational CyberPlayGround <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 22:46:47 -0500
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Hi,Can anyone recommend someone who
can be an expert on the subject of camp songs?There is a reporter on KQED who would like to know.Please send the info directly to me.thanks for any help,Karen Ellis
Educational CyberPlayGround<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
The Educational CyberPlayGround
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/National Children's Folksong Repository
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/NCFR/Hot List of Schools Online and
Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/7 Hot Site Awards
New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/15/05 (Ballads & Folk Songs)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 22:47:52 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(79 lines)


Hi!        Here is the regular list. There doesn't seem to be as much on
Ebay this week as sometimes.        SONGSTERS        6951796269 - The Diamond Songster containing the most approved
Sentiment IRISH SONGS, 1812, $1 (ends Mar-22-05 09:38:07 PST)        MISCELLANEOUS        4709791750 - North Carolina Ballads and Folk Songs by Moser, LP,
$5 (ends Mar-19-05 18:28:16 PST)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        6951198223 - Folk Songs of the Southern Appalachians by Ritchie,
1965, $0.99 (ends Mar-16-05 11:01:51 PST)        6950914292 - A Book Of Nursery Songs And Rhymes by Baring-Gould,
1895, 12 GBP (ends Mar-16-05 13:08:44 PST)        7306958983 - Songs From The Hills Of Vermont by Sturgis, $9.99
(ends Mar-16-05 16:07:03 PST)        6951005717 - English Minstrelsie by Baring-Gould, 1895, 1.04 GBP
(ends Mar-17-05 06:29:17 PST)        4534705801 - TALES & SONGS OF SOUTHERN ILLINOIS by Neely, 1998
reprint, $12.50 (ends Mar-17-05 06:32:45 PST)        6950707125 - JACOBITE SONGS AND BALLADS by MacQuoid, 1887, 7 GBP
(ends Mar-18-05 07:01:50 PST)        4535105012 - Steamboatin' Days: Folk Songs of the River Packet Era
by Wheeler, 1969, $9.99 (ends Mar-18-05 16:00:40 PST)        7307456300 - Songs of PENNSYLVANIA by Whitefield, 1949, $2.49 (ends
Mar-18-05 17:42:08 PST)        7307456936 - Songs of CALIFORNIA by Whitefield, 1949, $2.49 (ends
Mar-18-05 17:46:06 PST)        7307457473 - Songs of OHIO by Whitefield, 1949, $2.49 (ends
Mar-18-05 17:50:09 PST)        4535308268 - Songs of American Sailormen by Colcord, 1938, $9.99
(ends Mar-19-05 16:21:54 PST)        4535485106 - Marrow Bones: English Folk Songs from the Hammond and
Gardiner Mss by Purslow, 1965, 1.99 GBP (ends Mar-20-05 10:48:46 PST)        6951350748 -  OLD BALLADS HISTORICAL AND NARRATIVE by Evans, 4
volumes, 1810, 10.50 GBP (ends Mar-20-05 13:00:00 PST)        7500159162 - The Seeds of Love by Sedley, 1967, 4.99 GBP (ends
Mar-21-05 12:00:00 PST)        4535895620 - Anglo-American Folksong Style by Abrahams & Foss,
1968, $2.93 (ends Mar-21-05 16:10:03 PST)        4535924606 - Larry Gorman: The Man Who Made the Songs by Ives, 1993,
$3.99 (ends Mar-21-05 18:17:32 PST)        6951750759 - Folk Songs of American Negro by Work, 1907, $8.50
(ends Mar-22-05 00:12:32 PST)        4710683873 - American Folklore Society Biliography, volume 4, jazz,
1954, $8.95 (ends Mar-22-05 11:13:27 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 05:25:13 EST
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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 14:20:45 EST
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To reply to Fred McCormick.Moses Asch, the genial creator and PresidEnt of Folkways, Inc . not long
before his death contributed all of his Folkways record masters to the Smithsonian
Institution  in Washington, DC. The Smithsonian has promised that none of the
reords will be allowed to go "out of print, but will always be available for
purchase in tape form.   You'll find a complete listing (including four of my
records made 50 years ago) at
< http://www folkways  si,edu/search >.I hope you'll find what you wanted.Sam

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Subject: ha-ha
From: Andy Rouse <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:27:50 +0100
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You might all enjoy this.My mother-in-law is a 75-year-old chain smoker who prefers lighters but
occasionally buys a box of matches. My band usually practices at the
in-laws, and a couple of weeks ago there was a box of Hungarian-made
matches on the table with a photograph of the Hungarian music educator
Zolt? Kod?y on the top, with the legend beneath, "Keep away from
children!"Cheers,
Andy

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:35:45 -0500
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At the risk of over-self-promotion, I'd like to point out that
Smithsonian will provide /either /custom cassettes or cuastom CDs of any
recordings in their inventory. And you can obtain any of these CDs from
CAMSCO Music (800/548-FOLK <3655>) for four bucks less than the $20 that
SF charges.dick greenhaus[unmask] wrote:>To reply to Fred McCormick.
>
>Moses Asch, the genial creator and PresidEnt of Folkways, Inc . not long
>before his death contributed all of his Folkways record masters to the Smithsonian
>Institution  in Washington, DC. The Smithsonian has promised that none of the
>reords will be allowed to go "out of print, but will always be available for
>purchase in tape form.   You'll find a complete listing (including four of my
>records made 50 years ago) at
>< http://www folkways  si,edu/search >.
>
>I hope you'll find what you wanted.
>
>Sam
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Roy Berkeley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 18:42:07 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Back in the 70s there was a young woman named Patricia Averill who used to
deliver papers at AFS meetings on that very topic...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Educational CyberPlayGround" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 10:46 PM
Subject: Question re: Camp Songs> Hi,
>
> Can anyone recommend someone who
> can be an expert on the subject of camp songs?
>
> There is a reporter on KQED who would like to know.
>
> Please send the info directly to me.
>
> thanks for any help,
>
>
> Karen Ellis
> Educational CyberPlayGround
>
> <>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
> The Educational CyberPlayGround
> http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/
>
> National Children's Folksong Repository
> http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/NCFR/
>
> Hot List of Schools Online and
> Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
> http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/
>
> 7 Hot Site Awards
> New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
> USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
> <>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
>

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Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Dan Goodman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:21:52 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(37 lines)


I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood FlowerI need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
"Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".I'm wondering if the song he has uses the word "lyder" as a perversion =
of "leader" (or possibly vice versa with etymology!), but I can find no
reliable proof.  Also, what is the earliest version of this song?  I =
only found the 1860 and 1920s versions--and none with an explanation of
why the "pale aronatus" reference was later replaced with the (less
logical) "leader".Any help is appreciated because I'M curious, too!My guess:  The word doesn't mean anything.  It was what one singer who
transmitted it thought he/she heard.--
Dan Goodman
Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Jon Bartlett <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 19:54:24 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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I knew it as 'amanita' but I suspect the whole song is full of such
mondegreens.
Jon Bartlett
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 7:21 PM
Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower> I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:
>
> Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
> From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
> Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
> I need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
> from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
> would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
> etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
> have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
> "Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
> red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
> dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"
>
> I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
> pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".
>
> I'm wondering if the song he has uses the word "lyder" as a perversion =
> of "leader" (or possibly vice versa with etymology!), but I can find no
> reliable proof.  Also, what is the earliest version of this song?  I =
> only found the 1860 and 1920s versions--and none with an explanation of
> why the "pale aronatus" reference was later replaced with the (less
> logical) "leader".
>
> Any help is appreciated because I'M curious, too!
>
> My guess:  The word doesn't mean anything.  It was what one singer who
> transmitted it thought he/she heard.
>
> --
> Dan Goodman
> Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
> Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
> Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
> All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
> John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.
>

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Jon Bartlett <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 20:07:07 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(49 lines)


Sorry - 'pale Amanita and Iris so blue'.Jon Bartlett----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 7:21 PM
Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower> I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:
>
> Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
> From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
> Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
> I need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
> from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
> would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
> etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
> have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
> "Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
> red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
> dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"
>
> I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
> pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".
>
> I'm wondering if the song he has uses the word "lyder" as a perversion =
> of "leader" (or possibly vice versa with etymology!), but I can find no
> reliable proof.  Also, what is the earliest version of this song?  I =
> only found the 1860 and 1920s versions--and none with an explanation of
> why the "pale aronatus" reference was later replaced with the (less
> logical) "leader".
>
> Any help is appreciated because I'M curious, too!
>
> My guess:  The word doesn't mean anything.  It was what one singer who
> transmitted it thought he/she heard.
>
> --
> Dan Goodman
> Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
> Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
> Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
> All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
> John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.
>

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Sammy Rich <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:11:13 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(60 lines)


Pale amanita and eye-slip so blue is they way I was taght it.SRich
>
> From: Jon Bartlett <[unmask]>
> Date: 2005/03/16 Wed PM 11:07:07 EST
> To: [unmask]
> Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
> Sorry - 'pale Amanita and Iris so blue'.
>
> Jon Bartlett
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
> To: <[unmask]>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 7:21 PM
> Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
>
> > I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:
> >
> > Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
> > From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
> > Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
> >
> > I need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
> > from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
> > would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
> > etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
> > have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
> > "Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
> > red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
> > dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"
> >
> > I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
> > pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".
> >
> > I'm wondering if the song he has uses the word "lyder" as a perversion =
> > of "leader" (or possibly vice versa with etymology!), but I can find no
> > reliable proof.  Also, what is the earliest version of this song?  I =
> > only found the 1860 and 1920s versions--and none with an explanation of
> > why the "pale aronatus" reference was later replaced with the (less
> > logical) "leader".
> >
> > Any help is appreciated because I'M curious, too!
> >
> > My guess:  The word doesn't mean anything.  It was what one singer who
> > transmitted it thought he/she heard.
> >
> > --
> > Dan Goodman
> > Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
> > Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
> > Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
> > All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
> > John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.
> >
>

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:15:40 EST
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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Malcolm Douglas <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 05:43:08 -0000
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: 17 March 2005 03:21
Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower> I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:
>
> Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
> From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
> Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
> I need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
> from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
> would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
> etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
> have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
> "Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
> red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
> dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"
>
> I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
> pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".------------The 1860 "version" appears to be the original song, "I'll twine 'mid the ringlets", written by Maud
Irving and J P  Webster. A mutation of "pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue" into "pale and the
leader and eyes look like blue" wouldn't be very surprising or unusual, particularly as so few
people are likely to know what "aronatus" is.I expect that some poking around in indexes would provide publication details.Re Heather's comment on amanita, I gather that the impressive effects described by Graves are more
usually experienced as nausea and vomiting. Gunther Grass (I think) mentioned a technique that I
believe I've heard of elsewhere, which involved first processing the fungi through a horse in order
to remove the toxins while leaving the active ingredients intact. There may be some sort of analogy
involving folk music to be had there.Malcolm

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Subject: Re: ha-ha
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:18:38 -0800
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Andy:Now if you hjad said it was a picture of Bela Bartok  holding the third book of "Microkosmos" I would have beliueved you.  But Kodaly, composer of the genial  "Hary Janos"?  Never.Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Rouse <[unmask]>
Date: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 12:27 pm
Subject: ha-ha> You might all enjoy this.
> 
> My mother-in-law is a 75-year-old chain smoker who prefers lighters 
> butoccasionally buys a box of matches. My band usually practices at 
> thein-laws, and a couple of weeks ago there was a box of Hungarian-
> madematches on the table with a photograph of the Hungarian music 
> educatorZolt? Kod?y on the top, with the legend beneath, "Keep 
> away from
> children!"
> 
> Cheers,
> Andy
>

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Subject: Mushrooms
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:25:10 -0800
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Heather wrote:  "Amanita is a toadstool. Amanita Muscaria is the red-with-white-spots one eaten by Bacchus and his maenads, per Robert Graves' White Goddess, p. 45: "[it] gives them enormous muscular strength, erotic power, delirious visions, and the gift of prophecy."Which prompts me to ask, where do I buy this toadstool?Ed

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 01:37:18 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Sammy Rich" <[unmask]><<Pale amanita and eye-slip so blue is they way I was taght it.>>Unfortunately, "amanita" is a family of mushrooms, mostly poisonous, hardly
an attractive image. They are, however, pale.I've always heard it as "amelita", a word which is not in my dictionary.
Neither is "eye-slip", but "Islip" is a town in New York. Still doesn't fit
too well.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: ha-ha
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Subject: Re: Mushrooms
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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
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Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 05:12:26 -0800
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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: "Cohen, Ronald" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:27:57 -0500
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Here are some suggestions. Some of the songs in Marcia and Jon Pankake, A PRARIE HOME COMPANION FOLK SONG BOOK might be in the realm of camp songs. More to the point, the Cooperative Recreation Service issued a number of songbooks designed for children, at camp or otherwise. It was organized by Lynn Rohrbough in 1930, and published over 600 songbooks. A diss. was written by Larry Holcomb in 1972 at the Univ. of Michigan, "A History of the Cooperative Recreation Service." It includes a listing of the songbooks, many published for specific organizations. There are many camp songbooks, religious and otherwise. Ronald CohenSubject:        Question re: Camp SongsHi,Can anyone recommend someone who
can be an expert on the subject of camp songs?There is a reporter on KQED who would like to know.Please send the info directly to me.thanks for any help,Karen Ellis
Educational CyberPlayGround<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
The Educational CyberPlayGround
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/National Children's Folksong Repository
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/NCFR/Hot List of Schools Online and
Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/7 Hot Site Awards
New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:48:22 -0500
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Sing Out 3 p3 has 'Pale emanita and eyes look like blue'
Silverman various pub. has 'Pale emanita and eyslip so blue'
Henry (Beech Mountain) has 'Pale Emneta with eyes of dark blue'
Brown (North carolina Folklore) has 'Pale Armeta with eyes of dark blue'
I have a vague recollection of 'Pale Carmelita with eyes of pale blue'
possibly Baez.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:53:04 -0500
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I just Googled 'emanita' and apart from Emanita being a female Spanish
Christian name it threw out this whole speculation on a multiplicity of
sites.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Cal Lani Lani Herrmann <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:25:17 -0800
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On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 09:27:57AM -0500, Cohen, Ronald wrote:
> Here are some suggestions. Some of the songs in Marcia and Jon Pankake, A PRARIE HOME COMPANION FOLK SONG BOOK might be in the realm of camp songs. More to the point, the Cooperative Recreation Service issued a number of songbooks designed for children, at camp or otherwise. It was organized by Lynn Rohrbough in 1930, and published over 600 songbooks. A diss. was written by Larry Holcomb in 1972 at the Univ. of Michigan, "A History of the Cooperative Recreation Service." It includes a listing of the songbooks, many published for specific organizations. There are many camp songbooks, religious and otherwise. Ronald Cohen
>
I have added in past discussions that The Coop Rec Service was
sold by the Rohrbaughs and now resides in Burnsville NC as World
Around Songs.  Last time I looked (last year) they still have a
website, worldaroundsongs.com, and are in basically the same
business, selling inexpensive pocket-sized books of songs (many
of them 'folk') as well as producing custom collections for
affinity groups such as schools and church clubs.  Thanks for
the added info and for the added encouragement to me for making
a list.  I think Lynn Wolz at Indiana initiated the last exchange
a year or so ago.  -- Aloha, Lani<||> Lani Herrmann * [unmask] (or: [unmask])
<||> 5621 Sierra Ave. * Richmond, CA 94805 * (510) 237-7360

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:26:16 -0500
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Somewhere in Kentucky, I heard it sung "...pale esmeralita.."
dick greenhaus
Paul Stamler wrote:>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Sammy Rich" <[unmask]>
>
><<Pale amanita and eye-slip so blue is they way I was taght it.>>
>
>Unfortunately, "amanita" is a family of mushrooms, mostly poisonous, hardly
>an attractive image. They are, however, pale.
>
>I've always heard it as "amelita", a word which is not in my dictionary.
>Neither is "eye-slip", but "Islip" is a town in New York. Still doesn't fit
>too well.
>
>Peace,
>Paul
>
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:46:14 -0600
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Hi folks:This is a very interesting and useful discussion, but may I remind folks
that the original poster was looking for someone who is an *expert* on camp
songs, to be interviewed by a television reporter doing a story on the
subject? So far I've seen lots of suggestions on where to find the songs,
but only one mention of someone who could be interviewed.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:53:04 EST
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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Mary Cliff <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 13:02:27 -0500
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Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]> writes:
> looking for someone who is an *expert* on camp
>songs, to be interviewed by a television reporter doing a story on the
>subject
I answered her directly, as others might have.Mary Cliff, TRADITIONS
WETA Radio

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Kathy Kaiser <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:42:23 -0600
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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: scott utley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 18 Mar 2005 08:41:32 -0500
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Subject: Blue Grass Roy
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 19 Mar 2005 07:07:29 EST
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Subject: Ebay List - 03/19/05 (Songsters)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 19 Mar 2005 22:09:45 -0500
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Hi!        It looks like 3 separate lists this week - songsters tonight,
general folklore tomorrow night and ballads/songs on Monday night.        SONGSTERS        6951857788 - The Comic Songster, 1880?, $9.99 (ends Mar-20-05
17:51:24 PST)        7308456308 - BROWN & LYN'S CIRCUS & COLORED MINSTRELS SONGSTER,
1928, $9 (ends Mar-22-05 18:47:55 PST)        6951971226 - Martha Washington Temperance Songster, $14.99 (ends
Mar-23-05 14:59:45 PST)        3965433224 - Gorton's Original New Orleans Minstrels And Gold
Band Songster, 1880?, $9.99 (ends Mar-25-05 14:38:28 PST)        6951752636 - Rough and Ready Songster, 1848, 500 GBP (ends
Mar-25-05 15:15:00 PST)        3965403421 - Bonnie Runnell's Great Barnum and London Circus
Dutch Burlesque Clown Songster, 1882, $9 (ends Mar-28-05 17:42:00 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Folklore Ebay List - 03/20/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 20 Mar 2005 20:50:52 -0500
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Hi!        As promised, here is list #2 - folklore books & journals.        4535893122 - Folklore on the American Land by Emrich, 1972, $6.50
(ends Mar-21-05 15:55:20 PST)        4535895752 - Like We Say Back Home by Syatt, 1990, $2.93 (ends
Mar-21-05 16:10:55 PST)        4535899334 - The Science of Folklore by Krappe, 1964, $3.93 (ends
Mar-21-05 16:28:20 PST)        4535899393 - A Guide for Field Workers in Folklore by Goldstein,
1964, $2.93 (ends Mar-21-05 16:28:40 PST)        4536129488 - An Ornery Bunch, 1999, $2.99 (ends Mar-22-05 14:59:05
PST)        6951494205 - HUMANIORA by Hand, 1960, $24.95 (ends Mar-13-05
10:45:48 PST)        5176047486 - The Australian Yarns Legends Ballads by Wannan, 1979,
$2 AU (ends Mar-24-05 04:41:38 PST)        4536462472 - Folklore of Canada by Fowke, 1976, $9.99 (ends
Mar-24-05 06:14:58 PST)        4536489923 - Stiff As a Poker: A Collection of Ozark Folk Tales by
Randolph, 1993, $6.50 (ends Mar-24-05 08:14:48 PST)        4535803776 - YORKSHIRE TALES AND LEGENDS by Scott, 1990, 0.99 GBP
(ends Mar-24-05 10:26:22 PST)        4536632306 - Ozark Magic and Folklore by Randolph, 1964 Dover
edition, $7 (ends Mar-24-05 16:42:26 PST)        6952184378 - LORE OF FAITH & FOLLY by Cheney, Fife & Brooks, $5
(ends Mar-24-05 20:46:54 PST)        4537068046 - PISSING IN THE SNOW-AND OTHER OZARK FOLKTALES by
Randolph, 1977, $3.99 (ends Mar-26-05 13:47:48 PST)        6952402985 - California Folklore Quarterly, 16 issues, 1941-44,
$9.95 (ends Mar-26-05 14:14:15 PST)        4533761299 - The Talking Turtle and other Ozark Folk Tales by
Randolph, 1957, $4 (ends Apr-05-05 16:06:47 PDT)        4534739334 - Folk Culture on St. Helena Island South Carolina by
Johnson, 1968, $45 (ends Jul-08-05 09:53:48 PDT)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: earworms
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 21 Mar 2005 09:19:45 EST
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 Can't Get It Out of My Head Mar 20, 2005 2:51 pm US/Eastern
Have you ever had one of those days when you can’t get a song out of your 
head? What part of the brain controls this and can we use this to our advantage? 
Researchers at Dartmouth decided to take a look and write about it in the 
journal Nature. They looked at spontaneous forms of sound imagery that occur in 
everyday life. In the study, participants’ brains were monitored while they 
listened to excerpts from familiar and unfamiliar songs. Sections of music were 
removed at different points during the soundtracks and replaced with silent 
gaps. The researchers found that gaps in familiar songs led to more neural 
activity in parts of the brain that control the way we hear things. The area hit is 
called the primary auditory cortex. Knowing what parts of the brain are 
affected may lead researchers to figure out the way we remember things and aid with 
learning. 

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/22/05 (Songbooks, etc.)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 22 Mar 2005 22:08:24 -0500
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Hi!        Here is the list of songbooks and related miscellaneous items.
It includes a couple of biographies/autobiographies which I could have
put in the general folklore. Any opinions?        MISCELLANEOUS        4711698697 - smoky mountain ballads, 5 78 records, $48 (ends
Mar-23-05 17:59:59 PST)        6951909727 - English Folk Dance & Song, 7 issues, 1950-62, 4.99
GBP (ends Mar-26-05 07:00:54 PST)        4536243038 - Folk Music Journal, EFDSS, 1974, 2.99 GBP (ends
Mar-26-05 07:01:11 PST)        4536255829 - Essex Review, 1955, 1.99 GBP (ends Mar-26-05 08:11:34
PST)        7309293771 - Gentleman's Magazine, April 1739, $65 (ends Mar-26-05
10:19:33 PST)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        4536649098 - Folksingers & Folksongs of America by Lawless, $1.25
(ends Mar-24-05 17:51:22 PST)        7308956662 - A Catalogue of an Unique collection of Ancient English
Broadside Ballads printed entirely in the Black Letter, 1856, $22 (ends
Mar-24-05 18:46:29 PST)        4536693890 - Old-Time Songs and Poetry of Newfoundland by Doyle,
1966 edition, $29.95 (ends Mar-24-05 21:03:30 PST)        4536845484 - Bush Ballads of Australia, 1985, $15 (ends Mar-25-05
13:36:28 PST)        4537407735 - Lithuanian Folksongs in America by Balys, 1958,
$24.95 (ends Mar-25-05 21:51:35 PST)        4712540567 - Fifty Folk Songs by Sharp, 1 GBP (ends Mar-26-05
07:59:59 PST)        4537069668 - Norwegian Emigrant Songs and Ballads by Blegen & Ruud,
1979 reprint, $9.99 (ends Mar-26-05 13:56:45 PST)        4537097314 - Songs of Miramichi by Manny & Wilson, 1968, $12.99
(ends Mar-26-05 16:54:06 PST)        4537109062 - HELEN CREIGHTON: A LIFE IN FOLKLORE by Creighton,
1975, $9.99 (ends Mar-26-05 18:10:10 PST)        4537162217 - FANNIE HARDY ECKSTORM. A DESCRIPTIVE BIBLIOGRAPHy by
Whitten, 1975, $6 (ends Mar-27-05 03:49:19 PST)        4537842771 - Living Country Blues by Oster, 1969, $19.99 (ends
Mar-27-05 06:06:56 PST)        6952476215 - Ballads & Songs Of Lancashire by Harland, 1882, 9.99
GBP (ends Mar-27-05 06:29:57 PST)        7502224516 - BASCOM LAMAR LUNSFORD Minstrel of the Appalachians,
1966, $8.99 (ends Mar-27-05 10:11:12 PST)        4537302483 - First Book of Irish Ballads by O'Keefe, 1955, $9 (ends
Mar-27-05 14:38:09 PST)        4537351874 - 2 books (Folk Songs and Singing Games of the Ilinois
Ozarks by McIntosh, 1974 and Southern Folk Ballads by McNeil, 1987, $1.99
(ends Mar-27-05 17:43:48 PST)        7309676171 - WALTER PETERSON MOUNTAIN BALLADS and OLD TIME SONGS,
1927, $12.99 (ends Mar-27-05 19:15:13 PST)        7308967949 - Sea Songs & Shanties by Whall, 1974 reprint, $0.99
(ends Mar-27-05 19:21:25 PST)        7310032888 - SONGS OF THE SAILOR AND LUMBERMAN by Doerflinger,
1972 edition, $14.95 (ends Mar-28-05 12:52:10 PST)        7310110857 - REILLY'S DAUGHTER, 1968, $6.95 (ends Mar-28-05 15:31:35
PST)        7310113024 - SONGS SUNG IN SUFFOLK by Howson, 1992, $19.95 (ends
Mar-28-05 15:43:48 PST)        7502912122 - Folk Songs of the Caribbean by Morse, $1.99 (ends
Mar-28-05 23:08:46 PST)        4537561686 - Pennsylvania Songs and Legends by Korson, 1949, $1.99
(ends Mar-29-05 08:45:00 PST)        7310268183 - 2 books of cowboy songs (The Happy Cowboy & Songs of
the Roaming Range), 1934-5, $7 (ends Mar-29-05 10:33:42 PST)        4537010219 - Early To Rise: A Sussex Boyhood by Copper, 1976, 4.99
GBP (ends Mar-29-05 14:00:00 PST)        6952402976 - Legend of the Blind Beggar's Daughter of Bednal-Green
by Vale, 1933, 4.99 GBP (ends Mar-29-05 14:14:11 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 25 Mar 2005 14:01:04 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(15 lines)


Hello everyone,For those interested in such things, here are two _Merry Muses of
Caledonia_ one is an openly (?) printed edition from 1905 (6.6MB)
and the other is a complete copy of the infamous "1827" edition
(4.6MB).http://immortalia.com/1905-the-merry-muses-waverly-company.ziphttp://immortalia.com/1872-merry-muses-complete.zipEnjoy.John Mehlberg

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Subject: Re: My order
From: Thomas Stern <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 25 Mar 2005 17:37:48 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hello David Kleiman,
  Still have not received my order!
  Please let me know what is going on.
Thomas Stern.----- Original Message -----
From: "David Kleiman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 12:08 PM
Subject: Re: My orderDear Ballad Fellows,We cannot (and will not) normally (some do slip through) answer support and
ordering messages received through public forums.  I don't get to check the
Ballad-L that frequently and the staff do not have Ballad-L accounts.  Also,
I assume that those of you ordering do not want to broadcast your credit
card info to a public list-serve.Please make sure that support and/or ordering queries intended for Heritage
Muse, ESPB Publishing, or me are emailed directly to one of the following:[unmask]
[unmask]
[unmask]Thank you all.David M. Kleiman
President & CEO
Heritage Muse, Inc. & ESPB Publishing, Ltd.

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 25 Mar 2005 19:05:42 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(26 lines)


Thanx much, John
dick greenhausJohn Mehlberg wrote:>Hello everyone,
>
>For those interested in such things, here are two _Merry Muses of
>Caledonia_ one is an openly (?) printed edition from 1905 (6.6MB)
>and the other is a complete copy of the infamous "1827" edition
>(4.6MB).
>
>http://immortalia.com/1905-the-merry-muses-waverly-company.zip
>
>http://immortalia.com/1872-merry-muses-complete.zip
>
>
>Enjoy.
>
>John Mehlberg
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: My order
From: Mike Luster <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 25 Mar 2005 19:23:09 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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David,Perhaps you could post a general statement on the English and Scottish Popular Ballads electronic edition and its current status. I've been waiting myself since October 2003.
--
Mike Luster
KEDM FM
611A Roselawn Ave.
Monroe, LA  71201Creole Statement/AmericanaRama
airs Saturdays 7-11PM CST
archived programs available at:
http://kedm.org/creolestatement/real.htm
http://kedm.org/americanarama/real.htm
KEDM.org
[unmask]
318-342-5565 studio line
318-324-1665 voice or fax"The music choices and opinions on these programs are my own and not those of KEDM, its management, or the University of Louisiana at Monroe."

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/26/05 (Songsters)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 15:41:38 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(38 lines)


Hi!        Time for my weekly interruption of agoing threads (although
there doesn't seem to be much this week). The folklore list will follow
later today and the ballads/songs list tomorrow.        6520223266 - The Popular Songster, 1869, $16.50 (ends Mar-27-05
15:58:49 PST)        6952584917 - The Grant Songster, For the Campaign of 1868, $9.99
(ends Mar-27-05 16:55:48 PST)        7143751155 - Merchant's Gargling Oil Songsters, 1888, $7.99
(ends Mar-27-05 20:12:48 PST)        6164947283 - MERCHANTS GARGLING OIL Songster, 1890, $5 (ends
Mar-28-05 11:28:39 PST)        3966365329 - Great Circus Songster, 1899, $19.99 (ends Mar-28-05
18:51:57 PST)        7310234876 - The Prohibition Songster, 1885, $6 (ends Mar-29-05
07:48:07 PST)        6165453261 - 2 booklets inc. The Funny Clown Songster, 1893,
$4.95 (ends Mar-30-05 04:03:34 PST)        7310530612 - Cole & Lockwood All New United Shows 1894 Up To
Date Songster, 1894, $11.50 (ends Mar-30-05 13:01:06 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 16:22:29 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hi, I have a Panther paperback 1970 by Barke and Smith.
Does anyone know if there is anything interesting in the originals
mentioned that isn't in the paperback?
Twill save me much searching possibly to come up with nothing.
Thanks.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 14:00:06 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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Steve:I'm no help.  I have the original hardcover, but not the Panther reprint.  However, I would guess they are one and the same in contents.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Date: Saturday, March 26, 2005 1:22 pm
Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs> Hi, I have a Panther paperback 1970 by Barke and Smith.
> Does anyone know if there is anything interesting in the originals
> mentioned that isn't in the paperback?
> Twill save me much searching possibly to come up with nothing.
> Thanks.
> SteveG
>

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 16:29:31 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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Dear Steve,All _Merry Muses of Caledonia_ have differing content (see
Legman's 1964 _Merry Muses_).   The Barke & Smith edition
contains songs not found in the 1st edition (two known copies).Legman's 1964 version of _The Merry Muses_ is a type-facsimille
of the one, then known, copy of the 1st edition and there is G.
Ross Roy's 2000 photo-facsimille edition from the later
discovered copy of the 1st edition.   Legman's bibliography of
the various editions and his listing of the songs which are added
& removed is important and Legman's addition of the Cunningham
manuscript is also important.   So everyone should own a copy of
Legman's _Merry Muses of Caledonia_.I don't have time to OCR the various _Merry Muses_ in my
collection.  But if anyone wants to work on them, please feel
free as the PDFs on my website contain 600DPI black & white page
images.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
My, mostly traditional, bawdy songs, toasts and recitations
website: www.immortalia.com----- Original Message -----
From: "edward cray" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 4:00 PM
Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFsSteve:I'm no help.  I have the original hardcover, but not the Panther
reprint.  However, I would guess they are one and the same in
contents.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Date: Saturday, March 26, 2005 1:22 pm
Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs> Hi, I have a Panther paperback 1970 by Barke and Smith.
> Does anyone know if there is anything interesting in the
> originals
> mentioned that isn't in the paperback?
> Twill save me much searching possibly to come up with nothing.
> Thanks.
> SteveG
>

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Subject: Folklore Ebay List - 03/26/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 19:47:24 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(52 lines)


Hi!        Ok - here is the second installment. :-) See you tomorrow!        6521224383 - American Gas Station : History and Folklore of Gas
Stations in America by Witzel, $24.95 (ends Mar-27-05 11:31:04 PST)        4537633992 - Discovering The Folklore of Plants by Baker, 1975,
1.50 GBP (ends Mar-28-05 11:44:32 PST)        4538353840 - Myths and Folk-Lore of Ireland by Curtin, 1975, $5
(ends Mar-29-05 06:37:25 PST)        4537862816 - The Golden Log, Texas Folklore Society, 1962, $3.99
(ends Mar-29-05 07:54:38 PST)        4537982984 - Stiff As A Poker by Randolph, 1993 edition, $8.99
(ends Mar-29-05 17:27:29 PST)        4538340337 - Body, Boots & Britches by Thompson, 1940 edition,
$7.95 (ends Mar-31-05 04:57:32 PST)        4537682521 - PREHISTORIC MONUMENTS OF GUERNSEY AND ASSOCIATED
FOLKLORE by Cox, 1982, 2.99 GBP (ends Mar-31-05 13:02:42 PST)        7964259134 - The Classic Fairy Tales by Opie, 1994, $7.99 (ends
Apr-01-05 10:01:23 PST)        4538725101 - The Spirit of Folk Art by Glassie, 1989, $5.95 (ends
Apr-01-05 16:17:59 PST)        4538842497 - Listen For A Lonesome Drum by Carmer, 1936, $8 (ends
Apr-02-05 05:04:44 PST)        3967178417 - Stars Fell on Alabama by Carmer, 1934, $19.99 (ends
Apr-02-05 07:53:44 PST)        4538424584 - the Folklore of Somerset by Palmer, 1976, 4.99 GBP
(ends Apr-03-05 12:35:53 PDT)        4538466406 - YORKSHIRE TALES AND LEGENDS by Scott, 1990, 0.99 GBP
(ends Apr-03-05 15:09:04 PDT)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 27 Mar 2005 15:29:59 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Thanks, John, Ed,
The simplest answer must be to start by comparing lists of contents.
SteveG

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Subject: FW: LISTSERV Unavailable Wednesday, March 30th, 5-9pm
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 28 Mar 2005 15:53:10 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Just want to let you know that the list will be unavalable on Wednesday, March 30th, from five P.M. to nine P.M.Peace.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: LSTMAINT 
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 3:10 PM
To: [unmask]
Subject: LISTSERV Unavailable Wednesday, March 30th, 5-9pmDO NOT REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE.  Please direct your responses/queries to
[unmask]LISTSERV will be unavailable Wednesday, March 30th, 5-9pm for an upgrade
to version 14.3. The web management page will also be unavailable during
this time.  For information about some of the new features please see
this Knowledge Base article, http://kb.indiana.edu/data/aqqg.html.During the upgrade, messages to lists will be spooled on the mail relay
machines and they will be delivered once the service comes back online.Thank you,IU LISTSERV Administration
UITS Messaging Team
Indiana University

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/28/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 28 Mar 2005 18:53:58 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(90 lines)


Hi!        Here is the 3rd installment for this week. :-) See you in few
days.        MISCELLANEOUS        4714217964 - A Treasury of Field Recordings, volume 1, LP, 1962,
$6.99 (ends Mar-31-05 16:33:19 PST)        5568490537 - AMERICANA ILLUSTRATED, magazine, Oct. 1940, $9.50
(ends Apr-03-05 18:11:43 PDT)        6953745764 - EIGHTEENTH-CENTURY IRELAND, journal, 1989, $24.99
(ends Apr-03-05 20:26:06 PDT)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        7310331217 - Lonesome Tunes Folk Songs From the Kentucky Mountains
by Wyman, 1944, $12 (ends Mar-29-05 14:47:26 PST)        6953121798 - Folk singers and Folksongs in America by Lawless,
1960, $9.95 (ends Mar-30-05 07:36:42 PST)        7310487144 - Carson J Robison's Folio of Hill Country Songs and
Ballads, 1928, $4.99 (ends Mar-30-05 10:08:33 PST)        6953167791 - English Songs and Ballads by Crosland, 1927, 0.99 GBP
(ends Mar-30-05 13:17:16 PST)        6953174407 - SOUTH CAROLINA BALLADS by Smith, 1928, $85 (ends
Mar-30-05 14:10:01 PST)        4538464427 - Folk Songs of Canada by Fowke, 1970, $5 (ends
Mar-31-05 14:00:18 PST)        7310773140 - The Jolly Herring, 3.99 GBP (ends Mar-31-05 14:15:59
PST)        4538540351 - The Erotic Muse by Cray, 1992 edition, $9.99 (ends
Mar-31-05 20:23:19 PST)        4538635174 - SONGS OF IRELAND, 1910?, $15 (ends Apr-01-05 09:00:04
PST)        4538635444 - SONGS OF THE GAEL by Breathnach, 1915, $19 (ends
Apr-01-05 09:00:45 PST)        6953408951 - ENGLISH FOLK SONGS FROM SOUTHERN APPALACHIANS by
Sharp, 2 volumes in 1, 1960, $49 (ends Apr-01-05 09:37:50 PST)        7310997086 - Songs of Work and Freedom by Fowke & Glazer, 1960,
$9.99 (ends Apr-01-05 14:36:58 PST)        7311028825 - Irish Street Ballads by Lochlainn, 1960, $5 (ends
Apr-01-05 18:16:07 PST)        7311225932 - The Vauxhall Comic Song - Book, 1850?, $9.99 (ends
Apr-02-05 19:15:13 PST)        7311256107 - Real Sailor Songs by Ashton, 1973 reprint, 12.99 GBP
(ends Apr-03-05 01:53:51 PST)        7311323873 - Folk Songs of Massachusetts by Whitefield, 1948,
$1.59 (ends Apr-03-05 10:49:07 PDT)        4538403416 - Folk Songs of the Americas by Lloyd, 1966, 5.69 GBP
(ends Apr-03-05 11:09:25 PDT)        4538406283 - A Ballad History of England by Palmer, 1979, 3.50
GBP (ends Apr-03-05 11:22:19 PDT)        4538443504 - EVERYMAN'S BOOK OF SEA SONGS by Baker & Miall, 1982,
4.99 GBP (ends Apr-03-05 13:45:37 PDT)        6953829609 - Robin Hood. A Collection of All the Ancient Poems,
Songs and Ballads by Ritson, 2 volumes, 1887 edition, 8 GBP (ends
Apr-04-05 12:14:47 PDT)        6953449929 - English Folk-song Some Conclusions by Sharp, 1907,
2.99 GBP (ends Apr-04-05 16:34:44 PDT)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Blue Grass Roy
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:24:51 EST
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Subject: Eddie Lenihan on Radio 4
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:37:32 EST
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Subject: Eddie Lenihan on Radio 4
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 05:10:27 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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I shared a performance once with Eddie at a storytelling festival in Milton
Keynes - he blew me off the stage. Also, he successfully championed the
non-removal of a bush on the grounds that it was a known stop-over place
for the Wee Folk on their journeys.
Highly recommended.Ewan McVicar

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Subject: Re: Eddie Lenihan on Radio 4
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 06:07:08 EST
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Subject: Re: Eddie Lenihan on Radio 4
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 06:49:54 -0500
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My lack of clarity, Fred.The gig was in MK, the bush is in the midst of Ireland - well, I recall
reading recently someone burned it down! Are fairies known to be careless
with matches?Ewan McVicar

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Subject: It beggars belief
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 07:49:30 EST
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Subject: Re: Blue Grass Roy
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 08:01:29 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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Fred:Ron is still a subscriber.  He may not be at home or picking up email.  I forwarded your message to him.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Date: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 1:24 am
Subject: Blue Grass Roy> A couple of weeks ago, I posted a message saying that someone on
> this list
> had asked me to copy an LP of Blue Grass Roy, and that I had lost
> the name and
> address of the person in question.
>
> Nobody has yet contacted me, but I had a sudden recollection
> yesterday that
> the person in question might be Ron Cohen.
>
> Does anybody know whether he still contributes to this list and, if
> not,does anybody know how I can get in touch with him ?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Fred McCormick.
>

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Subject: Re: Blue Grass Roy
From: "Cohen, Ronald" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 12:11:24 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Fred: Yes, I guess I did mention wanting a copy of Blue Grass Roy, sorry not to have responded before. I am at:Ronald Cohen
Dept. of History
Indiana University Northwest
Gary, IN 46408-1197
 
Thanks! ron> A couple of weeks ago, I posted a message saying that someone on this list had asked me to copy an LP of Blue Grass Roy, and that I had lost the name and address of the person in question.
>  
> Nobody has yet contacted me, but I had a sudden recollection yesterday that the person in question might be Ron Cohen.
>  
> Does anybody know whether he still contributes to this list and, if not, does anybody know how I can get in touch with him ?
>  
> Cheers,
>  
> Fred McCormick.
> 

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Subject: Re: Blue Grass Roy
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 12:27:47 EST
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Subject: Re: BALLAD-L Digest - 28 Feb 2005 (#2005-93): Earworms
From: Joe Fineman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 08:25:14 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Automatic digest processor <[unmask]>, in the
person of Heather Wood, writes:> does anyone know how to get rid of an ear-worm (the tune that gets
> into your head and stays there)?
>
> I've got those dam' puffer-trains ...and it's a REALLY STUPID tuneDeliberately switch to a suitably edifying tune, such as that of a
hymn or patriotic anthem.  I generally use The Star-Spangled Banner.
--
---  Joe Fineman    [unmask]||:  Whatever you live is life.  :||

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Subject: Puffer Billies
From: Lydia Fish <[unmask]>
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Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:38:34 EST
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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:49:46 -0500
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Yes I remember singing it in the fifties.
Just a guess but it sounds to me like the product of a 20s/30s children's
radio programme, something like 'Listen With Mother' British radio that is.Heather
Earworms can be very infectious, I'd watch out. Listening to the radio
about a year ago I caught part of foreign female singer singing a very
haunting song which was also familiar from my 50s childhood. Before I
eventually found out what it was I managed to infect 100s of my associates
and family with the annoying nagging desire to find out what the familiar
tune was. I eventually tracked it down. It was 'Coimbra'/ 'April in
Portugal' by Amalia Rodrigues that wonderful Fado singer, and I'm now a big
Fado fan.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Beth Brooks <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:50:35 -0500
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I read somewhere (I think our local newsrag) that the two best ways to
get rid of earworms is to play them on your instrument or share them
with someone else. I've subjected my husband to them over the years, and
it almost always goes away when I've given it to someone else.Beth Brooks>>Earworms can be very infectious, I'd watch out.

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
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Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 13:05:05 -0500
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Thanks, Beth,
It certainly helped me sharing the earworm, but I don't think it endeared
me to those on the receiving end.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Simon Furey <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 18:16:52 -0000
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I agree with Beth. My technique is simply to sing the damn thing. The
mistake is not to let it out, or it just runs round in your head forever.Another trick might be to try and play it on an instrument one is totally
incompetent with, always assuming you happen to have such an instrument
lying around, of course. Then you get one of three results: your brain gives
up, you learn an interesting instrument or your neighbours kill you. Anyone
for "Puffer-Billies" on, say, the Uillean Pipes? ;oDCheers
Simon-----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]] On
Behalf Of Beth Brooks
Sent: 01 March 2005 16:51
To: [unmask]
Subject: Re: PufferbilliesI read somewhere (I think our local newsrag) that the two best ways to
get rid of earworms is to play them on your instrument or share them
with someone else. I've subjected my husband to them over the years, and
it almost always goes away when I've given it to someone else.Beth Brooks>>Earworms can be very infectious, I'd watch out.__________ NOD32 1.1015 (20050301) Information __________This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
http://www.nod32.com

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Adam Miller <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:24:25 -0800
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Dear Simon,Wait until you hear the soon-to-be-released CD "Sam Hinton - Master of
the Diatonic Harmonica," which comes out on June 4th.Sam plays "Pufferbillies" on the ten-hole diatonic harmonica, as a
round, by himself.  It's pretty amazing and entertaining.The album contains over 120 songs and stories on two CDs: Folksongs,
reels, jigs, double jigs, gospel songs, fiddle tunes, Yiddish ditties,
hoedowns and hornpipes  And it's all solo harmonica.  Many people don't
know that Sam is the greatest living non-blues, first position solo
harmonica player.-Adam Miller
Woodside, CAOn Mar 1, 2005, at 10:16 AM, Simon Furey wrote:> I agree with Beth. My technique is simply to sing the damn thing. The
> mistake is not to let it out, or it just runs round in your head
> forever.
>
> Another trick might be to try and play it on an instrument one is
> totally
> incompetent with, always assuming you happen to have such an instrument
> lying around, of course. Then you get one of three results: your brain
> gives
> up, you learn an interesting instrument or your neighbours kill you.
> Anyone
> for "Puffer-Billies" on, say, the Uillean Pipes? ;oD
>
> Cheers
> Simon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]
> On
> Behalf Of Beth Brooks
> Sent: 01 March 2005 16:51
> To: [unmask]
> Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
>
> I read somewhere (I think our local newsrag) that the two best ways to
> get rid of earworms is to play them on your instrument or share them
> with someone else. I've subjected my husband to them over the years,
> and
> it almost always goes away when I've given it to someone else.
>
> Beth Brooks
>
>>> Earworms can be very infectious, I'd watch out.
>
>
> __________ NOD32 1.1015 (20050301) Information __________
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.nod32.com
>

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:16:48 -0500
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>Dear Simon,
>
>Wait until you hear the soon-to-be-released CD "Sam Hinton - Master of
>the Diatonic Harmonica," which comes out on June 4th.
>
>Sam plays "Pufferbillies" on the ten-hole diatonic harmonica, as a
>round, by himself.  It's pretty amazing and entertaining.
>
>The album contains over 120 songs and stories on two CDs: Folksongs,
>reels, jigs, double jigs, gospel songs, fiddle tunes, Yiddish ditties,
>hoedowns and hornpipes  And it's all solo harmonica.  Many people don't
>know that Sam is the greatest living non-blues, first position solo
>harmonica player.I recall an Eddie Condon obituary: "one of jazz's great left-handed
rhythm guitar players" (or something like that).Thanks for the heads-up.  I really look forward to Sam's CD.>-Adam Miller
>Woodside, CA
--
john garst    [unmask]

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Norm Cohen <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:31:42 -0800
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I saw Sam play harmonica (and other instruments) years ago several times.
He blew me away (so to speak)
Norm> >Dear Simon,
> >
> >Wait until you hear the soon-to-be-released CD "Sam Hinton - Master of
> >the Diatonic Harmonica," which comes out on June 4th.
> >
> >Sam plays "Pufferbillies" on the ten-hole diatonic harmonica, as a
> >round, by himself.  It's pretty amazing and entertaining.
> >
> >The album contains over 120 songs and stories on two CDs: Folksongs,
> >reels, jigs, double jigs, gospel songs, fiddle tunes, Yiddish ditties,
> >hoedowns and hornpipes  And it's all solo harmonica.  Many people don't
> >know that Sam is the greatest living non-blues, first position solo
> >harmonica player.
>
>

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:52:51 -0500
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>Does anyone know the history of Pufferbillies?  Is it an American song?
>  When did it first appear in print?
>...
>-Adam MillerHas anyone answered Adam's questions?Are far as I can tell, we have pushed it back to ca 1935 and had some
speculation that it was a '20s-'30s British song.John

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Subject: Ear-worms
From: Cal Lani Lani Herrmann <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:07:40 -0800
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Or another approach: blast it out of your head with
a worse (=more 'memorable,' invasive) one.  I find
that humming a few bars of, say, "Mairzy Doats" usually
works.  Of course, that leaves you with the dregs to
take care of -- Aloha, Lani<||> Lani Herrmann * [unmask] (or: [unmask])
<||> 5621 Sierra Ave. * Richmond, CA 94805 * (510) 237-7360

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Subject: Re: Ear-worms
From: [unmask]
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Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 23:07:38 EST
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In a message dated 03/01/05 3:07:59 PM, [unmask] writes:<<  Lani Herrmann * [unmask] (or: [unmask])
<||> 5621 Sierra Ave. * Richmond, CA 94805 * (510) 237-7360
 >>

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Subject: New cd out- Rayna Gellert & Susie Goehring
From: "Lisa - S. H." <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 2 Mar 2005 20:59:43 -0500
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Friends,
I am passing the word about the release of Rayna Gellert & Susie'
Goehring's CD, "Starch and Iron".  Rayna plays oldtime fiddle to Susie's
guitar, and they both sing some great oldtime songs and ballads.  There is
a nice mix between instrumental fiddle tunes and songs.
Rayna's fiddling is truly impressive (as always), and the two women do some
beautiful harmony singing together.   -Susie does a particularly delectable
solo a cappella ballad Addie Graham used to sing, called Sister Thou Art
Mild and Lovely (my personal most favorite track, Susie's voice being so
true and pure, both strong and gentle at the same time).  Here's the
website for the cd,  -there are several MP3 sample cuts you can listen to
there:
http://starchandiron.utopiandesign.com/
(Standard disclaimer: I don't profit from any of this, nor was I asked to
post anything..... I just happen to admire Susie Goehring to pieces and
have loved her music and her voice for years.)      ;)Lisa Johnson

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Subject: New? Kids folklore
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 2 Mar 2005 22:57:37 -0500
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Ballad-listers,        This is not really ballad related, but still folklore related.        I've noticed that recently the television station news
broadcasts in the Washington DC area have discovered kids' folklore --
at least on one particular vein.        They've recently (after our relatively late snows for the area)
interviewed some small kids -- probably 6-8 years old -- about what they
do to make sure that it snows and school is thus closed for the day.        The two which I have noticed mentioned are:1)      Go to bed with your pajamas inside-out.2)      Flush some ice cubes down the toilet.        At least one interviewee did both to be sure.        So -- I have two questions relating to this:1)      Are TV stations in other areas "discovering" this?2)      Are there any other kid's folk beliefs which I have not mentioned
        to cause snow?        Thanks,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:13:41 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
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Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:27:04 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
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Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:30:45 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
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Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:36:31 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
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Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:03:41 -0800
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Subject: Starch&Iron
From: Cliff Abrams <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:05:08 -0800
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Bought the CD while listening to MP3-- The Girl I left
Behind Me. Their site takes you right to PayPal, so by
the time the tune was done-- so was the order. Very
good stuff.C.

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Beth Brooks <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 08:41:36 -0500
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I've never heard of my elementary students doing anything of the sort,
but I know the teachers are inclined to do a "snow dance" the week
before Christmas break!The ritualistic/superstitious inverted pyjamas and ice cubes down the
toilet come, I suspect, from some child-centered mass media, either the
movie "Snow Day" (which I've not seen) or from some episode of a
cartoon, now that cartoons are available on demand at any hour of any
day.Beth Brooks
>>> [unmask] 03/03/05 8:03 AM >>>
I never heard anything like these when I was in grade school in the US
northeast (1950s). In fact, we didn't even have the term "snow day."
When the snow was bad enough, we had a "day off from school."
/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: Kids' folklore
From: Joe Fineman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 08:43:43 -0500
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Automatic digest processor <[unmask]>, in the
person of DoN. Nichols, writes:>         They've recently (after our relatively late snows for the area)
> interviewed some small kids -- probably 6-8 years old -- about what
> they do to make sure that it snows and school is thus closed for the
> day.I spent part of my childhood in southern California, where it would
have taken very strong magic to make that happen, and part in Vermont,
where it would have taken a hell of a lot of snow.  Presumably such
folklore is confined to a climatic belt in between; perhaps
folklorists will someday come up with a map of it.
--
---  Joe Fineman    [unmask]||:  It's not who you know, it's whom.  :||

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: "Lisa - S. H." <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 09:04:05 -0500
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Amusingly, my email filter put this message in the SPAM box along with the
Viagra offers, yet totally ignored all the "Lady from France" posts.   ;)
LisaAt 05:36 AM 3/3/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>Hether,
>
> >is "repubication" when you get your balls back?<
>
>I wouldn't know. I've never lost mine.
>
>Fred
>

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Clifford J OCHELTREE <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 10:13:04 -0600
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Grew up in Chicago during the 50s and early 60s. We used the term "snow
days" but never had them. Chalk it up to Mayor Daley keeping the streets
[and alleys] clear at all costs. The first time a "snow day" was
declared came shortly after his death as the political machine began to
come apart.Speaking of Chicago, are any of you familiar with Slim Brundage's
daughter Dorothy? She passed away several years ago but I'm interested
in contacting her children.

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 11:26:57 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Clifford J OCHELTREE" <[unmask]><<Grew up in Chicago during the 50s and early 60s. We used the term "snow
days" but never had them. Chalk it up to Mayor Daley keeping the streets
[and alleys] clear at all costs. The first time a "snow day" was
declared came shortly after his death as the political machine began to
come apart.>>Not quite; January of '67, when we got 21" of snow in about 12 hours,
managed to shut the city down. I stayed on the U of C campus to see Judy
Collins do a concert at Mandel Hall (there were about 50 of us in the
audience), and never made it home.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 12:55:10 -0500
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Isn't the wearing of clothing inside out supposed to give
some form of protection from the fairy world? I know I've
read that in several stories.
I grew up in southern Cal, Hawaii, and south Texas. I don't
know who did what form of dance but I remember one winter day
getting snow in Texas. Two inches (maybe) and all the schools
closed. I saved some for my Dad who grew up in Worcester,
Mass. He was not terribly impressed.
Kathleen---- Original message ----
>Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:03:41 -0800
>From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
>Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
>To: [unmask]>   In my childhood, clothing (like socks or underwear)
>   inadvertently worn inside out was regarded as a
>   bringer of good luck - but it had to be done
>   inadvertently to work.

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 13:46:23 -0500
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On 2005/03/03 at 12:55:10PM -0500, [unmask] wrote:> Isn't the wearing of clothing inside out supposed to give
> some form of protection from the fairy world? I know I've
> read that in several stories.        That sounds like a reasonable origin for that part, at least.
And ice cubes down the toilet would be "sympathetic magic".> I grew up in southern Cal, Hawaii, and south Texas. I don't
> know who did what form of dance but I remember one winter day
> getting snow in Texas.        Hmm ... What part of South Texas?  I was in a town called
Cotulla -- about two thirds of the way from San Antonio to Laredo on
Highway 81.>                        Two inches (maybe) and all the schools
> closed.        And I remember once getting perhaps 1/4" to 1/2" of snow, and
they closed the schools for *two* days.  Someone had told them that it
was dangerous to drive on that stuff.  I remember that I had an Army
surplus pup tent set up, and the appearance of the snow on the ground
just outside the tent's entrance.  At a guess, this would have been
about 1952 or so.>         I saved some for my Dad who grew up in Worcester,
> Mass. He was not terribly impressed.        Nor would mine have been impressed, as he grew up in Boston
Mass.  But he was not there to see it, as I was living with my
grandparents because of rather severe asthma.        Enjoy,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 11:44:29 -0800
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Heather:Okay, I looked up this valuable resource, typed in "ballad" while searching _Gentleman's Magazine,_ got three hits including this from Vol. 5 (February, 1735), p. 93:"The scandalous practice of ballad singing is the bane of all good manners and morals, a nursery for idlers, whores and pickpockets, a School for Scandal, smut and debauchery and ought to be entirely suppressed, or reduced under p[roper restriction..."  There is more.  It is signed, ironically, "Democritis."Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Date: Thursday, March 3, 2005 2:27 am
Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication> In a message dated 3/3/2005 5:13:55 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> [unmask] writes:
> An unrivalled document of the cultural history of the era, the
> entire run of
> the magazine, 1731 to 1745,
> Interesting that the Internet Library of Early Journals at
> http://www.bodley.ox.ac.uk/ilej/ lists Gentleman's Magazine through
> 1750 (20 vols in all).
>
> For any who don't know this site, it holds the following journals
> (not all
> complete)
> Annual Register
> Blackwood's Edinburgh Magazine
> Gentleman's Magazine
> Notes and Queries
> Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society
> The Builder
>
> in pdf form. "Browse" is just an index of holdings, vols, issues.
> "Search" is
> somewhat unreliable--they haven't fully digitized the text. I have
> sometimesfound that the "next page" button will produce "File Not
> Found" -- way round
> this is to go to the last good page and manually type the required
> page number
> into the end of the URL. Also found that using Norton's Internet
> Securitysometimes prevents the images from displaying. Otherwise a
> great and useful
> website. Notes and Queries is particulary fab.
>
> Heather
>

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
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Subject: EAR-WORMS
From: [unmask]
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Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:07:00 EST
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So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the ear-worm
(although I don't believe he used that term)  about the handling of street-car
tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair"  which was seen as a poem
in a newspaper.  Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached a funeral
oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding their heads in
rhythm.  The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will kill me!"
to which the new widow, mistaking  the  cause of his agony, replied "Bless you
sir, for those kind words!"  Twain's advice, given after he had quoted the
entire  offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines, shun them as
you would the plague! "My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie,  was a country lawyer living in Beaumont,
Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and 'Dearie", his wife
and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's.  (We lived 700 miles
north of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.)  Dearie and Judge owned, among other
treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and reread) volumes,
and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."Sam Hinton
La Jolla, CAlifornia

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Subject: Vera Johnson
From: Andy Rouse <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 22:32:33 +0100
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I'd be grateful if anyone could supply the lyrics to Vera Johnson's
"Pierre Trudeau" song, especially if it was sent to [unmask]
within the next 14 hours! But anyhow!Andy

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:36:20 -0500
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>the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and reread) volumes,
>and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."
>
>Sam HintonWe hd it, and I recall it.John

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Norm Cohen <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 14:00:17 -0800
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Punch, brothers, punch,
Punch with care,
Punch in the presence of the passenjair.
A blue trip slip for a six cent fare,
A pink trip slip for a ten cent fare,
Punch brothers...  etc.
Is what echoes in my mind's ear.
Norm----- Original Message -----
From: <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:07 PM
Subject: EAR-WORMS> So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the
ear-worm
> (although I don't believe he used that term)  about the handling of
street-car
> tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair"  which was seen as a
poem
> in a newspaper.  Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached a
funeral
> oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding their
heads in
> rhythm.  The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will kill
me!"
> to which the new widow, mistaking  the  cause of his agony, replied "Bless
you
> sir, for those kind words!"  Twain's advice, given after he had quoted the
> entire  offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines, shun
them as
> you would the plague! "
>
> My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie,  was a country lawyer living in
Beaumont,
> Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and 'Dearie", his
wife
> and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's.  (We lived 700 miles
> north of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.)  Dearie and Judge owned, among other
> treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and
reread) volumes,
> and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."
>
> Sam Hinton
> La Jolla, CAlifornia
>

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:21:13 -0500
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>Punch, brothers, punch,
>Punch with care,
>Punch in the presence of the passenjair.
>A blue trip slip for a six cent fare,
>A pink trip slip for a ten cent fare,
>Punch brothers...  etc.
>Is what echoes in my mind's ear.
>NormI recallPunch, brothers, punch with care,
Punch in the presence of the passenjair....John

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Clifford J OCHELTREE <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:28:42 -0600
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True, I had forgotten. Unfortunately I was in a private HS by that time
and while the public schools were closed we were expected to attend class.Paul Stamler wrote:>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Clifford J OCHELTREE" <[unmask]>
>
><<Grew up in Chicago during the 50s and early 60s. We used the term "snow
>days" but never had them. Chalk it up to Mayor Daley keeping the streets
>[and alleys] clear at all costs. The first time a "snow day" was
>declared came shortly after his death as the political machine began to
>come apart.>>
>
>Not quite; January of '67, when we got 21" of snow in about 12 hours,
>managed to shut the city down. I stayed on the U of C campus to see Judy
>Collins do a concert at Mandel Hall (there were about 50 of us in the
>audience), and never made it home.
>
>Peace,
>Paul
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Clifford J OCHELTREE <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:30:58 -0600
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My only cousins were reared in Alaska. I recall asking them about "snow
days" and was advised that they did not have them. They were expected to
attend unless the temperature dropped below minus 50 degrees, no one
could be sure the busses would start![unmask] wrote:>Isn't the wearing of clothing inside out supposed to give
>some form of protection from the fairy world? I know I've
>read that in several stories.
>I grew up in southern Cal, Hawaii, and south Texas. I don't
>know who did what form of dance but I remember one winter day
>getting snow in Texas. Two inches (maybe) and all the schools
>closed. I saved some for my Dad who grew up in Worcester,
>Mass. He was not terribly impressed.
>Kathleen
>

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/03/05 (Songsters)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:23:12 -0500
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Hi!        No earworms to report at the moment but perhaps we can find some
bookworms instead. :-) The main list will follow tomorrow.        SONGSTERS        6949318768 - 5 songster, recitations, song and joke book, and
songster catalogue, 1905-10, $4.99 (ends Mar-04-05 11:17:59 PST)        3878147874 - Henshaw & Ten Broeck The Nabobs Songster, 1892,
$9.50 (ends Mar-06-05 14:46:17 PST)        3962112952 - The Gormans' Minstrels Musical Album, 1891-2, $75
(ends Mar-09-05 18:17:24 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine republication
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:39:39 -0500
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The ILEJ project is an excellent start, but it should be borne in mind that it includes only a small selection of Gentleman's Mag. and Notes & Queries:
GM ran from 1745 - 1868 (224 volumes), so ILEJ has only 10%
NQ started in 1849 and is still going, and heaven knows what volume number they're up to now. They're both excellent sources, and they include oodles of folklore material, but there's no avoiding the slog of reading most of them in the original.
The 15 vols (plus index) of GM on offer from Postscript are quality cloth bindings, but the reproduction of some of the pages is rather muddy, as some of the early originals were.
They take up a whole shelf and look really smart, but they ain't worth ?700.
Steve Roud--
Message sent with Supanet E-mail-----Original Message-----
From:     Heather Wood <[unmask]>
To:       [unmask]
Subject:  Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication> In a message dated 3/3/2005 5:13:55 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> [unmask] writes:
> An unrivalled document of the cultural history of the era, the entire run of
> the magazine, 1731 to 1745,
> Interesting that the Internet Library of Early Journals at
> http://www.bodley.ox.ac.uk/ilej/ lists Gentleman's Magazine through 1750 (20 vols in all).
>
> For any who don't know this site, it holds the following journals (not all
> complete)
> Annual Register
> Blackwood's Edinburgh Magazine
> Gentleman's Magazine
> Notes and Queries
> Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society
> The Builder
>
> in pdf form. "Browse" is just an index of holdings, vols, issues. "Search" is
> somewhat unreliable--they haven't fully digitized the text. I have sometimes
> found that the "next page" button will produce "File Not Found" -- way round
> this is to go to the last good page and manually type the required page number
> into the end of the URL. Also found that using Norton's Internet Security
> sometimes prevents the images from displaying. Otherwise a great and useful
> website. Notes and Queries is particulary fab.
>
> HeatherSignup to supanet at https://signup.supanet.com/cgi-bin/signup?_origin=sigwebmail

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 14:55:53 -0800
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 15:26:17 -0800
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 18:37:45 EST
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 15:48:58 -0800
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Mary Cliff <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 18:55:33 -0500
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A recent recording by Canada's James Gordon is entitled "Endomusia."
Here's a definition from the web:>endomusia
>silent recall of a melody; endomusia often appears as a type of obsessive
>thought [Psychiatric Dictionary, 4th ed., Hinsie and Campbell]
ear-worm, no?Mary Cliff, TRADITIONS
WETA Radio

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:36:05 -0800
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Jonathan:One of the smarter folks who subscribe to ballad-l translated the German word for this common irritation.Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Date: Thursday, March 3, 2005 3:26 pm
Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS> "Ear-worm" in this sense isn't in the OED.  Did somebody just
> invent it, or is there a neat story behind it?
>
> JL
>
> [unmask] wrote:
> So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the
> ear-worm
> (although I don't believe he used that term) about the handling of
> street-car
> tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair" which was seen
> as a poem
> in a newspaper. Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached
> a funeral
> oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding
> their heads in
> rhythm. The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will
> kill me!"
> to which the new widow, mistaking the cause of his agony, replied
> "Bless you
> sir, for those kind words!" Twain's advice, given after he had
> quoted the
> entire offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines,
> shun them as
> you would the plague! "
>
> My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie, was a country lawyer living in
> Beaumont,Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and
> 'Dearie", his wife
> and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's. (We lived 700
> milesnorth of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.) Dearie and Judge owned,
> among other
> treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red
> (and reread) volumes,
> and that's where I found the story about "Punch, Brothers."
>
> Sam Hinton
> La Jolla, CAlifornia
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday!
> Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web
>

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 20:58:37 -0500
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Or, to move it up into Sci-Fi of the mid 20th Century:
"Tenser," said the tensor
"Tenser," said the tensor
Tension apprehension and dissension have begun...Norm Cohen wrote:>Punch, brothers, punch,
>Punch with care,
>Punch in the presence of the passenjair.
>A blue trip slip for a six cent fare,
>A pink trip slip for a ten cent fare,
>Punch brothers...  etc.
>Is what echoes in my mind's ear.
>Norm
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <[unmask]>
>To: <[unmask]>
>Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:07 PM
>Subject: EAR-WORMS
>
>
>
>
>>So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the
>>
>>
>ear-worm
>
>
>>(although I don't believe he used that term)  about the handling of
>>
>>
>street-car
>
>
>>tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair"  which was seen as a
>>
>>
>poem
>
>
>>in a newspaper.  Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached a
>>
>>
>funeral
>
>
>>oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding their
>>
>>
>heads in
>
>
>>rhythm.  The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will kill
>>
>>
>me!"
>
>
>>to which the new widow, mistaking  the  cause of his agony, replied "Bless
>>
>>
>you
>
>
>>sir, for those kind words!"  Twain's advice, given after he had quoted the
>>entire  offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines, shun
>>
>>
>them as
>
>
>>you would the plague! "
>>
>>My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie,  was a country lawyer living in
>>
>>
>Beaumont,
>
>
>>Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and 'Dearie", his
>>
>>
>wife
>
>
>>and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's.  (We lived 700 miles
>>north of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.)  Dearie and Judge owned, among other
>>treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and
>>
>>
>reread) volumes,
>
>
>>and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."
>>
>>Sam Hinton
>>La Jolla, CAlifornia
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 21:11:03 EST
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Jon Bartlett <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 18:34:19 -0800
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Dick's 'tensor' line is from Alfred Bester, The Demolished Man:  here's
VonnegutTENT RENTALS
Rented a tent, a tent, a tent,
Rented a tent, a tent, a tent,
Rented a tent!
Rented a tent!
Rented a, rented a tent.- snare drum on Mars, from The Sirens of Titan.----- Original Message -----
From: "dick greenhaus" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 5:58 PM
Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS> Or, to move it up into Sci-Fi of the mid 20th Century:
> "Tenser," said the tensor
> "Tenser," said the tensor
> Tension apprehension and dissension have begun...
>
>
>
> Norm Cohen wrote:
>
>>Punch, brothers, punch,
>>Punch with care,
>>Punch in the presence of the passenjair.
>>A blue trip slip for a six cent fare,
>>A pink trip slip for a ten cent fare,
>>Punch brothers...  etc.
>>Is what echoes in my mind's ear.
>>Norm
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: <[unmask]>
>>To: <[unmask]>
>>Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:07 PM
>>Subject: EAR-WORMS
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the
>>>
>>>
>>ear-worm
>>
>>
>>>(although I don't believe he used that term)  about the handling of
>>>
>>>
>>street-car
>>
>>
>>>tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair"  which was seen as a
>>>
>>>
>>poem
>>
>>
>>>in a newspaper.  Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached a
>>>
>>>
>>funeral
>>
>>
>>>oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding their
>>>
>>>
>>heads in
>>
>>
>>>rhythm.  The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will kill
>>>
>>>
>>me!"
>>
>>
>>>to which the new widow, mistaking  the  cause of his agony, replied
>>>"Bless
>>>
>>>
>>you
>>
>>
>>>sir, for those kind words!"  Twain's advice, given after he had quoted
>>>the
>>>entire  offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines, shun
>>>
>>>
>>them as
>>
>>
>>>you would the plague! "
>>>
>>>My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie,  was a country lawyer living in
>>>
>>>
>>Beaumont,
>>
>>
>>>Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and 'Dearie", his
>>>
>>>
>>wife
>>
>>
>>>and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's.  (We lived 700
>>>miles
>>>north of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.)  Dearie and Judge owned, among other
>>>treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and
>>>
>>>
>>reread) volumes,
>>
>>
>>>and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."
>>>
>>>Sam Hinton
>>>La Jolla, CAlifornia
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
From: Jack Campin <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:21:01 +0000
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> Has anyone know this very melodic ballad?  It has a recurring verse
> of "She's the earl of March's daughter/ and the flooer of ---/ but
> the humble squire of Tushielaw/ has ta'en her heart awa'"If you look at http://www.folktrax.com/bus001.htm you will see the
Tasmanian group Tantallon attributing it to Lionel McClelland and
saying they heard him sing it at Nitten Folk Club (in this village).
He'll have been doing a floor spot.Now I have heard Tantallon at Nitten Folk Club, they've been twice,
and I may have been there when they heard that.  I have certainly
heard it sung often enough around here.  But can I remember who
Lionel McClelland is?...I will ask somebody who might know on Thursday.Google suggests it's been a hit for Aoife Clancy who I haven't
knowingly heard.  At guess she got it from the Tantallon CD.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760
<http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack>     *     food intolerance data & recipes,
Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files, and my CD-ROM "Embro, Embro".
---> off-list mail to "j-c" rather than "ballad-l" at this site, please. <---

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
From: Jack Campin <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 10:12:38 +0000
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> Has anyone know this very melodic ballad?  It has a recurring
> verse of "She's the earl of March's daughterFurther to my previous reply: Lionel McClelland, who wrote it,
is half of Black-Eyed Biddy, who don't appear to have a website.
There's a review of one of their CDs at
   <http://www.folkmusic.net/htmfiles/webrevs/cdtrax056.htm>
but they don't seem to have recorded this song.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760
<http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack>     *     food intolerance data & recipes,
Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files, and my CD-ROM "Embro, Embro".
---> off-list mail to "j-c" rather than "ballad-l" at this site, please. <---

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Conrad Bladey Peasant <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 06:29:41 -0500
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Some things should perhaps not be digtized  :)CBJonathan Lighter wrote:> Thank you, Heather. You and Ed have done us all a service !
>
> JL
>
> Heather Wood <[unmask]> wrote:
>
>     For those who would like to flagellate themselves with the whole
>     article:
>
>
>     Grubstreet Journal, Feb 27 No. 276.
>
>     Of Ballad-singing.
>
>     The Scandalous Practice of Ballad-singing, is the Bane of all good
>     Manners and Morals, a Nursery for Idlers. Whores and Pickpockets, a
>     School for Scandal, Smut and Debauchery, and ought to be entirely
>     suppressed, or reduced under proper Restriction. If Ballads do not,
>     yet they ought to come under the Stamp Act, and the Law looks on
>     Ballad-singers as Vagrants. This brings to my Mind the ill Conduct
>     of many of our middling Gentry, who suffer their Children,
>     particularly their daughters, to frequent the Kitchen, be familiar
>     with the Servants, and so learn their Manners. One Part of their
>     Conversation turns upon frightful Stories of Witches, Apparitions,
>     &c. which serve to keep Miss in Awe, and in their interest.
>
>     Her Delight in the Kitchen-Conversation increases with her Years;
>     now is flattered, taught to shew Tricks upon Cards, and play at
>     Romps; ~ which soon makes her forget htt Birth, and think herself on
>     a level with them. Well! Miss is now out of her Hanging Sleeves, and
>     every one, especially the Footman, tells her how pretty she is. Now
>     Ballads and Love Songs are daily presented her, and vouched for
>     Truth: One tells, "How a Footman died for Love of a young Lady, and
>     how she was haunted by his Ghost, and died for Grief. Another, How
>     the Coachman run away with his young Mistress, took to Hedging and
>     Ditching, and she to Knitting and Spinning, and lived vast Happy,
>     and in great Plenty. And a third, How the young ’Squire,
>     Master’s eldest Son, fell in Love with the Chambermaid, married
>     her at the Fleet, was turn’d out of Doors, kept an Inn, got Money
>     as fast as Hops, till the old Gentleman died suddenly without a
>     Will, and then his Son got all, kept a Coach, and made his Wife a
>     great Lady, who bore him Twins for 12 years together, who all lived
>     to be Justices of the Peace, &c. By such foolish Stories Miss is
>     deluded; sighs, pities, and at last loves; and so too often undone
>     without Remedy
>
>     § A Female Correspondent, who signs Virtuous, complains of the many
>     ruinous Marriages that are every Year practiced in the Fleet, by a
>     Set of drunken swearing Parsons, with their Myrmidons that wear
>     black Coats, and pretend to. be Clerks and Registers to the Fleet,
>     plying about Ludgate-hill, pulling and forcing People to some
>     pedling Alehouse or Brandyshop to be married, even on Sunday,
>     stopping them as they go to the Church.
>
>     Not long since, a young Lady was deluded and forced from her
>     Friends, and by the Assistance of a very wicked swearing Parson,
>     married to an atheistical Wretch, whose Life is a continual Practice
>     of all Manner of Vice and Debauchery.—Another young Lady was
>     decoyed to a House in the confines of the Fleet by a pretended
>     Gentleman. Dr. Wryneck immediately appear'd, and swore she should be
>     married; or if she would not, he would have his Fee, and register
>     the Marriage from that Night. The Lady, to recover her Liberty, left
>     her Ring as a Pledge that she would meet h im the morrow Night.
>
>
>
>     Gentleman’s Magazine, Vol. 5 Feb 1735, p. 93
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>--
@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@#@@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@
Looking through my bedroom window, out into the moonlight and the
uneding smoke-colored snow,
I could see the lights in the windows of all the other houses on our
hill and hear the music rising from them
up the long, steadily falling night. I turned the gas down, I got into
bed. I said some words to the
close and holy darkness, and then I slept!-Dylan Thomas
####################################################################

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Subject: Re: BALLAD-L Digest - 3 Mar 2005 (#2005-99): Earworms
From: Joe Fineman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 08:54:26 -0500
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Automatic digest processor <[unmask]>, in the
person of Dick Greenhaus, writes:> Or, to move it up into Sci-Fi of the mid 20th Century:
> "Tenser," said the tensor
> "Tenser," said the tensor
> Tension apprehension and dissension have begun...IIRC, Mark 2ain's "Punch, brothers" was quoted in that very story by
Alfred Bester (whose title has succumbed to my senility -- ah, no, not
quite: "The Demolished Man").  8, sir, 7, sir, 6, sir, 5, sir,
  4, sir, 3, sir, 2, sir, 1.
--
---  Joe Fineman    [unmask]||:  When scared of the dark, it may help to close your eyes.  :||

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Subject: Earworm
From: Educational CyberPlayGround <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 10:40:54 -0500
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FYI: Exactly what an earworm is.
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Culdesac/Stars/funkbrothersCulture.htmlKaren Ellis
Educational CyberPlayGround<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
The Educational CyberPlayGround
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/National Children's Folksong Repository
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/NCFR/Hot List of Schools Online and
Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/7 Hot Site Awards
New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>

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Subject: Rochelle's Recovery
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 08:38:38 -0800
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Folks:This good report about Rochelle Goldstein, Ken's widow, comes from daughter Rhoda Goldstein.  A few more get-well emails might  boost Rochelle's return to action.Ed
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear friends,
    I just wanted to let you all know that my mom is doing much better and
will be going home tomorrow to her own apt.  She's come a very long way in a
relatively short time. While she is still weak , she has great range of
motion in her upper body and can walk with a walker, which hopefully soon
she will be able to throw away! She gets stronger everyday. Her physical
therapist told her she has the spirit and drive of a 20 year old, not a 73
year-old.  She'll continue to get physical therapy at home, and for the next
few weeks either I, Scott or Diane will be with her to help her out.  Thank
you to everyone who has sent her good wishes.  She has thrived on the cards,
emails, visits and calls she has received.
Warm wishes and thanks,
Rhoda Goldstein

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Subject: Vera Johnson, Pierre Trudeau, Justin Thyme
From: Barry O'Neill <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 11:51:52 -0500
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Years ago someone on this list to whom I am grateful send me thisPierre Trudeau is very astute
Not only that, he really is cute
He's got ideas, and get up and go
That's why we like Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, un homme savant
Et quelquefois, un homme charmant
Il boit seulement du lait et de l'eau
Il est gentil, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, he comes from Quebec
But doesn't think like Rene' Levesque
He wants to see our Canada grow.
Both strong and free, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, il parle bien
Avec candeur, sans peur de rien
"Les Liberaus sont idiots."
Il dit cela, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau has positive views
Cast totems down and break the taboos
Forget the past, the old status quo
Try something new, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, c'est vrai qu'il est riche
Mais pour l'argent, il dit "Je m'en fiche"
Il demeure seul dans un grand chateau
Tout simplement, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, he doesn't conform
In thought or dress, to what is the norm
He is unique, we want you to know
There's no one like Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, c'est l'homme pour moi
Il veut garder, proteger nos droits
Et quand il parle, j'ecoute ses mots
Car il est sage, Pierre Trudeau.

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:15:03 -0500
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---- Original message ----
>Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 13:46:23 -0500
>From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
>Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore>>  I remember one winter day getting snow in Texas.
>
>        Hmm ... What part of South Texas?Corpus Christi, on the Gulf coast way down towards the tip.
My dad being in the Navy we didn't live there long, but we
did live there twice. Birth to 2 I don't remember much; the
snow incident would have been between 5-7 years... around
1963-66.
It was while in Corpus Christi that I was introduced to girl
scouts from which venerable organization I learned many fine
rounds... including the recently discussed "Rose,Rose,Rose".
I learned it with the same version of words that Ghost
posted. Though I cut my eye teeth on Sea Shanties as a baby
(Dad may never have sailed in square riggers but that didn't
stop him from singing as if he had) the first ballad type
song I ever learned was also through Girl Scouts, "The Cruel
War is Raging". Never have figured out if it's truly a
traditional song?Aha! Back to the topic of Ballads. Sort of.
Kathleen

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Subject: Missing Email address
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 14:46:08 -0800
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Folks:I doubt many of you have Rhoda Goldstein's address.  So if yoy wish to send her encouraging greetings, do it through:Rhoda Goldstein <[unmask]>Ed

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Subject: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 17:30:08 -0600
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Hello everyone,Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
US...Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  UNCLE BUD   (Recording: http://tinyurl.com/3mcoe )  Uncle Bud's fine; Uncle Bud is keen.
  Uncle Bud's got plenty of gasoline.        Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud.  Uncle Bud's got this; Uncle Bud's got that.
  Uncle Bud's got a dick like a baseball bat.        Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud.]  Uncle Bud's got a wife.  She's big and fat.
  She's got a cunt like a Stetson hat.    Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud.  Notes: This is transcribed from the LP "Unexpurgated Folk Songs
of Men" by Mack McCormick.

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/04/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 20:21:45 -0500
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Hi!        As promised, here are the remaining bookworms for this week.        MISCELLANEOUS        4526273000 - Virginia Folk Legends by Barden, 1991, $4.99 (ends
Mar-06-05 14:30:00 PST)        4705823647 - Ontario Ballads & Folksongs, LP, $8 (ends Mar-06-05
18:19:17 PST)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        6949209213 - The Singin' Gatherin' by Thomas & Leeder, 1939, $9.99
(ends Mar-05-05 18:52:47 PST)        7303326418 - A Ballad History of England by Palmer, 1979, 9.99 GBP
(ends Mar-05-05 22:54:05 PST)        6949270018 - FOLK SONGS, CHANTEYS, AND SINGING GAMES by Sharp &
Farnsworth, 1909, $4.49 (ends Mar-06-05 07:25:17 PST)        4531730654 - Irish Street Ballads by O'Lochlainn, 1960, $17 (ends
Mar-06-05 15:02:17 PST)        6947346494 - Frontier Ballads by Finger, 1927, $19.99 (ends
Mar-06-05 18:00:00 PST)        3961560840 - A BALLAD HISTORY of IRELAND by MacHale, 1906, $9.95
(ends Mar-06-05 19:58:51 PST)        4705985097 - Cold Snap by MacColl & Seeger, LP, 1977, 4.99 GBP
(ends Mar-07-05 11:00:27 PST)        6949546302 - THE OXFORD NURSERY RHYME BOOK by Opie, 1963 edition,
$0.39 (ends Mar-07-05 19:06:44 PST)        6949553504 - Folk Songs of the American Negro by Work, $6 (ends
Mar-07-05 20:05:02 PST)        7304895880 - 2 books (American Mountain Songs & Buckaroo Ballads),
$5.99 (ends Mar-08-05 07:30:54 PST)        7304967703 - TIP TOP ALBUM OF CARSON J. ROBINSON SONGS, 1931, $6
(ends Mar-08-05 12:25:40 PST)        4531475946 - Ballad Hunter by Lomax, 1947, $10.50 (ends Mar-08-05
14:13:15 PST)        6515975810 - Salt and Peanuts, Our Favorite Comdey Songs and
Ballads, 1931, $9.99 (ends Mar-09-05 08:38:24 PST)        6949374738 - Traditional Tunes of the Child Ballads by Bronson,
complete set (4 volumes), 1962-72, $202.50 AU (ends Mar-09-05 16:37:27 PST)        4532671458 - AIRMAN'S SONG BOOK by Ward-Jackson & Lucas, 1967,
4.99 GBP (ends Mar-10-05 04:30:04 PST)        4532783455 - One Singer One Song by McVicar, 1990, 4.99 GBP (ends
Mar-10-05 11:43:16 PST)        3878799607 - EVERYMANS BOOK OF ENGLISH COUNTRY SONGS by Palmer,
1979, 4.99 GBP (ends Mar-12-05 09:16:11 PST)        4532515975 - A Scottish Ballad Book by Buchan, 1973, 1 GBP (ends
Mar-12-05 13:25:18 PST)        6949929168 - Ballads Migrant in New England by Flanders & Olney,
1953, $10 (ends Mar-13-05 07:43:22 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 21:19:54 -0500
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On 2005/03/04 at 04:15:03PM -0500, [unmask] wrote:> >From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>> >>  I remember one winter day getting snow in Texas.
> >
> >        Hmm ... What part of South Texas?
>
> Corpus Christi, on the Gulf coast way down towards the tip.        O.K.  That would have had more humidity, so it would be more
likely to actually get snow from time to time.  In Cotulla, the virtual
snowfalls were separated by about the traditional "seven long years". :-)
We were lacking in both cold and humidity most of the year.
(Occasionally, it would get cold enough so above-ground water faucets
would be left trickling, and the vertical pipes wrapped in old
newspaper.> My dad being in the Navy we didn't live there long, but we
> did live there twice. Birth to 2 I don't remember much; the
> snow incident would have been between 5-7 years... around
> 1963-66.        O.K.  You sound like a kid from a Navy family.        [ ... ]> posted. Though I cut my eye teeth on Sea Shanties as a baby
> (Dad may never have sailed in square riggers but that didn't
> stop him from singing as if he had)        Hmm ... my father was partial to Shanties as well.  I wasn't old
enough to have any critical sense of the quality of his singing at that
age, and he had quit by the time I acquired said sense.        I only managed to get one nautical recitation from him on tape
some years before he passed on.  I don't know if it had an official
title, but I knew it as "Ci-vil-e-tie".>                                     the first ballad type
> song I ever learned was also through Girl Scouts, "The Cruel
> War is Raging". Never have figured out if it's truly a
> traditional song?        I believe that it is traditional.  I'm sure that someone will
fill us in with chapter and verse on that soon enough.        I see that I missed something by not becoming a scout.  I was
more tempted (at the time) by things like building your own crystal
radio (in an area where the signal strength was far too weak for a
crystal radio to be practical. About the only thing which I would have
been likely to get is the private airport mechanically broadcasting
it's identifier "COT" (_._. ___ _ in Morse code) very slowly. :-)        Enjoy,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 18:24:38 -0800
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Subject: _The Shaughraun_ by Boucicault and the tune to Harvey Duff
From: bennett schwartz <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:50:05 -0500
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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 23:28:07 EST
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As a kid, I knew only one verse of "Uncle Bud;"  I was a "good boy," and
didn't seek furhther verses, although I knew there were some.    "Old Uncle Bud is the jelly-roll king;
    Got a hump in his back from a-shakin' that thing."Sam Hinton
La Jolla, CA

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 00:16:49 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: <[unmask]><<Though I cut my eye teeth on Sea Shanties as a baby
(Dad may never have sailed in square riggers but that didn't
stop him from singing as if he had) the first ballad type
song I ever learned was also through Girl Scouts, "The Cruel
War is Raging". Never have figured out if it's truly a
traditional song?>>It is; Laws lists it as O33, under the title of "The Girl Volunteer".
Earliest citation in the Traditional Ballad Index is 1914 (Brown), but it's
certainly older than that.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 00:25:48 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: "John Mehlberg" <[unmask]><<Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
US...>>A cleanish version was recorded by Gid Tanner & his Skillet Lickers in 1928.
For other information, see the entry in the Traditional Ballad Index.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Self Congratulations
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 04:45:10 -0500
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Hurray!
A book I wrote appears in sainted Dolores Nichols' current Ebay list.
I shall have a drink tonight to celebrate.
The price of ?4.99 quoted is what it still sells for in the shops.EwanEwan McVicar, 
84 High Street
Linlithgow, 
West Lothian
Scotland
EH49 7AQtel 01506 847935

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Beth Brooks <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 07:43:58 -0500
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It appears so, at least here in the Hoosier state. I polled 3 classes of
5th graders and one class of undergrads and they had never heard
anything of the sort (although my 5th graders were willing to give it a
try!).Beth Brooks>>> [unmask] 03/04/05 9:24 PM >>>
So the consensus - no, the unanimous decision - is that snow-day
superstitions are new. Or at least newly applied to "snow days."JL

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw
From: Jean Lepley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 05:14:28 -0800
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On Mon, 28 Feb 2005, Murray Shoolbraid wrote:> Jean - it would help a great deal if you posted the words you can make out.
>
> Murray Shoolbraid
>
I would if I hadn't already got my answer from Malcolm Douglas (and his
lead to a record with Garrick Macpherson singing "the earl of March's
daughter").  Thanks all!

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Subject: Re: Self Congratulations
From: Conrad Bladey Peasant <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:11:43 -0500
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Congratulations!Not long ago I found one of my books on Abe at 300% of original value!
And.....it was soon sold!Watch for a hand painted hubcap from my artcar Handy on ebay- signed!
and with an autographed portrait of myself and the car!- who knows I may
include my song about artcars-http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Vines/5863/artcaranthem.htmlThe midi must be played to truly understand!~
LITTLE     PlAIN      CARS
An Artcar Anthem!         Adapted  from Malvina Reynolds ?Little Boxes?
         To Play Midi sound click here
         For Notation click here
         For ABC Notation click here         Little plain cars on the car lots,
         Little plain cars  made of  status quo-a-stuff
         Little plain cars on the high-a-ways,
         Little plain cars all the same,
         There's a black one and a brown one
         And a blue one and a red one
         And they're all made out of status quo-a-stuff
         And they all look just the same.         And the people in the plain cars
         All went to the university
         Where they were put in plain cars
         And they came out all the same
         And there's doctors and lawyers
         And street rod-od-ers
         And they're all made out of status quo-a-stuff
         And they all look just the same.         And they all play on the golf course
         And drink their hand-crafted beer
         And they all have pretty children
         And the children go to school,
         And the children go to summer camp
         And then to the university
         Where they are all  put in plain cars
         And they drive out all the same.         And the boys go into business
         And marry and raise a family
         Drive in  plain cars made of status quo-a-stuff
         And they all look just the same,
         There's a green one and a grey one
         And a blue one and a yellow one
         And they're all made out of status quo-a-stuff
         And they all look just the same.         But the one child  he?s an ar-tist
         And knows that his freedom?s real
         Tired of plain cars made of status quo-a-stuff
         That all look just the same,
         Now there?s glued ones and there are painted ones
         And a carved one and a magnet one
         And they?re all made out of  joy and smiles
         And they all are all the rage!         (alt last verse or add on - And they all the world will change!)Back to chasing Guy Fawkes!ConradEwan McVicar wrote:
> Hurray!
> A book I wrote appears in sainted Dolores Nichols' current Ebay list.
> I shall have a drink tonight to celebrate.
> The price of ?4.99 quoted is what it still sells for in the shops.
>
> Ewan
>
>
> Ewan McVicar,
> 84 High Street
> Linlithgow,
> West Lothian
> Scotland
> EH49 7AQ
>
> tel 01506 847935
>--
@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@#@@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@
Looking through my bedroom window, out into the moonlight and the
uneding smoke-colored snow,
I could see the lights in the windows of all the other houses on our
hill and hear the music rising from them
up the long, steadily falling night. I turned the gas down, I got into
bed. I said some words to the
close and holy darkness, and then I slept!-Dylan Thomas
####################################################################

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Subject: Little Boxes parodies - was Self Congratulations
From: [unmask]
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Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 11:04:22 EST
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Subject: Re: Self Congratulations
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 08:17:48 -0800
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Ewan:Take heart!  When my books turn up on ebay or in used book stores, they are listed at a fraction of their cost.  The worst was a 50-cent price for a book I spent four years on.  That sent me to drink too.Ah, capitalism.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Date: Saturday, March 5, 2005 1:45 am
Subject: Self Congratulations> Hurray!
> A book I wrote appears in sainted Dolores Nichols' current Ebay list.
> I shall have a drink tonight to celebrate.
> The price of ?4.99 quoted is what it still sells for in the shops.
> 
> Ewan
> 
> 
> Ewan McVicar, 
> 84 High Street
> Linlithgow, 
> West Lothian
> Scotland
> EH49 7AQ
> 
> tel 01506 847935
>

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 12:47:34 -0500
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I checked with my 12 yr old niece (who lives in NH). She had
indeed heard of the inside out PJs, and she had a further
ritual. You say "no school" backwards five times and then go
straight to bed. Preferably with those inside out jammies on.
That's "loohcs on" for those of you wiling to try it.
Kathleen>>>> [unmask] 03/04/05 9:24 PM >>>
>So the consensus - no, the unanimous decision - is that snow-
day
>superstitions are new. Or at least newly applied to "snow
days."
>
>JL

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 12:53:38 -0500
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>>----- Original Message -----
>From: <[unmask]>
>"The Cruel War is Raging". Never have figured out if it's
truly a traditional song?>>
>
>It is; Laws lists it as O33, under the title of "The Girl
Volunteer".
>Earliest citation in the Traditional Ballad Index is 1914
(Brown), but it's
>certainly older than that.
>
>Peace,
>PaulAs I've learned more, and heard more, traditional ballad and
song, I've started to recognize some of the themes and motifs
in that song. Especially the ever popular "I'll cut off my
hair and dress in Men's clothes" idea. But having learned it
from a guitar playing teenager in the midst of the 60's folk
revival I always suspected it. Good to know it's got a older
pedigree.
I learn so much from this list! Thank you.
Kathleen

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 13:07:23 -0500
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Aoife Clancy is a member of the Clancy Brother's family (a
daughter of one of the brothers?). She's been the vocalist
for the Irish music group Cherish the Ladies for a few years
now. She has a lovely voice.
Kathleen---- Original message ----
>Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:21:01 +0000
>From: Jack Campin <[unmask]>
>Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
>To: [unmask]>>Google suggests it's been a hit for Aoife Clancy who I
haven't
>knowingly heard.

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/04/05
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:42:43 -0800
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Dolores:I note that your "search engine" for eBay picked up the Barden folk legends volume.  I wonder if you could rewrite that "engine" -- perhaps posting to ballad-l in a separate listing -- to pick up more folklore, tale, belief, etc., books.Such a supplement would, first of all, complement the song and ballad listings; and, second, would enhance the already considerable value of your work on our behalf.Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Date: Friday, March 4, 2005 5:21 pm
Subject: Ebay List - 03/04/05> Hi!
>
>        As promised, here are the remaining bookworms for this week.
>
>        MISCELLANEOUS
>
>        4526273000 - Virginia Folk Legends by Barden, 1991, $4.99
> (endsMar-06-05 14:30:00 PST)
>
>        4705823647 - Ontario Ballads & Folksongs, LP, $8 (ends Mar-
> 06-05
> 18:19:17 PST)
>
>        SONGBOOKS, ETC.
>
>        6949209213 - The Singin' Gatherin' by Thomas & Leeder,
> 1939, $9.99
> (ends Mar-05-05 18:52:47 PST)
>
>        7303326418 - A Ballad History of England by Palmer, 1979,
> 9.99 GBP
> (ends Mar-05-05 22:54:05 PST)
>
>        6949270018 - FOLK SONGS, CHANTEYS, AND SINGING GAMES by
> Sharp &
> Farnsworth, 1909, $4.49 (ends Mar-06-05 07:25:17 PST)
>
>        4531730654 - Irish Street Ballads by O'Lochlainn, 1960, $17
> (endsMar-06-05 15:02:17 PST)
>
>        6947346494 - Frontier Ballads by Finger, 1927, $19.99 (ends
> Mar-06-05 18:00:00 PST)
>
>        3961560840 - A BALLAD HISTORY of IRELAND by MacHale, 1906,
> $9.95(ends Mar-06-05 19:58:51 PST)
>
>        4705985097 - Cold Snap by MacColl & Seeger, LP, 1977, 4.99 GBP
> (ends Mar-07-05 11:00:27 PST)
>
>        6949546302 - THE OXFORD NURSERY RHYME BOOK by Opie, 1963
> edition,$0.39 (ends Mar-07-05 19:06:44 PST)
>
>        6949553504 - Folk Songs of the American Negro by Work, $6
> (endsMar-07-05 20:05:02 PST)
>
>        7304895880 - 2 books (American Mountain Songs & Buckaroo
> Ballads),$5.99 (ends Mar-08-05 07:30:54 PST)
>
>        7304967703 - TIP TOP ALBUM OF CARSON J. ROBINSON SONGS,
> 1931, $6
> (ends Mar-08-05 12:25:40 PST)
>
>        4531475946 - Ballad Hunter by Lomax, 1947, $10.50 (ends Mar-
> 08-05
> 14:13:15 PST)
>
>        6515975810 - Salt and Peanuts, Our Favorite Comdey Songs and
> Ballads, 1931, $9.99 (ends Mar-09-05 08:38:24 PST)
>
>        6949374738 - Traditional Tunes of the Child Ballads by
> Bronson,complete set (4 volumes), 1962-72, $202.50 AU (ends Mar-09-
> 05 16:37:27 PST)
>
>        4532671458 - AIRMAN'S SONG BOOK by Ward-Jackson & Lucas, 1967,
> 4.99 GBP (ends Mar-10-05 04:30:04 PST)
>
>        4532783455 - One Singer One Song by McVicar, 1990, 4.99 GBP
> (endsMar-10-05 11:43:16 PST)
>
>        3878799607 - EVERYMANS BOOK OF ENGLISH COUNTRY SONGS by
> Palmer,1979, 4.99 GBP (ends Mar-12-05 09:16:11 PST)
>
>        4532515975 - A Scottish Ballad Book by Buchan, 1973, 1 GBP
> (endsMar-12-05 13:25:18 PST)
>
>        6949929168 - Ballads Migrant in New England by Flanders &
> Olney,1953, $10 (ends Mar-13-05 07:43:22 PST)
>
>                                Happy Bidding!
>                                Dolores
>
> --
> Dolores Nichols                 |
> D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
> Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
>        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?
>

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:54:00 -0800
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Folks:My old professor Wayland Hand would be busy writing all these down.  They are interesting inversions of the widely held belief that putting on or wearing clothes (outwear to underwear) backwards brings BAD luck., or in Utah "invites all evil."Ed----- Original Message -----
From: [unmask]
Date: Saturday, March 5, 2005 9:47 am
Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore> I checked with my 12 yr old niece (who lives in NH). She had
> indeed heard of the inside out PJs, and she had a further
> ritual. You say "no school" backwards five times and then go
> straight to bed. Preferably with those inside out jammies on.
> That's "loohcs on" for those of you wiling to try it.
> Kathleen
>
> >>>> [unmask] 03/04/05 9:24 PM >>>
> >So the consensus - no, the unanimous decision - is that snow-
> day
> >superstitions are new. Or at least newly applied to "snow
> days."
> >
> >JL
>

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 14:17:23 -0500
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>----- Original Message -----
>From: "John Mehlberg" <[unmask]>
>
><<Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
>"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
>US...>>
>
>A cleanish version was recorded by Gid Tanner & his Skillet Lickers in 1928.
>For other information, see the entry in the Traditional Ballad Index.
>
>Peace,
>PaulZora Neale Hurston, Mules and Men?, something on-line at LOC's American Memory?John--
john garst    [unmask]

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: "Robert B. Waltz" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 13:43:04 -0600
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On 3/5/05, edward cray wrote:>Folks:
>
>My old professor Wayland Hand would be busy writing all these down.  They are interesting inversions of the widely held belief that putting on or wearing clothes (outwear to underwear) backwards brings BAD luck., or in Utah "invites all evil."How does this reconcile with the modern notion of "rally caps" --
a baseball cap worn backward or inside out, used when one is
behind and really needs to start a "rally"?--
Bob Waltz
[unmask]"The one thing we learn from history --
   is that no one ever learns from history."

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
From: Mary Cliff <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 14:53:41 -0500
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Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]> writes:
>Aoife Clancy is a member of the Clancy Brother's family (a
>daughter of one of the brothers?).Bobby.Mary Cliff

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Subject: Re: Self Congratulations
From: Conrad Bladey Peasant <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 15:06:56 -0500
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What do you mean? sent you to drink....It is because of running out of money for drink that I write!Must be a "Poe" Author.....CBedward cray wrote:
> Ewan:
>
> Take heart!  When my books turn up on ebay or in used book stores, they are listed at a fraction of their cost.  The worst was a 50-cent price for a book I spent four years on.  That sent me to drink too.
>
> Ah, capitalism.
>
> Ed
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
> Date: Saturday, March 5, 2005 1:45 am
> Subject: Self Congratulations
>
>
>>Hurray!
>>A book I wrote appears in sainted Dolores Nichols' current Ebay list.
>>I shall have a drink tonight to celebrate.
>>The price of ?4.99 quoted is what it still sells for in the shops.
>>
>>Ewan
>>
>>
>>Ewan McVicar,
>>84 High Street
>>Linlithgow,
>>West Lothian
>>Scotland
>>EH49 7AQ
>>
>>tel 01506 847935
>>
>
>--
@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@#@@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@
Looking through my bedroom window, out into the moonlight and the
uneding smoke-colored snow,
I could see the lights in the windows of all the other houses on our
hill and hear the music rising from them
up the long, steadily falling night. I turned the gas down, I got into
bed. I said some words to the
close and holy darkness, and then I slept!-Dylan Thomas
####################################################################

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 15:11:48 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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On 2005/03/05 at 12:47:34PM -0500, [unmask] wrote:> I checked with my 12 yr old niece (who lives in NH). She had
> indeed heard of the inside out PJs, and she had a further
> ritual. You say "no school" backwards five times and then go
> straight to bed. Preferably with those inside out jammies on.
> That's "loohcs on" for those of you wiling to try it.
> Kathleen        Thank you.  That gives us Washington DC area and New Hampshire.
(And wasn't there another sighting mentioned?)  It seems that it is an
Eastern seaboard phenomeon, so far (unless that other sighting put it
elsewhere).        Thanks,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Death of Joe Carter
From: "Robert B. Waltz" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 16:09:35 -0600
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I've been sick all week, so maybe this came up and no one
mentioned it, but I thought it better to repeat than leave
it out.Joe Carter, the son of A. P. and Sara, died last Wednesday of
cancer at the age of 78. He was present at the Bristol Sessions --
thought to be the last living person to have been associated with
the events. He recorded with his father A. P. and sister Janette
on the Acme label from 1952-1956, and later sang bass with Sara
and Maybelle.I don't have much else in the way of detail.--
Bob Waltz
[unmask]"The one thing we learn from history --
   is that no one ever learns from history."

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Subject: More Faux, Fawkes,Fox,fauks....trivia-Prince of Sinisters Song
From: Conrad Bladey Peasant <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 19:31:42 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Greetings!
Just what you have been looking for! More Prince of Sinisters Trivia....So far the earliest dated version of the song comes from a play
performed in 1822 and published in 1837 called "The Meltonians" Where it
appears in Act Two, Scene I. By R. B. Peake....Of course that is as far
as I know....A bit about this song-now for the trivia-The new police may reference bow street runners which went through
several improvements from 1749 (Under Fielding)  into late 1700s with
the bigest change coming with Peel and formation of The Metropolis
Police in 1829. Hard to tell what the New Police were but the force was
based at Scotland yard from 1829. And Scotland yard is mentioned in the
song.....-Voxhall bridge was constructed from 1813-19 and it is mentioned.
(of course Anne Vox of Voxhall and Voxhall figured in the plot of 1605)-Portable gas light is mentioned- first gas cylinders were introduced in
1819.-It is likely that other references were added after the appearance of
the song in the meltonians.Queen Victoria's sons were born in- 1841, 1850, and 1853. These are all
a bit later than this version.Townsend or Townshend was a famous Bow Street Runner. He is not
mentioned in this version but in others. Townshend was active and famous
by  1828.The last line of the Meltonian version is interesting. The use of the
concept of members of parliament blowing each other up via personal
attack and rhetoric is one used by Cruikshank when describing his
cartoon of the Unexhibited Cartoon of Guy Fawkes. A very similar usage-".  Unfortunately, some had long noses and some had short; so, putting
this and that together, the long and the short of it is, that I
determined on adopting a living prototype, who has been blowing up both
Houses of Parliament for several years, and if not a Fawkes in other
respects, is at least famous for encouraging forking out the part of
others."-from: The Comic Almanac, 1844Of course the tune has a long history....bow wow wow....So there....some trivia....now a question!Who is Cruikshank referring to as the person who is his prototype who
has been blowing up both Houses of Parliament for several
years....forking out the part of others."So the search goes on! But the trivia had piled up high enough to shift
it over to you! Have fun....CB--
@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@#@@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@
Looking through my bedroom window, out into the moonlight and the
uneding smoke-colored snow,
I could see the lights in the windows of all the other houses on our
hill and hear the music rising from them
up the long, steadily falling night. I turned the gas down, I got into
bed. I said some words to the
close and holy darkness, and then I slept!-Dylan Thomas
####################################################################

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 19:14:48 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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HelloI found two recordings in the Florida Folklife from the WPA Collections.
The first is Zora Neale Hurston and the second is James Brown & Rufs Bland.        http://tinyurl.com/5umrn        http://tinyurl.com/6jzwwSurely a song so widespread should have survived somewhere.  Someone must
still sing this song.   I will try placing up a few texts on my site and on
mudcat to encourage people to come out of the woodworks.I remember reading about "Uncle Bud" in the unpublished part of Roger
Abrahams' discertation and in a 1928 Texas folklore journal.   References
later.Thanks for you help.Yours,John Mehlberg----- Original Message -----
From: "John Garst" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 1:17 PM
Subject: [Spam][68.1%] Re: "Uncle Bud" song> >----- Original Message -----
>>From: "John Mehlberg" <[unmask]>
>>
>><<Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
>>"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
>>US...>>
>>
>>A cleanish version was recorded by Gid Tanner & his Skillet Lickers in
>>1928.
>>For other information, see the entry in the Traditional Ballad Index.
>>
>>Peace,
>>Paul
>
> Zora Neale Hurston, Mules and Men?, something on-line at LOC's American
> Memory?
>
> John
>
>
> --
> john garst    [unmask]

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 05:08:16 EST
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Subject: Scrounging
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 02:29:39 -0800
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Folks:While surfing for possible purchases on Abebooks.com, I found the following.  For those who don't have it, this would be an important addition to their ballad library, and at a very fair price:BIBLIOTHECA CURIOSA. A BALLAD BOOK; OR, POPULAR AND ROMANTIC BALLADS AND SONGS CURRENT IN ANNANDALE AND OTHER PARTS OF SCOTLAND: PART 1. Reprinted from the Rare Original Editions of 18240 1.Edited by Edmund Goldsmid.
Sharpe, Charles Kirkpatrick (compiler).
Price: US$ 21.74 [Convert Currency]
Shipping: [Rates and Speeds]Book Description: Edinburgh: privately printed, 1891. Paperback. Part 1 only. Reprint, 16mo, tan wraps, 50 pages. Wraps lightly soiled & foxed, small chips to spine, otherwise binding Good, text Very Good. Bookseller Inventory #187033Bookseller: The Bookshop, Inc. (Chapel Hill, NC, U.S.A.)Ed

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 03:35:31 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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John:A clarification, if you will:Is that  Zora Neale Hurston singing "Uncle Bud," or is she merely the collector?And if it is her voice, are there other recordings by her?  Given interest in that prominent figure of the Harlem Renaissance, a CD with her singing and  storytelling (?) might be a worthy addition to a library.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Date: Saturday, March 5, 2005 5:14 pm
Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song> Hello
>
> I found two recordings in the Florida Folklife from the WPA
> Collections.The first is Zora Neale Hurston and the second is James
> Brown & Rufs Bland.
>
>        http://tinyurl.com/5umrn
>
>        http://tinyurl.com/6jzww
>
> Surely a song so widespread should have survived somewhere.
> Someone must
> still sing this song.   I will try placing up a few texts on my
> site and on
> mudcat to encourage people to come out of the woodworks.
>
> I remember reading about "Uncle Bud" in the unpublished part of Roger
> Abrahams' discertation and in a 1928 Texas folklore journal.
> Referenceslater.
>
> Thanks for you help.
>
> Yours,
>
> John Mehlberg
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Garst" <[unmask]>
> To: <[unmask]>
> Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 1:17 PM
> Subject: [Spam][68.1%] Re: "Uncle Bud" song
>
>
> > >----- Original Message -----
> >>From: "John Mehlberg" <[unmask]>
> >>
> >><<Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
> >>"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
> >>US...>>
> >>
> >>A cleanish version was recorded by Gid Tanner & his Skillet
> Lickers in
> >>1928.
> >>For other information, see the entry in the Traditional Ballad
> Index.>>
> >>Peace,
> >>Paul
> >
> > Zora Neale Hurston, Mules and Men?, something on-line at LOC's
> American> Memory?
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> > --
> > john garst    [unmask]
>

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Subject: Re: Vera Johnson, Pierre Trudeau, Justin Thyme
From: Andy Rouse <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 20:36:15 +0100
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Thanks to everyone who sent help regarding the Vera Johnson song. Time
to oil my (Canadian) French!Andy

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Subject: House Of The Rising Sun
From: Clifford J OCHELTREE <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 10:26:16 -0600
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Some time back there were some e-mails concerning the House of the
Rising Sun. Some of you may be interested in this article which ran in
today's Times-Picauyne. My favorite used CD shop was next door to the
Conti dig, who would have thunk it!A French Quarter excavation yields some tantalizing history
Sunday, March 06, 2005
By Bruce Eggler
Staff writerDig a hole almost anywhere in the French Quarter and you're likely to
discover at least a shard or two of history. Put a trained archaeologist
in charge of the digging, and you'll likely do better than that.
Archaeologist Shannon Dawdy, who recently dug several holes in the 500
block of Conti Street, thinks she has uncovered evidence at the site
that could help answer at least two intriguing historical questions:-- What and where, if anywhere, was the New Orleans institution made
famous in the song "The House of the Rising Sun"?
-- Was there an earlier American Indian settlement on the site of what
became the French colonial town of New Orleans?
The Historic New Orleans Collection decided to commission the
archaeological dig after it acquired the property at 535-37 Conti St.
The site, a one-story parking garage for most of the 20th century, will
be used for a new archives building for the historical museum and
research center.
The collection has had similar digs done at several other sites it owns
in the Quarter.
It picked Dawdy, an assistant professor in the anthropology department
at the University of Chicago and visiting scholar at the University of
New Orleans' College of Urban and Public Affairs, to oversee the Conti
Street excavation.
Because time was short, the local archaeological firm Earth Search also
was hired to get as much digging done as possible before contractors
moved in late last month to start demolishing the garage.
Because the floor of the garage was covered with concrete, the first
step was to jackhammer about a dozen test holes through it and then dig
down 3 or 4 feet to see what turned up. Dawdy and her colleagues then
picked seven sites for full-scale excavations, each about 3 feet square
and 4 feet deep.
It was known that the Conti Street site had been occupied by two
successive hotels in the 19th century. The second one opened in 1828 and
was known over the years as the Richardson, the Conti and the Conti
Verandah. It burned to the ground in 1887.
But despite the second hotel's long occupancy of the site, few artifacts
from it were found, perhaps because the area being excavated was used as
a carriageway or because the site was well-cleaned after the fire.
More items were found from the lower excavation levels associated with
the earlier hotel, which operated from about 1808 to 1822, when it
burned. That establishment was known as the Rising Sun Hotel, and the
results are "looking impressively like a bordello," Dawdy said, citing
the suggestive combination of broken pieces from "tons of liquor
bottles" and several rouge pots.
Dawdy said local historians generally have claimed that the earliest
formal bordellos in New Orleans did not open until the Civil War, a view
that let them push the blame for the development on occupying Union
troops. It was assumed the Rising Sun Hotel had been a regular hostelry.
But in view of what the excavation uncovered, Dawdy finds a January 1821
ad for the hotel in the Louisiana Gazette of considerable interest. The
ad says the hotel's new owners will "maintain the character of giving
the best entertainment, which this house has enjoyed for twenty years
past." It goes on: "Gentlemen may here rely upon finding attentive
Servants. The bar will be supplied with genuine good Liquors; and at the
Table, the fare will be of the best the market or the season will afford."
Although the ad does not prove that anything illicit was happening at
the Rising Sun, it suggests it was a place where men went for a good time.
Whether the hotel also lent its name to the song is another matter.
"The House of the Rising Sun," an old folk song best known through Eric
Burdon and The Animals' hit 1964 version, was first written on paper in
the 1930s by pioneering folk song collector Alan Lomax. He said he
learned it from a "yellow-headed miner's daughter" in Kentucky.
The melody may go back to 17th century England. Who penned the lyrics is
unknown, as well as what inspired them and whether the "house" in
question was a brothel, gambling hall, prison or something else.
The Lomax version put the words in the mouth of a woman: "There is a
house in New Orleans they call the Rising Sun. It's been the ruin of
many a poor girl, and me, O God, for one." The Animals' version changed
"girl" to "boy."
Buggy drivers, public relations officials and others, operating on
skimpy evidence at best, have identified at least two other French
Quarter addresses, 616 Ursulines St. and 826-30 St. Louis St., as the
site of a brothel known as the Rising Sun.
Local researcher Pamela Arceneaux, who has spent years investigating the
history of prostitution in New Orleans, said she has never found a
reference to a bordello known as the House of the Rising Sun. Whether
Dawdy's findings will provide such evidence remains to be seen.
Below the materials from the two hotels, the diggers found items from
the early 18th century, when the excavation site apparently was for many
years a garden behind a house on Chartres Street. There are pieces of
French faience and Natchez Indian pottery, and Dawdy plans further
analysis to try to learn whether the seeds and pollen recovered were
from native or imported French plants.
Below the garden were several inches of "sterile soil," containing no
artifacts, presumably from years before the founding of New Orleans in
1718. But the excavators dug a little deeper and unexpectedly found
pieces of prehistoric Indian pottery, "very plain everyday ware," dating
from between 1200 and 1700, in two of the seven excavation spots.
Although the presence of pottery does not prove there was a long-term
Indian settlement on the site, Dawdy said she thinks it is good evidence
of "sustained occupation." Historians have known there was an Indian
village near Bayou St. John, but she said there has been no evidence
until now that Indians had lived on the same spot thatBienville chose to
establish a European town.
If enough organic material is recovered with the pottery, Dawdy said,
she can use carbon-14 testing to date the Indians' presence at the site
more accurately.
Dawdy, who is writing a book on French colonial New Orleans and formerly
was director of UNO's New Orleans archaeology program, has been working
in the city on and off since 1994. She will spend at least a year
analyzing the finds from the Conti Street site, she said.
Although it would have been nice to have enough time and workers to dig
up the entire floor of the old garage, not just a few small sections of
it, Dawdy said she is "very satisfied with the sampling," especially
with the 18th century and earlier finds.
After she has had time to study the material, she said, she probably
will write a report for the Historic New Orleans Collection, give a
public talk and publish one or more scholarly articles.

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 10:54:06 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(107 lines)


Ed,Yes, that recording is Zora Neale Hurston singing "Uncle Bud".
That song and a few others sung by her can be found at the Florida
Folklife from the WPA Collections at the Library of Congress
American Memories online collection.I have lost the original google search but was able to find this
description of the recording "...sung and spoken by Hurston.
Recorded in Jacksonville, Florida, June 18, 1939."   See here:
http://tinyurl.com/4adb5Yours,John Mehlberg----- Original Message -----
From: "edward cray" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2005 5:35 AM
Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" songJohn:A clarification, if you will:Is that  Zora Neale Hurston singing "Uncle Bud," or is she merely
the collector?And if it is her voice, are there other recordings by her?  Given
interest in that prominent figure of the Harlem Renaissance, a CD
with her singing and  storytelling (?) might be a worthy addition to
a library.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Date: Saturday, March 5, 2005 5:14 pm
Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song> Hello
>
> I found two recordings in the Florida Folklife from the WPA
> Collections.The first is Zora Neale Hurston and the second is
> James
> Brown & Rufs Bland.
>
>        http://tinyurl.com/5umrn
>
>        http://tinyurl.com/6jzww
>
> Surely a song so widespread should have survived somewhere.
> Someone must
> still sing this song.   I will try placing up a few texts on my
> site and on
> mudcat to encourage people to come out of the woodworks.
>
> I remember reading about "Uncle Bud" in the unpublished part of
> Roger
> Abrahams' discertation and in a 1928 Texas folklore journal.
> Referenceslater.
>
> Thanks for you help.
>
> Yours,
>
> John Mehlberg
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Garst" <[unmask]>
> To: <[unmask]>
> Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 1:17 PM
> Subject: [Spam][68.1%] Re: "Uncle Bud" song
>
>
> > >----- Original Message -----
> >>From: "John Mehlberg" <[unmask]>
> >>
> >><<Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
> >>"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
> >>US...>>
> >>
> >>A cleanish version was recorded by Gid Tanner & his Skillet
> Lickers in
> >>1928.
> >>For other information, see the entry in the Traditional Ballad
> Index.>>
> >>Peace,
> >>Paul
> >
> > Zora Neale Hurston, Mules and Men?, something on-line at LOC's
> American> Memory?
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> > --
> > john garst    [unmask]
>

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Subject: Re: House Of The Rising Sun
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 12:20:19 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(127 lines)


We should soon have the book on this by Ted Anthony, and I expect it
to be authoritative.John>Some time back there were some e-mails concerning the House of the
>Rising Sun. Some of you may be interested in this article which ran in
>today's Times-Picauyne. My favorite used CD shop was next door to the
>Conti dig, who would have thunk it!
>
>
>A French Quarter excavation yields some tantalizing history
>Sunday, March 06, 2005
>By Bruce Eggler
>Staff writer
>
>
>Dig a hole almost anywhere in the French Quarter and you're likely to
>discover at least a shard or two of history. Put a trained archaeologist
>in charge of the digging, and you'll likely do better than that.
>Archaeologist Shannon Dawdy, who recently dug several holes in the 500
>block of Conti Street, thinks she has uncovered evidence at the site
>that could help answer at least two intriguing historical questions:
>
>-- What and where, if anywhere, was the New Orleans institution made
>famous in the song "The House of the Rising Sun"?
>-- Was there an earlier American Indian settlement on the site of what
>became the French colonial town of New Orleans?
>The Historic New Orleans Collection decided to commission the
>archaeological dig after it acquired the property at 535-37 Conti St.
>The site, a one-story parking garage for most of the 20th century, will
>be used for a new archives building for the historical museum and
>research center.
>The collection has had similar digs done at several other sites it owns
>in the Quarter.
>It picked Dawdy, an assistant professor in the anthropology department
>at the University of Chicago and visiting scholar at the University of
>New Orleans' College of Urban and Public Affairs, to oversee the Conti
>Street excavation.
>Because time was short, the local archaeological firm Earth Search also
>was hired to get as much digging done as possible before contractors
>moved in late last month to start demolishing the garage.
>Because the floor of the garage was covered with concrete, the first
>step was to jackhammer about a dozen test holes through it and then dig
>down 3 or 4 feet to see what turned up. Dawdy and her colleagues then
>picked seven sites for full-scale excavations, each about 3 feet square
>and 4 feet deep.
>It was known that the Conti Street site had been occupied by two
>successive hotels in the 19th century. The second one opened in 1828 and
>was known over the years as the Richardson, the Conti and the Conti
>Verandah. It burned to the ground in 1887.
>But despite the second hotel's long occupancy of the site, few artifacts
>from it were found, perhaps because the area being excavated was used as
>a carriageway or because the site was well-cleaned after the fire.
>More items were found from the lower excavation levels associated with
>the earlier hotel, which operated from about 1808 to 1822, when it
>burned. That establishment was known as the Rising Sun Hotel, and the
>results are "looking impressively like a bordello," Dawdy said, citing
>the suggestive combination of broken pieces from "tons of liquor
>bottles" and several rouge pots.
>Dawdy said local historians generally have claimed that the earliest
>formal bordellos in New Orleans did not open until the Civil War, a view
>that let them push the blame for the development on occupying Union
>troops. It was assumed the Rising Sun Hotel had been a regular hostelry.
>But in view of what the excavation uncovered, Dawdy finds a January 1821
>ad for the hotel in the Louisiana Gazette of considerable interest. The
>ad says the hotel's new owners will "maintain the character of giving
>the best entertainment, which this house has enjoyed for twenty years
>past." It goes on: "Gentlemen may here rely upon finding attentive
>Servants. The bar will be supplied with genuine good Liquors; and at the
>Table, the fare will be of the best the market or the season will afford."
>Although the ad does not prove that anything illicit was happening at
>the Rising Sun, it suggests it was a place where men went for a good time.
>Whether the hotel also lent its name to the song is another matter.
>"The House of the Rising Sun," an old folk song best known through Eric
>Burdon and The Animals' hit 1964 version, was first written on paper in
>the 1930s by pioneering folk song collector Alan Lomax. He said he
>learned it from a "yellow-headed miner's daughter" in Kentucky.
>The melody may go back to 17th century England. Who penned the lyrics is
>unknown, as well as what inspired them and whether the "house" in
>question was a brothel, gambling hall, prison or something else.
>The Lomax version put the words in the mouth of a woman: "There is a
>house in New Orleans they call the Rising Sun. It's been the ruin of
>many a poor girl, and me, O God, for one." The Animals' version changed
>"girl" to "boy."
>Buggy drivers, public relations officials and others, operating on
>skimpy evidence at best, have identified at least two other French
>Quarter addresses, 616 Ursulines St. and 826-30 St. Louis St., as the
>site of a brothel known as the Rising Sun.
>Local researcher Pamela Arceneaux, who has spent years investigating the
>history of prostitution in New Orleans, said she has never found a
>reference to a bordello known as the House of the Rising Sun. Whether
>Dawdy's findings will provide such evidence remains to be seen.
>Below the materials from the two hotels, the diggers found items from
>the early 18th century, when the excavation site apparently was for many
>years a garden behind a house on Chartres Street. There are pieces of
>French faience and Natchez Indian pottery, and Dawdy plans further
>analysis to try to learn whether the seeds and pollen recovered were
>from native or imported French plants.
>Below the garden were several inches of "sterile soil," containing no
>artifacts, presumably from years before the founding of New Orleans in
>1718. But the excavators dug a little deeper and unexpectedly found
>pieces of prehistoric Indian pottery, "very plain everyday ware," dating
>from between 1200 and 1700, in two of the seven excavation spots.
>Although the presence of pottery does not prove there was a long-term
>Indian settlement on the site, Dawdy said she thinks it is good evidence
>of "sustained occupation." Historians have known there was an Indian
>village near Bayou St. John, but she said there has been no evidence
>until now that Indians had lived on the same spot thatBienville chose to
>establish a European town.
>If enough organic material is recovered with the pottery, Dawdy said,
>she can use carbon-14 testing to date the Indians' presence at the site
>more accurately.
>Dawdy, who is writing a book on French colonial New Orleans and formerly
>was director of UNO's New Orleans archaeology program, has been working
>in the city on and off since 1994. She will spend at least a year
>analyzing the finds from the Conti Street site, she said.
>Although it would have been nice to have enough time and workers to dig
>up the entire floor of the old garage, not just a few small sections of
>it, Dawdy said she is "very satisfied with the sampling," especially
>with the 18th century and earlier finds.
>After she has had time to study the material, she said, she probably
>will write a report for the Historic New Orleans Collection, give a
>public talk and publish one or more scholarly articles.--
john garst    [unmask]

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 09:32:23 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(123 lines)


Folks:All that WPA material is in the public domain.  (And, so far as I know, she had no heirs.)For those with the software,  it would be simple to download and burn a CD of  Ms. Hurston's songs.I might try it myself.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Date: Sunday, March 6, 2005 8:54 am
Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song> Ed,
>
> Yes, that recording is Zora Neale Hurston singing "Uncle Bud".
> That song and a few others sung by her can be found at the Florida
> Folklife from the WPA Collections at the Library of Congress
> American Memories online collection.
>
> I have lost the original google search but was able to find this
> description of the recording "...sung and spoken by Hurston.
> Recorded in Jacksonville, Florida, June 18, 1939."   See here:
> http://tinyurl.com/4adb5
>
> Yours,
>
> John Mehlberg
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "edward cray" <[unmask]>
> To: <[unmask]>
> Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2005 5:35 AM
> Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
>
>
> John:
>
> A clarification, if you will:
>
> Is that  Zora Neale Hurston singing "Uncle Bud," or is she merely
> the collector?
>
> And if it is her voice, are there other recordings by her?  Given
> interest in that prominent figure of the Harlem Renaissance, a CD
> with her singing and  storytelling (?) might be a worthy addition to
> a library.
>
> Ed
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
> Date: Saturday, March 5, 2005 5:14 pm
> Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
>
> > Hello
> >
> > I found two recordings in the Florida Folklife from the WPA
> > Collections.The first is Zora Neale Hurston and the second is
> > James
> > Brown & Rufs Bland.
> >
> >        http://tinyurl.com/5umrn
> >
> >        http://tinyurl.com/6jzww
> >
> > Surely a song so widespread should have survived somewhere.
> > Someone must
> > still sing this song.   I will try placing up a few texts on my
> > site and on
> > mudcat to encourage people to come out of the woodworks.
> >
> > I remember reading about "Uncle Bud" in the unpublished part of
> > Roger
> > Abrahams' discertation and in a 1928 Texas folklore journal.
> > Referenceslater.
> >
> > Thanks for you help.
> >
> > Yours,
> >
> > John Mehlberg
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "John Garst" <[unmask]>
> > To: <[unmask]>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 1:17 PM
> > Subject: [Spam][68.1%] Re: "Uncle Bud" song
> >
> >
> > > >----- Original Message -----
> > >>From: "John Mehlberg" <[unmask]>
> > >>
> > >><<Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
> > >>"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
> > >>US...>>
> > >>
> > >>A cleanish version was recorded by Gid Tanner & his Skillet
> > Lickers in
> > >>1928.
> > >>For other information, see the entry in the Traditional Ballad
> > Index.>>
> > >>Peace,
> > >>Paul
> > >
> > > Zora Neale Hurston, Mules and Men?, something on-line at LOC's
> > American> Memory?
> > >
> > > John
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > john garst    [unmask]
> >
>

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Subject: Re: House Of The Rising Sun
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 09:33:05 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(163 lines)


John:Keep us posted.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Date: Sunday, March 6, 2005 9:20 am
Subject: Re: House Of The Rising Sun> We should soon have the book on this by Ted Anthony, and I expect it
> to be authoritative.
>
> John
>
> >Some time back there were some e-mails concerning the House of the
> >Rising Sun. Some of you may be interested in this article which
> ran in
> >today's Times-Picauyne. My favorite used CD shop was next door to the
> >Conti dig, who would have thunk it!
> >
> >
> >A French Quarter excavation yields some tantalizing history
> >Sunday, March 06, 2005
> >By Bruce Eggler
> >Staff writer
> >
> >
> >Dig a hole almost anywhere in the French Quarter and you're likely to
> >discover at least a shard or two of history. Put a trained
> archaeologist>in charge of the digging, and you'll likely do better
> than that.
> >Archaeologist Shannon Dawdy, who recently dug several holes in the
> 500>block of Conti Street, thinks she has uncovered evidence at the
> site>that could help answer at least two intriguing historical
> questions:>
> >-- What and where, if anywhere, was the New Orleans institution made
> >famous in the song "The House of the Rising Sun"?
> >-- Was there an earlier American Indian settlement on the site of
> what>became the French colonial town of New Orleans?
> >The Historic New Orleans Collection decided to commission the
> >archaeological dig after it acquired the property at 535-37 Conti St.
> >The site, a one-story parking garage for most of the 20th century,
> will>be used for a new archives building for the historical museum and
> >research center.
> >The collection has had similar digs done at several other sites it
> owns>in the Quarter.
> >It picked Dawdy, an assistant professor in the anthropology
> department>at the University of Chicago and visiting scholar at the
> University of
> >New Orleans' College of Urban and Public Affairs, to oversee the
> Conti>Street excavation.
> >Because time was short, the local archaeological firm Earth Search
> also>was hired to get as much digging done as possible before
> contractors>moved in late last month to start demolishing the garage.
> >Because the floor of the garage was covered with concrete, the first
> >step was to jackhammer about a dozen test holes through it and
> then dig
> >down 3 or 4 feet to see what turned up. Dawdy and her colleagues then
> >picked seven sites for full-scale excavations, each about 3 feet
> square>and 4 feet deep.
> >It was known that the Conti Street site had been occupied by two
> >successive hotels in the 19th century. The second one opened in
> 1828 and
> >was known over the years as the Richardson, the Conti and the Conti
> >Verandah. It burned to the ground in 1887.
> >But despite the second hotel's long occupancy of the site, few
> artifacts>from it were found, perhaps because the area being
> excavated was used as
> >a carriageway or because the site was well-cleaned after the fire.
> >More items were found from the lower excavation levels associated
> with>the earlier hotel, which operated from about 1808 to 1822,
> when it
> >burned. That establishment was known as the Rising Sun Hotel, and the
> >results are "looking impressively like a bordello," Dawdy said,
> citing>the suggestive combination of broken pieces from "tons of
> liquor>bottles" and several rouge pots.
> >Dawdy said local historians generally have claimed that the earliest
> >formal bordellos in New Orleans did not open until the Civil War,
> a view
> >that let them push the blame for the development on occupying Union
> >troops. It was assumed the Rising Sun Hotel had been a regular
> hostelry.>But in view of what the excavation uncovered, Dawdy finds
> a January 1821
> >ad for the hotel in the Louisiana Gazette of considerable
> interest. The
> >ad says the hotel's new owners will "maintain the character of giving
> >the best entertainment, which this house has enjoyed for twenty years
> >past." It goes on: "Gentlemen may here rely upon finding attentive
> >Servants. The bar will be supplied with genuine good Liquors; and
> at the
> >Table, the fare will be of the best the market or the season will
> afford.">Although the ad does not prove that anything illicit was
> happening at
> >the Rising Sun, it suggests it was a place where men went for a
> good time.
> >Whether the hotel also lent its name to the song is another matter.
> >"The House of the Rising Sun," an old folk song best known through
> Eric>Burdon and The Animals' hit 1964 version, was first written on
> paper in
> >the 1930s by pioneering folk song collector Alan Lomax. He said he
> >learned it from a "yellow-headed miner's daughter" in Kentucky.
> >The melody may go back to 17th century England. Who penned the
> lyrics is
> >unknown, as well as what inspired them and whether the "house" in
> >question was a brothel, gambling hall, prison or something else.
> >The Lomax version put the words in the mouth of a woman: "There is a
> >house in New Orleans they call the Rising Sun. It's been the ruin of
> >many a poor girl, and me, O God, for one." The Animals' version
> changed>"girl" to "boy."
> >Buggy drivers, public relations officials and others, operating on
> >skimpy evidence at best, have identified at least two other French
> >Quarter addresses, 616 Ursulines St. and 826-30 St. Louis St., as the
> >site of a brothel known as the Rising Sun.
> >Local researcher Pamela Arceneaux, who has spent years
> investigating the
> >history of prostitution in New Orleans, said she has never found a
> >reference to a bordello known as the House of the Rising Sun. Whether
> >Dawdy's findings will provide such evidence remains to be seen.
> >Below the materials from the two hotels, the diggers found items from
> >the early 18th century, when the excavation site apparently was
> for many
> >years a garden behind a house on Chartres Street. There are pieces of
> >French faience and Natchez Indian pottery, and Dawdy plans further
> >analysis to try to learn whether the seeds and pollen recovered were
> >from native or imported French plants.
> >Below the garden were several inches of "sterile soil," containing no
> >artifacts, presumably from years before the founding of New
> Orleans in
> >1718. But the excavators dug a little deeper and unexpectedly found
> >pieces of prehistoric Indian pottery, "very plain everyday ware,"
> dating>from between 1200 and 1700, in two of the seven excavation
> spots.>Although the presence of pottery does not prove there was a
> long-term
> >Indian settlement on the site, Dawdy said she thinks it is good
> evidence>of "sustained occupation." Historians have known there was
> an Indian
> >village near Bayou St. John, but she said there has been no evidence
> >until now that Indians had lived on the same spot thatBienville
> chose to
> >establish a European town.
> >If enough organic material is recovered with the pottery, Dawdy said,
> >she can use carbon-14 testing to date the Indians' presence at the
> site>more accurately.
> >Dawdy, who is writing a book on French colonial New Orleans and
> formerly>was director of UNO's New Orleans archaeology program, has
> been working
> >in the city on and off since 1994. She will spend at least a year
> >analyzing the finds from the Conti Street site, she said.
> >Although it would have been nice to have enough time and workers
> to dig
> >up the entire floor of the old garage, not just a few small
> sections of
> >it, Dawdy said she is "very satisfied with the sampling," especially
> >with the 18th century and earlier finds.
> >After she has had time to study the material, she said, she probably
> >will write a report for the Historic New Orleans Collection, give a
> >public talk and publish one or more scholarly articles.
>
> --
> john garst    [unmask]
>

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Subject: Re: House Of The Rising Sun
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 13:04:33 -0500
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I may as well put in my very speculative two cents' worth again:I suspect that the "House of the Rising Sun" was Lulu White's place
in Storyville, at 235 N. Basin Street, known as the "Hall of Mirrors"
and "Mahogany Hall."  The glass transom plate over the front door,
illustrated in Al Rose's "Storyville," p 83, resembles the rays a
rising sun and its rays.  It makes sense to me that a song would
reference one of the most famous bordellos, such as Lulu White's.John>John:
>
>Keep us posted.
>
>Ed
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: John Garst <[unmask]>
>Date: Sunday, March 6, 2005 9:20 am
>Subject: Re: House Of The Rising Sun
>
>>  We should soon have the book on this by Ted Anthony, and I expect it
>>  to be authoritative.
>>
>  > John

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: Andrew Brown <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 12:35:19 -0600
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>From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
>
>Oster's notes to Mean Trouble Blues tell us nothing about the persona of
>uncle Bud, saying merely that bawdy songs about sex lighten frustration. I
>can't
>find any reference to the song in Oster'sm Living Country Blues. However, I
>have a feeling that I've read somewhere that the original Uncle Bud was a
>transfer man for the State of Louisiana. Please don't quote me on that last
>bit.
>At my age I'm liable to read anything."Uncle Bud" Russell was the transfer man in Texas (not Louisiana) for
several decades in the early 20th Century, serving the same role that Joe
Turney aka Turner did in Tennessee earlier. What great sources of folklore
transfer men once provided.AB

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/04/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 15:16:03 -0500
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On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 10:42:43AM -0800, edward cray wrote:
>
> Dolores:
>
> I note that your "search engine" for eBay picked up the Barden folk
>legends volume.  I wonder if you could rewrite that "engine" -- perhaps
>posting to ballad-l in a separate listing -- to pick up more folklore,
>tale, belief, etc., books.
>
> Such a supplement would, first of all, complement the song and ballad
>listings; and, second, would enhance the already considerable value of
>your work on our behalf.
>
> EdHi!        Some of my current searches do find occasional other folklore -
tales, urban legends, folk dance, etc. Among those, the publications of
the Texas Folklore Society and books by or about Zora Neale Hurston
(hope that is spelled correctly!) are among the most frequent finds.        Is there sufficient interest in another Ebay list of this
material to warrant a regular posting? Or perhaps only when something
unusual appears?        Any and all opinions are welcome. :-)                                        Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 15:45:09 EST
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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 21:25:31 -0500
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> In a message dated 06/03/2005 18:45:34 GMT Standard Time,
> [unmask] writes:
>
> "Uncle  Bud" Russell was the transfer man in Texas (not Louisiana) for
> several  decades in the early 20th Century, serving the same role that Joe
> Turney  aka Turner did in Tennessee earlier. What great sources of  folklore
> transfer men once provided.        Could someone please explain what a "transfer man" is?  Both
Dolores and I are scratching our heads.  Is it anything like a
"remittance man"?        Thanks,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: Andrew Brown <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 20:46:23 -0600
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>From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
>         Could someone please explain what a "transfer man" is?  Both
>Dolores and I are scratching our heads.  Is it anything like a
>"remittance man"?A transfer man is the guy whose job it is to pick up convicts from county
jails and take them to the state prison.---Andrew

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Subject: Joe Carter
From: Educational CyberPlayGround <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 6 Mar 2005 22:59:03 -0500
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MACES SPRINGS - The stage of the Carter Fold will have one glowing smile
conspicuously missing during its regular Saturday night music show.Joe Carter, who actually helped in the construction of the venue known for
its down-home feel and was a cornerstone of the preservation of old-time
mountain music, succumbed to cancer Wednesday afternoon at his home."We had been anticipating and trying to get ourselves ready for this, but it
still hurts to give him up," said Carter Fold executive and Carter's niece,
Rita Forrester. "He meant so much to me, to Janette, and so many people.
They broke the mold when they made my Uncle Joe.''Carter, 78, was just five months old when he accompanied his mother and
father, A.P. and Sara Carter, on a trip from Maces Springs to Bristol in
June 1927 that would become one of the most famous recording sessions in
country music history.Friend and WGOC Bluegrass Show host Tim White said Thursday that Joe was the
last direct connection to anyone who was at that original session that took
place on State Street that virtually launched the careers of the Carter
Family and has been frequently called "the big bang of country music.''"Years ago, I asked Joe if he remembered being at the session, and he told
me he didn't remember much about it but wished he would have because that
would have been some story to tell,'' said White."He told me that his older sister Gladys had to baby-sit him while his mom
and dad were involved in those recording sessions. (Gladys) told him that
she would take him down to Beaver Creek and throw grass in the creek to
pacify him."Joe was the last living link to those sessions. Helen, Maybelle's daughter,
was there, but she was still inside Maybelle's tummy because Maybelle was
eight months pregnant at the time of the recordings.''White also likened Carter to "a big ol' little boy,'' who was not only known
for his pure bass voice, which he would use as he accompanied sister Janette
Carter many nights on stage, but for his uncanny animal sounds he would
make, which were recently a part of a DVD produced by Marty Stuart that
accompanied his latest album, "Country Music.''Stuart, family friend and country legend Tom T. Hall, and John Carter Cash,
son of the late Johnny and June Carter Cash, are listed among the honorary
pallbearers for Joe's funeral at 2 p.m. Sunday at Mount Vernon United
Methodist Church, where he will be laid to rest beside his parents in the
church's cemetery.Calling hours for Carter will be from 4 to 8 p.m. Saturday at Scott County
Funeral Home in Weber City."Joe always liked to have fun, and he was truly the life of a party. If you
saw him from a distance, you would think he was some kind of salty old goat.
But once you talked to him, you found out what a funny guy he was and how
special a human being he was. I am going to miss his laugh and miss him
altogether,'' White said.Forrester commented on Carter's 78th birthday party held at his home on
Sunday, which she said was a blessing."He knew that he was surrounded by love. He had been struggling with this
for a while, but he remained loyal to the Fold. He even came and performed
in his wheelchair, including his last performance a few weeks ago,'' said
Forrester.Carter, who served in the latter part of World War II in the U.S. Navy and
later became a master carpenter, used his woodworking traits to the fullest
in helping build the structure that has been used to keep the memories of
A.P., Sara and Maybelle and the music they created in the shadows of Clinch
Mountain alive."He hammered boards and put seats in when that building first went up. It
was his love, and it meant so much to him to see the Fold become what it has
grown into,'' said Forrester.She also noted that he helped in the construction of other notable landmarks
in the region, including Dobyns-Bennett High School and various facilities
at Breaks Interstate Park.The passing of Joe Carter marks another sorrowful time that has come upon
the valley near Hiltons, which mourned the deaths of Johnny and June Carter
Cash in 2003 with an outpouring of support for a family that has become part
of the region's history.Two weeks ago, a Leon Kiser Memorial musical tribute show was conducted at
the Fold, and a program was given to concert goers that featured Joe and
other family members hard at work constructing the music center.White says it gave him a message that he had dwelled on for years and what
Joe and the Carter Family meant to the local music scene and to the mountain
music that he was so proud to produce."I thought what an undertaking that was for an old country boy there who
just wanted to see this music do good. And he did it. And over the years, he
has put many stars in his crown, because he helped people,'' said White.Forrester said the Saturday evening tradition that Joe and Janette began
back in 1975 will continue this Saturday."We still plan to present a show at the Fold, which will end up being a
tribute to Joe. All of us may not be there because of the funeral services,
but we feel like Uncle Joe would have wanted us to go with the show,'' she
said.Carter is also survived by three daughters and seven grandchildren.According to a message posted on the Carter Family Fold Web site Thursday,
flowers or a donation to the Mount Vernon United Methodist Church Cemetery
Fund can be sent to the following address: Mount Vernon United Methodist
Church Cemetery Fund, c/o Mrs. Flo Wolfe, Route 1, Box 76A, Hiltons, Va.
24258.More information on Joe Carter and the Carter Family is available on the
Internet at www.carterfamilyfold.org.>------------------------------
>
>Date:    Sat, 5 Mar 2005 16:09:35 -0600
>From:    "Robert B. Waltz" <[unmask]>
>Subject: Death of Joe Carter
>
>I've been sick all week, so maybe this came up and no one
>mentioned it, but I thought it better to repeat than leave
>it out.
>
>Joe Carter, the son of A. P. and Sara, died last Wednesday of
>cancer at the age of 78. He was present at the Bristol Sessions --
>thought to be the last living person to have been associated with
>the events. He recorded with his father A. P. and sister Janette
>on the Acme label from 1952-1956, and later sang bass with Sara
>and Maybelle.
>
>I don't have much else in the way of detail.
>
>--
>Bob Waltz
>[unmask]
>
>"The one thing we learn from history --
>    is that no one ever learns from history."<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
Guavaberry Books
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/GuavaberryBooks/
Domino - Traditional Children's Songs, Proverbs, and Culture U.S.V.I.
Find Music Books by The Funk Brothers  - 2x Grammy WinnersThe Educational CyberPlayGround
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/National Children's Folksong Repository
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Culdesac/Repository/NCFR.htmlHot List of Schools Online
Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/index.html7 Hot Site Awards
New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/04/05
From: Malcolm Douglas <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 7 Mar 2005 07:13:39 -0000
Content-Type:text/plain
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Dolores Nichols" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: 06 March 2005 20:16
Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/04/05> On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 10:42:43AM -0800, edward cray wrote:> > I note that your "search engine" for eBay picked up the Barden folk
> >legends volume.  I wonder if you could rewrite that "engine" -- perhaps
> >posting to ballad-l in a separate listing -- to pick up more folklore,
> >tale, belief, etc., books.
> >
> > Such a supplement would, first of all, complement the song and ballad
> >listings; and, second, would enhance the already considerable value of
> >your work on our behalf.>         Some of my current searches do find occasional other folklore -
> tales, urban legends, folk dance, etc. Among those, the publications of
> the Texas Folklore Society and books by or about Zora Neale Hurston
> (hope that is spelled correctly!) are among the most frequent finds.
>
>         Is there sufficient interest in another Ebay list of this
> material to warrant a regular posting? Or perhaps only when something
> unusual appears?
>
>         Any and all opinions are welcome. :-)Anything you may come up with is likely to be of interest. A lot of us have picked up things we'd
have missed otherwise if not for your sterling work. The more, the better, I'd say; though I may
have to work extra night shifts and make some more shelves.Best regardsMalcolm Douglas

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Subject: Boozoo's "Uncle Bud" song
From: bingham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 7 Mar 2005 14:42:22 -0500
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Back in the early- to mid-1990's, I believe, zydeco star
Boozoo Chavis did a song called "Uncle Bud" which seems to
stem from the same root as the song you're looking for, but
the words are considerably different, though just as
graphic. (I believe he also did a cleaned-up version). Can't
recall the name of the CD (on Rounder), but it was the only
zydeco CD ever to come with an Explicit Lyrics warning label
(though there were only two bawdy songs on it; believe
me, that was enough to warrant the label).
Tom Bingham
School of Music
SUNY Fredonia

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 7 Mar 2005 14:11:15 -0600
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Hello everyone,Here is a PDF of "Six New Negro Songs with Music" by Nicolas
Joseph Hutchingson Smith in the _Follow the Drinkin' Gou'd_
journal of the Texas Folk-lore Society 1928.  Download here:
http://tinyurl.com/4fcjp     The last song is "O, Bud" of which
he gives one bowdlerized verse.A six stanza bawdy "Uncle Bud" with music can be found on pgs
249-50 of Roger Abrahams' "Negro Folklore in South Philadelphia"
unpublished 1962 dissertation.Yours,John Mehlberg

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 7 Mar 2005 15:24:40 -0500
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On 2005/03/06 at 08:46:23PM -0600, Andrew Brown wrote:> >From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
> >        Could someone please explain what a "transfer man" is?  Both        [ ... ]> A transfer man is the guy whose job it is to pick up convicts from county
> jails and take them to the state prison.        Thank you!        Enjoy,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: Boozoo's "Uncle Bud" song
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 7 Mar 2005 14:14:08 -0800
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Subject: Re: Boozoo's "Uncle Bud" song
From: bingham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 7 Mar 2005 17:55:18 -0500
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"Uncle Bud" and "Deacon Jones" are on the same Boozoo Chavis
CD, "Who Stole My Monkey", and if memory serves, they're
both racy.
>
> Could you be thinking of Boozoo's song, "Deacon Jones" ?
>
> JL
>
> bingham <[unmask]> wrote:
> Back in the early- to mid-1990's, I believe, zydeco star
> Boozoo Chavis did a song called "Uncle Bud" which seems to
> stem from the same root as the song you're looking for,
> but the words are considerably different, though just as
> graphic. (I believe he also did a cleaned-up version).
> Can't recall the name of the CD (on Rounder), but it was
> the only zydeco CD ever to come with an Explicit Lyrics
> warning label (though there were only two bawdy songs on
> it; believe me, that was enough to warrant the label).
> Tom Bingham
> School of Music
> SUNY Fredonia
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday!
>  Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" / "Deacon Jones"
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 7 Mar 2005 16:22:04 -0800
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Subject: sneaky commercial announcemnt
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 7 Mar 2005 21:56:24 -0500
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Or you can get it from CAMSCO (who carries the entire Rounder catalog as
well as everything else in print) for $12.98Jonathan Lighter wrote:> A 1999 interview with Boozoo Chavis (1930-2001) that mentions these
> two songs (from his childhood) is here:
>
> http://www.offbeat.com/ob9904/boozoo.html
>
> "Who Stole My Monkey?" (1999) is available from Rounderstore here:
>
> http://www.rounderstore.com/retail/product.asp?P=1166121562
>
> JL
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday!
> Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web
> <http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/>

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Subject: Re: sneaky commercial announcemnt
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 05:18:56 -0800
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text/plain(31 lines) , text/html(6 lines)


Sorry, your browser doesn't support iframes.


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Subject: Journal Resources
From: Cliff Abrams <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 05:30:48 -0800
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John (and others),Are there resources, finding tools, etc. for old
journals? Did you make the ZIP fiile of the Texas
journal? I was looking for The Journal of Irish
Folklore (or some similar title-- it's been a while),
and, short of going to Dublin, was unable to find it.
Even if one does find the publication, how does one
look at it, get copies and so forth?What reminded me of all this is the intro to O Bud!
Guess you have to go to the Harvard College Library to
find those "unprintable" stanzas."The nature of this song is such as to prohibit the
printing of the six collected stanzas that go with the
music. The words are deposited in the Harvard College
Library, as well as at the College of William and
Mary..."
-----------------------------------------------------------Here is a PDF of "Six New Negro Songs with Music" by
Nicolas Joseph Hutchingson Smith in the _Follow the
Drinkin' Gou'd_ journal of the Texas Folk-lore Society
1928.

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Subject: Re: Journal Resources
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 08:49:02 -0600
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Dear Cliff,I made the zip of the PDF myself as I own a copy of the Journal.
As far as I know most of the state folklore journals are not online.
There is some underground "trafficking" in scholarly works which are
difficult or impossible to get but necessary for research.  What
once was sharing photocopies is now sharing a self-made PDF.   If
you tell me what journal you want, I may be able to find you a copy.Yes, if I want a copy of the "O, Bud" I will have to get it from
Harvard or William and Mary.   The world was different then and even
scholars could not share what they had found if it had unacceptable
words or concepts.   At least he had the decency to record that the
song exists and where the song can be found.  Many of the best known
ballad scholars were less kind with the songs they encountered.
Either they refused to collect the song or, if they did collect it,
they completely rewrote the songs.Yours,John Mehlberg.----- Original Message -----
From: "Cliff Abrams" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2005 7:30 AM
Subject: Journal ResourcesJohn (and others),Are there resources, finding tools, etc. for old
journals? Did you make the ZIP file of the Texas
journal? I was looking for The Journal of Irish
Folklore (or some similar title-- it's been a while),
and, short of going to Dublin, was unable to find it.
Even if one does find the publication, how does one
look at it, get copies and so forth?What reminded me of all this is the intro to O Bud!
Guess you have to go to the Harvard College Library to
find those "unprintable" stanzas."The nature of this song is such as to prohibit the
printing of the six collected stanzas that go with the
music. The words are deposited in the Harvard College
Library, as well as at the College of William and
Mary..."
-----------------------------------------------------------Here is a PDF of "Six New Negro Songs with Music" by
Nicolas Joseph Hutchingson Smith in the _Follow the
Drinkin' Gou'd_ journal of the Texas Folk-lore Society
1928.

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 14:12:32 -0500
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Seehttp://jargonbooks.com/vancerandolph.htmlfor a few "Uncle Bud" verses.  I suspect that there are more in the
Randolph/Legman "Unprintable" volumes, which I don't have in my
office right now.John

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 14:16:25 -0500
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See Bud Russell's grandson's WWW site, with lots of info about Bud, here:http://texashideout.tripod.com/russell.htmlJohn

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 14:27:42 -0500
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A CD by Bob Walser, "When Our Ship Comes Home," from The Tradition
Bearers, PO Box 26064 KILMARNOCK, KA2 0YG, Scotland, is said to
contain a song entitled "Uncle Bud."http://www.thetraditionbearers.com/htmfiles/recordings_oldandnew.htmJohn

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Roberts <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 14:41:41 -0500
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According to his liner notes, Bob's version is taken from Mary Wheeler's
"Steamboatin' Days: Folk Songs of the River Packet Era" (Baton Rouge: LA
State U. Press).JohnOn 3/8/05 2:27 PM, "John Garst" <[unmask]> wrote:> A CD by Bob Walser, "When Our Ship Comes Home," from The Tradition
> Bearers, PO Box 26064 KILMARNOCK, KA2 0YG, Scotland, is said to
> contain a song entitled "Uncle Bud."
>
> http://www.thetraditionbearers.com/htmfiles/recordings_oldandnew.htm
>
> John

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 14:46:11 -0500
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An Amazon.com search by song title, "Uncle Bud," results in 69 hits.
Not all of  these are "our" song, but some are.John

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: George Madaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 14:46:44 -0500
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It is on that CD. Here are the notes that describe the song:
."Uncle Bud is taken from Mary Wheeler's fine Steamboatin' Days Folk
Songs of the River Packet Era (Baton Rouge Louisiana State U Press
1944} the only print collection to include a number of riverboatmen's
working songs.I played it and the first verse goes: Well old Uncle Bud coming down
the road hauling women by the wagon load
The chorus is Uncle Bud Uncle Bud Uncle Bud Bud Bud I got it Uncle Bud
The remaining verses are not in anyway bawdy unless it is code I don't
understandGeorgeGeorge F Madaus
Professor Emeritus
Boston College
On Mar, 08, 2005, at 2:27 PM, John Garst wrote:> A CD by Bob Walser, "When Our Ship Comes Home," from The Tradition
> Bearers, PO Box 26064 KILMARNOCK, KA2 0YG, Scotland, is said to
> contain a song entitled "Uncle Bud."
>
> http://www.thetraditionbearers.com/htmfiles/recordings_oldandnew.htm
>
> John

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 14:54:26 -0500
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Tampa Red recorded "Uncle Bud."John

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: Roy Berkeley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 15:41:41 -0500
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Of course -- "'Cause Mr. Bud Russell/ He means to starve the men..."----- Original Message -----
From: "John Garst" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2005 2:16 PM
Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song> See Bud Russell's grandson's WWW site, with lots of info about Bud, here:
>
> http://texashideout.tripod.com/russell.html
>
> John
>

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine republication
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 17:58:18 EST
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For anyone with deep pockets:http://www.periodicals.com/index.htmlPartners with over 40 years experience, we are major reprinters of academic
journals and specialize in the supply of antiquarian backsets, back volumes and
back issues of out-of-print journals and serialsfor example:PERCY SOCIETY, LONDON. PUBLICATIONS
Vols. 1-30 (i.e. nos. 1-94). London, 1840-1852. Bound
Complete set $ 2,150.-drool.*sigh*Heather

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/08/05 (Folklore)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 19:04:09 -0500
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Hi!        Here is a first cut/sample of the proposed Ebay list of
folklore, tales, etc. Comments are welcome, encouraged and solicited.        4532578804 - Jack Always Seeks His Fortune by Davis, 1992, $5.95
(ends Mar-09-05 17:35:59 PST)        4532618012 - The Best of Texas Folk and Folklore 1916-1954 by
Boatright, 1998, $5.99 (ends Mar-09-05 20:07:35 PST)        6950050946 - Grandfather Tales by Chase, 1948, $4.99 (ends
Mar-10-05 19:38:53 PST)        5563184623 - Tennessee Folklore Society Bulletin, 3 issues,
1966-67, $6.99 (ends Mar-11-05 12:37:36 PST)        4533392200 - Outwitting the Devil:  Jack Tales from Wise County,
Virginia by Perdue, 1987, $4.95 (ends Mar-12-05 11:00:22 PST)        4533393751 - Pigsfoot Jelly & Persimmon Beer: Foodways from the
Virginia Writers' Project by Perdue, 1992, $4.95 (ends Mar-12-05
11:05:37 PST)        6160318784 - Celtic Fairy Tales by Jacobs, reprint, $7.95 (ends
Mar-12-05 11:52:17 PST)        5564138851 - Truculent Rustics Molly (Morris) Dancing in East
Anglia before 1940 by Bradtke, 0.99 GBP (ends Mar-13-05 10:39:34 PST)        4533781602 - Encyclopedia of Urban Legends by Brunvand, 2002, $3
(ends Mar-13-05 16:35:01 PST)        4533850365 - Cajun And Creole Folktales by Ancelet, 1994, $9.95
(ends Mar-13-05 20:24:07 PST)        6950575785 - The word on the Brazos by Brewer, 1953, $5 (ends
Mar-14-05 08:01:08 PST)        4533930958 - THE ROADS OF HOME ... LANES AND LEGENDS OF NEW
JERSEY by Beck, 1956, $5.95 (ends Mar-14-05 20:15:00 PST)        6949116747 - HOT SPRINGS AND HELL by Randolph, 1965, $24.95
(ends ?)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/08/05 (Folklore)
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 8 Mar 2005 21:03:12 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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Dolores:Yes, yes, yes!Even if your trolling pulls up a lot of skank, Doris, there are good things here.First, of course, would be the Randolph, _Hot Springs  and Hell,_ one of that great collector's anthologies of folk tales/jokes/anecdotes from the Ozarks.  Though the books are scarce, so far as I know this is the only one that was ever reprinted, this by the late Ken Goldstein's Folklore Associates.  (Ken, probably as responsible as anyone for the folk song revival, never made a distinction between song and lore.  In his mind, it was all part of the same multi-colored quilt.)I look forward to further lists, Dolores.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Date: Tuesday, March 8, 2005 4:04 pm
Subject: Ebay List - 03/08/05 (Folklore)> Hi!
>
>        Here is a first cut/sample of the proposed Ebay list of
> folklore, tales, etc. Comments are welcome, encouraged and solicited.
>
>        4532578804 - Jack Always Seeks His Fortune by Davis, 1992,
> $5.95(ends Mar-09-05 17:35:59 PST)
>
>        4532618012 - The Best of Texas Folk and Folklore 1916-1954 by
> Boatright, 1998, $5.99 (ends Mar-09-05 20:07:35 PST)
>
>        6950050946 - Grandfather Tales by Chase, 1948, $4.99 (ends
> Mar-10-05 19:38:53 PST)
>
>        5563184623 - Tennessee Folklore Society Bulletin, 3 issues,
> 1966-67, $6.99 (ends Mar-11-05 12:37:36 PST)
>
>        4533392200 - Outwitting the Devil:  Jack Tales from Wise
> County,Virginia by Perdue, 1987, $4.95 (ends Mar-12-05 11:00:22 PST)
>
>        4533393751 - Pigsfoot Jelly & Persimmon Beer: Foodways from
> theVirginia Writers' Project by Perdue, 1992, $4.95 (ends Mar-12-05
> 11:05:37 PST)
>
>        6160318784 - Celtic Fairy Tales by Jacobs, reprint, $7.95
> (endsMar-12-05 11:52:17 PST)
>
>        5564138851 - Truculent Rustics Molly (Morris) Dancing in East
> Anglia before 1940 by Bradtke, 0.99 GBP (ends Mar-13-05 10:39:34 PST)
>
>        4533781602 - Encyclopedia of Urban Legends by Brunvand,
> 2002, $3
> (ends Mar-13-05 16:35:01 PST)
>
>        4533850365 - Cajun And Creole Folktales by Ancelet, 1994,
> $9.95(ends Mar-13-05 20:24:07 PST)
>
>        6950575785 - The word on the Brazos by Brewer, 1953, $5 (ends
> Mar-14-05 08:01:08 PST)
>
>        4533930958 - THE ROADS OF HOME ... LANES AND LEGENDS OF NEW
> JERSEY by Beck, 1956, $5.95 (ends Mar-14-05 20:15:00 PST)
>
>        6949116747 - HOT SPRINGS AND HELL by Randolph, 1965, $24.95
> (ends ?)
>
>                                Happy Bidding!
>                                Dolores
>
> --
> Dolores Nichols                 |
> D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
> Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
>        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?
>

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Subject: Journals
From: Cliff Abrams <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 9 Mar 2005 05:45:06 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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John,Thanks very much for the information. I'll look
into... what i'm looking for and contact you directly.C.
"... As far as I know most of the state folklore
journals are
not online... If you tell me what journal you want, I
may be able to find
you a copy."

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Subject: Re: House Of The Rising Sun
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 9 Mar 2005 11:29:26 -0500
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>We should soon have the book on this by Ted Anthony, and I expect it
>to be authoritative.
>
>JohnTed tells me that the book is scheduled to appear in mid-2006.John

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/08/05 (Folklore)
From: Norm Cohen <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 9 Mar 2005 11:09:43 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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Dolores:
Thanks for all the helpful work!
Norm----- Original Message -----
From: "Dolores Nichols" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2005 4:04 PM
Subject: Ebay List - 03/08/05 (Folklore)> Hi!
>
>         Here is a first cut/sample of the proposed Ebay list of
> folklore, tales, etc. Comments are welcome, encouraged and solicited.
>
>         4532578804 - Jack Always Seeks His Fortune by Davis, 1992, $5.95
> (ends Mar-09-05 17:35:59 PST)
>
>         4532618012 - The Best of Texas Folk and Folklore 1916-1954 by
> Boatright, 1998, $5.99 (ends Mar-09-05 20:07:35 PST)
>
>         6950050946 - Grandfather Tales by Chase, 1948, $4.99 (ends
> Mar-10-05 19:38:53 PST)
>
>         5563184623 - Tennessee Folklore Society Bulletin, 3 issues,
> 1966-67, $6.99 (ends Mar-11-05 12:37:36 PST)
>
>         4533392200 - Outwitting the Devil:  Jack Tales from Wise County,
> Virginia by Perdue, 1987, $4.95 (ends Mar-12-05 11:00:22 PST)
>
>         4533393751 - Pigsfoot Jelly & Persimmon Beer: Foodways from the
> Virginia Writers' Project by Perdue, 1992, $4.95 (ends Mar-12-05
> 11:05:37 PST)
>
>         6160318784 - Celtic Fairy Tales by Jacobs, reprint, $7.95 (ends
> Mar-12-05 11:52:17 PST)
>
>         5564138851 - Truculent Rustics Molly (Morris) Dancing in East
> Anglia before 1940 by Bradtke, 0.99 GBP (ends Mar-13-05 10:39:34 PST)
>
>         4533781602 - Encyclopedia of Urban Legends by Brunvand, 2002, $3
> (ends Mar-13-05 16:35:01 PST)
>
>         4533850365 - Cajun And Creole Folktales by Ancelet, 1994, $9.95
> (ends Mar-13-05 20:24:07 PST)
>
>         6950575785 - The word on the Brazos by Brewer, 1953, $5 (ends
> Mar-14-05 08:01:08 PST)
>
>         4533930958 - THE ROADS OF HOME ... LANES AND LEGENDS OF NEW
> JERSEY by Beck, 1956, $5.95 (ends Mar-14-05 20:15:00 PST)
>
>         6949116747 - HOT SPRINGS AND HELL by Randolph, 1965, $24.95
> (ends ?)
>
>                                 Happy Bidding!
>                                 Dolores
>
> --
> Dolores Nichols                 |
> D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
> Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
>         --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?
>

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Subject: AFS Astray?
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 9 Mar 2005 14:03:33 -0800
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Folks:We've come a long way from Kansas, Toto.Ed---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------From     Margaret Yocom <[unmask]>
Sent    Wednesday, March 9, 2005 1:19 pm
To      [unmask]
Subject         [PUBLORE] Sign Folklore & Creative Writing petitionHello,  everyone. Amy Skillman and I would like to ask you for your
support in establishing a new Folklore & Creative Writing Section of
AFS. If you're willing -- and you're an AFS member-- please sign this
petition at the very end and email it back to me as soon as possible--
but especially before 16 March.Please pass this request on to any AFS person who might be interested.Thanks for considering our petition.
Peggy Yocom________________________________________________________________A Petition to the AFS Board of Directors for Establishing theFolklore and Creative Writing SectionRationale:
Many members of the American Folklore Society have an abiding interest
in creative writing. Recent productions include, for example, the novel
by Betty Belanus; the theater work of Elaine Lawless and her students;
the non-fiction of Barry Lopez; and the poetry of Susan Stewart and
Steven Zeitlin. Joanne Mulcahy of Lewis and Clark College, Portland, OR,
sponsors a summer workshop on creative writing and ethnography. The most
recent volume of the Journal of American Folklore has published works in
creative ethnography. In September 2005, the New York Folklore Society
will sponsor a conference in conjunction with creative writers of the
Hudson Valley Writers Center in honor of the 60th anniversary of the New
York folklore journal, now named Voices. Also, folklorists have long
studied the creative forms of others: cowboy, logger, and fisher poetry,
for example. With this Section, we hope to highlight the talents of
folklorists, provide an opportunity for dialogue, and consider how
creative writing has influenced the field of folklore-what we do and how
we do it-and how folklore influences creative writers. We also believe
that our work with creative writing will broaden public awareness of
folklore and of the issues folklorists explore.Goals:
The Folklore and Creative Writing section intends to (1) gather
folklorists with an interest in creative writing; (2) hold regular
panels and events such as readings and section-sponsored speakers, at
the AFS annual meeting; (3) provide support for folklorists who write,
teach, or organize workshops in poetry, drama, fiction writing, creative
non-fiction writing, and more;
(4) provide educational opportunities for folklorists who want to
improve their creative writing skills; (5) publicize and promote the
creative performance folklorists are doing, such as the theater piece
that immigrant women are creating with the sponsorship of the Institute
for Cultural Partnerships; (6) create additional venues for the
publication and performance of creative writing by folklorists; (7)
establish dialogues between AFS and creative writing associations, such
as the Association of Writers and Writing Programs, by sponsoring panels
at their conferences (http://www.awpwriter.org); and (8) work with the
Storytelling Section of AFS on programs of mutual interest.Operations:
The Section intends to (1) hold an annual meeting during the annual AFS
conference; (2) maintain a listserve among the section members; (3)
maintain a website.Initially the Section will not have dues, but it may collect dues in the
future to offset expenses. To become a member of the Section,
folklorists are asked to email Margaret "Peggy" Yocom at [unmask]At the first meeting of the section, members will make final membership
decisions. For example, the Section could have two co-conveners who
serve 2 years, in staggered terms. Co-conveners and the Committee could
be voted into office during the AFS Conference. Should the Section be
established, it will be moderated by the sponsors of this petition:
Peggy Yocom of  George Mason University, Fairfax, VA, and Amy Skillman,
Institute of Cultural Partnerships, Harrisburg, PA.To support the establishment of the Folklore and Creative Writing Section:
Please replace the phrase (YOUR NAME, YOUR AFFILIATION) below with your
name and your affiliation, and email this message back to Peggy Yocom at
[unmask] as soon as possible, before Wednesday 16 March 2005.I,    (YOUR NAME, YOUR AFFILIATION), as an AFS member, support this
petition to establish a Folklore and Creative Writing Section of the
American Folklore Society.

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/09/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 9 Mar 2005 19:54:46 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hi!        Here is the regular Ebay list for this week.        SONGSTERS        6517045923 - The Army Songster Dedicated to the Army of Northern
Virginia, 1902, $8 (ends Mar-13-05 17:57:40 PST)        6950872353 - CHARLEY GLEASON'S "NEVER SAY DIE" SONGSTER, 1870,
$0.99 (ends Mar-19-05 08:43:49 PST)        MISCELLANEOUS        4707812335 - RAMBLING BOYS-ULSTER BALLADS by Cinnamond, LP, 1975,
$9.99 (ends Mar-13-05 11:05:00 PST)        4708292653 - THE UNEXPURGATED FOLK SONGS OF MEN, LP, 1960, $9.99
(ends Mar-14-05 20:24:30 PST)        3880336829 - TRADITIONAL MUSIC MAKER, magazine, Feb-Mar 1998, 0.99
GBP (ends Mar-15-05 13:31:09 PST)        6950808603 - JEMF Quarterly, summer 1973, $3.99 (ends Mar-15-05
19:08:38 PST)        7305825399 - Broadside, The Irish Rake, 1860?, $9.50 (ends
Mar-17-05 20:30:00 PST)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        7305517909 - A TOUCH ON THE TIMES. SONGS OF SOCIAL CHANGE 1770 TO
1914 by Palmer, 1.99 GBP (ends Mar-10-05 14:32:34 PST)        5173059252 - Broadside, 1863?, 5.50 GBP (ends Mar-10-05 15:24:41 PST)        4532889160 - Texas Folk Songs by Owens, 1950, $9.99 (ends Mar-10-05
17:29:04 PST)        4533397762 - The English and Scottish Popular Ballads by Child,
Russian-English edition, 1988, $9.99 (ends Mar-12-05 11:17:45 PST)        7305892281 - Folk Dances and Singing Games, 1938, $0.99 (ends
Mar-12-05 11:25:03 PST)        7305955467 - Folk Songs From The Southern Highlands by Henry, 1938,
$15.50 (ends Mar-12-05 16:55:51 PST)        4533491289 - Traditional American Folk Songs by Warner, 1984, $9.99
(ends Mar-12-05 17:54:36 PST)        6949928738 - A GUN-ROOM DITTY BOX by Bowles, 1898, 0.99 GBP (ends
Mar-13-05 07:40:35 PST)        7306617545 - KERR'S 'BUCHAN' BOTHY BALLADS, 2 GBP (ends Mar-13-05
09:20:18 PST)        6950458506 - A Lytell Geste Of Robin Hode by gutch, 1867, $12.50
(ends Mar-13-05 13:08:21 PST)        4533777331 - ONE HUNDRED ENGLISH FOLKSONGS by Sharp, $4.88 (ends
Mar-13-05 16:16:15 PST)        6949775978 - Folk-Songs, Chanteys, and Singing Games by Sharp &
Farnsworth, $9.99 (ends Mar-13-05 17:47:00 PST)        6517055428 - 101 FAVORITE BALLADS, COWBOY & MOUNTAIN SONGS by
Cross, 1940?, $4.99 (ends Mar-13-05 20:00:00 PST)        6950632196 - English and Scottish Ballads by Child, 8 volumes in 4,
1885 edition, $95 (ends Mar-14-05 14:12:27 PST)        3880336829 - TRADITIONAL MUSIC MAKER, magazine, Feb-Mar 1998, 0.99
GBP (ends Mar-15-05 13:31:09 PST)        6950527636 - Songs of the North by MacLeod & Boulton, 1910?,
$49.95 AU (ends Mar-16-05 20:15:14 PST)        4533929517 - Victoria's Inferno: Songs of the Old Mills, Mines,
Manufactories, Canals and Railways by Raven, 5.50 GBP (ends Mar-17-05
05:28:41 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/09/05
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 9 Mar 2005 17:58:31 -0800
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Folks:Be advised, the important Mellinger E. Henry volume turns up rarely on Abebooks, if at all.  I would estimate that a rare book dealer would unblushingly ask $100 for the book.  (If I did not own it, I would never post this notice.)Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Date: Wednesday, March 9, 2005 4:54 pm
Subject: Ebay List - 03/09/05> Hi!
>
>        Here is the regular Ebay list for this week.
>
>        SONGSTERS
>
>        6517045923 - The Army Songster Dedicated to the Army of
> NorthernVirginia, 1902, $8 (ends Mar-13-05 17:57:40 PST)
>
>        6950872353 - CHARLEY GLEASON'S "NEVER SAY DIE" SONGSTER, 1870,
> $0.99 (ends Mar-19-05 08:43:49 PST)
>
>        MISCELLANEOUS
>
>        4707812335 - RAMBLING BOYS-ULSTER BALLADS by Cinnamond, LP,
> 1975,$9.99 (ends Mar-13-05 11:05:00 PST)
>
>        4708292653 - THE UNEXPURGATED FOLK SONGS OF MEN, LP, 1960,
> $9.99(ends Mar-14-05 20:24:30 PST)
>
>        3880336829 - TRADITIONAL MUSIC MAKER, magazine, Feb-Mar
> 1998, 0.99
> GBP (ends Mar-15-05 13:31:09 PST)
>
>        6950808603 - JEMF Quarterly, summer 1973, $3.99 (ends Mar-
> 15-05
> 19:08:38 PST)
>
>        7305825399 - Broadside, The Irish Rake, 1860?, $9.50 (ends
> Mar-17-05 20:30:00 PST)
>
>        SONGBOOKS, ETC.
>
>        7305517909 - A TOUCH ON THE TIMES. SONGS OF SOCIAL CHANGE
> 1770 TO
> 1914 by Palmer, 1.99 GBP (ends Mar-10-05 14:32:34 PST)
>
>        5173059252 - Broadside, 1863?, 5.50 GBP (ends Mar-10-05
> 15:24:41 PST)
>
>        4532889160 - Texas Folk Songs by Owens, 1950, $9.99 (ends
> Mar-10-05
> 17:29:04 PST)
>
>        4533397762 - The English and Scottish Popular Ballads by
> Child,Russian-English edition, 1988, $9.99 (ends Mar-12-05 11:17:45
> PST)
>        7305892281 - Folk Dances and Singing Games, 1938, $0.99 (ends
> Mar-12-05 11:25:03 PST)
>
>        7305955467 - Folk Songs From The Southern Highlands by
> Henry, 1938,
> $15.50 (ends Mar-12-05 16:55:51 PST)
>
>        4533491289 - Traditional American Folk Songs by Warner,
> 1984, $9.99
> (ends Mar-12-05 17:54:36 PST)
>
>        6949928738 - A GUN-ROOM DITTY BOX by Bowles, 1898, 0.99 GBP
> (endsMar-13-05 07:40:35 PST)
>
>        7306617545 - KERR'S 'BUCHAN' BOTHY BALLADS, 2 GBP (ends Mar-
> 13-05
> 09:20:18 PST)
>
>        6950458506 - A Lytell Geste Of Robin Hode by gutch, 1867,
> $12.50(ends Mar-13-05 13:08:21 PST)
>
>        4533777331 - ONE HUNDRED ENGLISH FOLKSONGS by Sharp, $4.88
> (endsMar-13-05 16:16:15 PST)
>
>        6949775978 - Folk-Songs, Chanteys, and Singing Games by
> Sharp &
> Farnsworth, $9.99 (ends Mar-13-05 17:47:00 PST)
>
>        6517055428 - 101 FAVORITE BALLADS, COWBOY & MOUNTAIN SONGS by
> Cross, 1940?, $4.99 (ends Mar-13-05 20:00:00 PST)
>
>        6950632196 - English and Scottish Ballads by Child, 8
> volumes in 4,
> 1885 edition, $95 (ends Mar-14-05 14:12:27 PST)
>
>        3880336829 - TRADITIONAL MUSIC MAKER, magazine, Feb-Mar
> 1998, 0.99
> GBP (ends Mar-15-05 13:31:09 PST)
>
>        6950527636 - Songs of the North by MacLeod & Boulton, 1910?,
> $49.95 AU (ends Mar-16-05 20:15:14 PST)
>
>        4533929517 - Victoria's Inferno: Songs of the Old Mills,
> Mines,Manufactories, Canals and Railways by Raven, 5.50 GBP (ends
> Mar-17-05
> 05:28:41 PST)
>
>                                Happy Bidding!
>                                Dolores
>
>
> --
> Dolores Nichols                 |
> D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
> Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
>        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?
>

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Subject: Tushielaw
From: Jean Lepley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 9 Mar 2005 22:03:26 -0800
Content-Type:TEXT/PLAIN
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TEXT/PLAIN(70 lines)


Okay, here are the words as I hear them --Tushielaw's a hunting ga'en
And gallant is his deed
For he's ta'en the heart o' lady March
The fairest maid in TweedAnd her fayther he has banished him
For he's below her station
And Tushielaw has fled to France
to fight for king and nation   She's the earl of March's daughter
   And the fairest of them a'
   But the humble squire of Tushielaw
   Has ta'en her heart awa'Well the lady she has heard the news
That Tushielaw has fled
And the lady's looking pale and wan (drawn?)
She's ta'en tae her bedA physician come to meet her
All season she's been lying
I fear she has a broken heart
I fear my lady's dying   She's the earl of March's daughter...........Well the fayther he's conceded
He's come to tak the blame
And a messenger was sent to France
to fetch her lover hameNoo the lady's feeling better
She's risen to her feet
And she's ta'en a house in Peeblestoon
Her true love there to meet   She's the earl of March's daughter...........But she's looking tired and pallid
Her cheeks have lost their glow
And she's no the handsome beauty that
She was a year agoAnd when Tushielaw to Peebles cam
His horse he did not tether
He quickly passed his lady by
He's ta'en her for another   She's the earl of March's daughter..........Well he's galloped on to meet her
To see his love again
He spurs his horse in anguish
But he's passed his house and hame   (do I have this right?)For his lady lies in Peeblestoon
It's there she's passed awa'
Noo her windered (?) heart may --- (?)
For handsome Tushielaw   She's the earl of March's daughter...........Can anyone fill in my blanks?  (Of course the missing/mangled words will
probably sound loud and clear once I know what they are.)Thanks again.

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Subject: Fw: Fw: New? Kids folklore
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 10 Mar 2005 00:16:53 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hi folks:A correspondent who wishes to remain anonymous writes:<<I've heard of the pajamas-inside-out one; my nieces used to do that. [They
lived in Howell, New Jersey. - PJS]This isn't folklore, but as a child, I do remember doing an actual spell to
try to bring the snow. I don't know where it was dug up from, or whether it
really was an old spell, as I imagined; but I do remember that it involved
drawing a "Solomon's seal," which in retrospect I'm pretty sure meant a star
of David. I got it wrong, though; when I asked my mother what a "Solomon's
seal" was, she said, "It's a kind of flower" (also true), so I drew flowers
instead.>>Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/09/05
From: Jack Campin <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 11 Mar 2005 18:19:03 +0000
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> Here is the regular Ebay list for this week.
>    5173059252 - Broadside, 1863?, 5.50 GBP (ends Mar-10-05 15:24:41 PST)The seller's enthusiasm for the subject matter is pretty alarming...-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760
<http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack>     *     food intolerance data & recipes,
Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files, and my CD-ROM "Embro, Embro".
---> off-list mail to "j-c" rather than "ballad-l" at this site, please. <---

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/09/05
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 11 Mar 2005 10:49:48 -0800
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Jack:I would be pretty excited too if I got 103GBP for something maybe worth a third of that.  Note that one of the more knowledgeable subscribers to ballad-l bailed out at 16.50 GBP.Seems that the winning bidder is not a folk music person but collects older UK imprints.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Jack Campin <[unmask]>
Date: Friday, March 11, 2005 10:19 am
Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/09/05> > Here is the regular Ebay list for this week.
> >    5173059252 - Broadside, 1863?, 5.50 GBP (ends Mar-10-05
> 15:24:41 PST)
>
> The seller's enthusiasm for the subject matter is pretty alarming...
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---------
> Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU;
> 0131 6604760
> <http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack>     *     food intolerance data
> & recipes,
> Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files, and my CD-ROM
> "Embro, Embro".
> ---> off-list mail to "j-c" rather than "ballad-l" at this site,
> please. <---
>

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Subject: Blatant Semi-commercial Announcement of probably Limited Interest
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 11 Mar 2005 14:53:44 -0500
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Due to a shift in Smithsonian-Folkways maketing policies, I'm now in a
position to offer their custom CDs at $16--about four bucks over SF's
price. As before, I carry all of their remastered non-custom CDs at a
buck or two less than S-F charges.dick greenhaus
CAMSCO Music

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Subject: Shades of Hillsville
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 11 Mar 2005 15:31:18 -0500
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The news from Atlanta this morning brings to mind the Hillsville
massacre and the ballads based on that event.I wonder if we will have songs about today's events.By the way, some historic documents relating to Sidna Allen are for sale:http://www.tramp-art.com/special1.htmJohn

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Subject: Re: Blatant Semi-commercial Announcement of probably Limited Interest
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:06:36 -0500
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    Oops-
please make that four bucks */under/*dick greenhaus wrote:> Due to a shift in Smithsonian-Folkways maketing policies, I'm now in a
> position to offer their custom CDs at $16--about four bucks over SF's
> price. As before, I carry all of their remastered non-custom CDs at a
> buck or two less than S-F charges.
>
> dick greenhaus
> CAMSCO Music
>
>

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Subject: Re: Blatant Semi-commercial Announcement of probably Limited Interest
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 11 Mar 2005 14:28:00 -0800
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Dick:I read that as four buck over the wholesale price.No damage done.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Date: Friday, March 11, 2005 1:06 pm
Subject: Re: Blatant Semi-commercial Announcement of probably Limited Interest>    Oops-
> please make that four bucks */under/*
>
> dick greenhaus wrote:
>
> > Due to a shift in Smithsonian-Folkways maketing policies, I'm now
> in a
> > position to offer their custom CDs at $16--about four bucks over
> SF's> price. As before, I carry all of their remastered non-custom
> CDs at a
> > buck or two less than S-F charges.
> >
> > dick greenhaus
> > CAMSCO Music
> >
> >
>

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Subject: Re: Blatant Semi-commercial Announcement of probably Limited Interest
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:44:59 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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----- Original Message -----
From: "dick greenhaus" <[unmask]><<Due to a shift in Smithsonian-Folkways maketing policies, I'm now in a
position to offer their custom CDs at $16--about four bucks over SF's
price. As before, I carry all of their remastered non-custom CDs at a
buck or two less than S-F charges.>>Dick, I think you mean "about four bucks *under* SF's price"; they normally
sell the custom discs for $20.00. Good deal!Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: "Lisa - S. H." <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 13 Mar 2005 15:38:46 -0500
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I am confused as to who exactly wrote this, and when?  -and is it from the 
Grubstreet Journal, or the Gentleman's Magazine?
Would appreciate clarification, thanks....
LisaAt 03:03 PM 3/3/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>For those who would like to flagellate themselves with the whole article:
>
>Grubstreet Journal, Feb 27 No. 276.
>
>Of Ballad-singing.
>
>The Scandalous Practice of Ballad-singing, is the Bane of all good Manners 
>and Morals, a Nursery for Idlers. Whores and Pickpockets, a School for 
>Scandal, Smut and Debauchery, and ought to be entirely suppressed, or 
>reduced under proper Restriction. If Ballads do not, yet they ought to 
>come under the Stamp Act, and the Law looks on Ballad-singers as Vagrants. 
>This brings to my Mind the ill Conduct of many of our middling Gentry, who 
>suffer their Children, particularly their daughters, to frequent the 
>Kitchen, be familiar with the Servants, and so learn their Manners. One 
>Part of their Conversation turns upon frightful Stories of Witches, 
>Apparitions, &c. which serve to keep Miss in Awe, and in their interest.
>
>Her Delight in the Kitchen-Conversation increases with her Years; now is 
>flattered, taught to shew Tricks upon Cards, and play at Romps; ~ which 
>soon makes her forget htt Birth, and think herself on a level with them. 
>Well! Miss is now out of her Hanging Sleeves, and every one, especially 
>the Footman, tells her how pretty she is. Now Ballads and Love Songs are 
>daily presented her, and vouched for Truth: One tells, "How a Footman died 
>for Love of a young Lady, and how she was haunted by his Ghost, and died 
>for Grief. Another, How the Coachman run away with his young Mistress, 
>took to Hedging and Ditching, and she to Knitting and Spinning, and lived 
>vast Happy, and in great Plenty. And a third, How the young ’Squire, 
>Master’s eldest Son, fell in Love with the Chambermaid, married her at 
>the Fleet, was turn’d out of Doors, kept an Inn, got Money as fast as 
>Hops, till the old Gentleman died suddenly without a Will, and then his 
>Son got all, kept a Coach, and made his Wife a great Lady, who bore him 
>Twins for 12 years together, who all lived to be Justices of the Peace, 
>&c. By such foolish Stories Miss is deluded; sighs, pities, and at last 
>loves; and so too often undone without Remedy
>
>§ A Female Correspondent, who signs Virtuous, complains of the many 
>ruinous Marriages that are every Year practiced in the Fleet, by a Set of 
>drunken swearing Parsons, with their Myrmidons that wear black Coats, and 
>pretend to. be Clerks and Registers to the Fleet, plying about 
>Ludgate-hill, pulling and forcing People to some pedling Alehouse or 
>Brandyshop to be married, even on Sunday, stopping them as they go to the 
>Church.
>
>Not long since, a young Lady was deluded and forced from her Friends, and 
>by the Assistance of a very wicked swearing Parson, married to an 
>atheistical Wretch, whose Life is a continual Practice of all Manner of 
>Vice and Debauchery.?Another young Lady was deecoyed to a House in the 
>confines of the Fleet by a pretended Gentleman. Dr. Wryneck immediately 
>appear'd, and swore she should be married; or if she would not, he would 
>have his Fee, and register the Marriage from that Night. The Lady, to 
>recover her Liberty, left her Ring as a Pledge that she would meet him the 
>morrow Night.
>
>
>
>Gentleman’s Magazine, Vol. 5 Feb 1735, p. 93

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 13 Mar 2005 16:53:12 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Steve Roud <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 13 Mar 2005 22:25:36 -0000
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The relevant section of the Gentleman's Magazine was where they reprinted
interesting items from other publications, in this case The Grub-Street
Journal.
If you're interested in using the GM as a source, you should know about the
excellent site:
'Attributions of Authorship in the Gentleman's Magazine, 1731-1868: An
Electronic Union List' at
http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/etcbin/browse-gmall?id=GM1731
The entry for this 'Ballad Singing' piece is as follows:
Vol. 3 (1733) :pp. 252.. A:. Letter originally signed "J. Ralph" from the
Grub-Street Journal , No. 178 (24 May 1733). James Ralph [?]. [ Orig.
"Ralph" ]Steve Roud----- Original Message -----
From: "Lisa - S. H." <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 8:38 PM
Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubicationI am confused as to who exactly wrote this, and when?  -and is it from the
Grubstreet Journal, or the Gentleman's Magazine?
Would appreciate clarification, thanks....
LisaAt 03:03 PM 3/3/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>For those who would like to flagellate themselves with the whole article:
>
>Grubstreet Journal, Feb 27 No. 276.
>
>Of Ballad-singing.
>
>The Scandalous Practice of Ballad-singing, is the Bane of all good Manners
>and Morals, a Nursery for Idlers. Whores and Pickpockets, a School for
>Scandal, Smut and Debauchery, and ought to be entirely suppressed, or
>reduced under proper Restriction. If Ballads do not, yet they ought to come
>under the Stamp Act, and the Law looks on Ballad-singers as Vagrants. This
>brings to my Mind the ill Conduct of many of our middling Gentry, who
>suffer their Children, particularly their daughters, to frequent the
>Kitchen, be familiar with the Servants, and so learn their Manners. One
>Part of their Conversation turns upon frightful Stories of Witches,
>Apparitions, &c. which serve to keep Miss in Awe, and in their interest.
>
>Her Delight in the Kitchen-Conversation increases with her Years; now is
>flattered, taught to shew Tricks upon Cards, and play at Romps; ~ which
>soon makes her forget htt Birth, and think herself on a level with them.
>Well! Miss is now out of her Hanging Sleeves, and every one, especially the
>Footman, tells her how pretty she is. Now Ballads and Love Songs are daily
>presented her, and vouched for Truth: One tells, "How a Footman died for
>Love of a young Lady, and how she was haunted by his Ghost, and died for
>Grief. Another, How the Coachman run away with his young Mistress, took to
>Hedging and Ditching, and she to Knitting and Spinning, and lived vast
>Happy, and in great Plenty. And a third, How the young ?TSquire,
>Master?Ts eldest Son, fell in Love with the Chambermaid, married her at
>the Fleet, was turn?Td out of Doors, kept an Inn, got Money as fast as
>Hops, till the old Gentleman died suddenly without a Will, and then his Son
>got all, kept a Coach, and made his Wife a great Lady, who bore him Twins
>for 12 years together, who all lived to be Justices of the Peace, &c. By
>such foolish Stories Miss is deluded; sighs, pities, and at last loves; and
>so too often undone without Remedy
>
>§ A Female Correspondent, who signs Virtuous, complains of the many
>ruinous Marriages that are every Year practiced in the Fleet, by a Set of
>drunken swearing Parsons, with their Myrmidons that wear black Coats, and
>pretend to. be Clerks and Registers to the Fleet, plying about
>Ludgate-hill, pulling and forcing People to some pedling Alehouse or
>Brandyshop to be married, even on Sunday, stopping them as they go to the
>Church.
>
>Not long since, a young Lady was deluded and forced from her Friends, and
>by the Assistance of a very wicked swearing Parson, married to an
>atheistical Wretch, whose Life is a continual Practice of all Manner of
>Vice and Debauchery.-Another young Lady was deecoyed to a House in the
>confines of the Fleet by a pretended Gentleman. Dr. Wryneck immediately
>appear'd, and swore she should be married; or if she would not, he would
>have his Fee, and register the Marriage from that Night. The Lady, to
>recover her Liberty, left her Ring as a Pledge that she would meet him the
>morrow Night.
>
>
>
>Gentleman?Ts Magazine, Vol. 5 Feb 1735, p. 93

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: "Lisa - S. H." <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 13 Mar 2005 18:57:24 -0500
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At 10:25 PM 3/13/2005 +0000, you wrote:
>The relevant section of the Gentleman's Magazine was where they reprinted
>interesting items from other publications, in this case The Grub-Street
>Journal.
>If you're interested in using the GM as a source, you should know about the
>excellent site:
>'Attributions of Authorship in the Gentleman's Magazine, 1731-1868: An
>Electronic Union List' at
>http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/etcbin/browse-gmall?id=GM1731
>The entry for this 'Ballad Singing' piece is as follows:
>Vol. 3 (1733) :pp. 252.. A:. Letter originally signed "J. Ralph" from the
>Grub-Street Journal , No. 178 (24 May 1733). James Ralph [?]. [ Orig.
>"Ralph" ]
>
>Steve RoudThank you kindly,
Lisa

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Subject: Tushielaw
From: Jean Lepley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 06:35:56 -0800
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Did my posting of words to Tushielaw (complete except for last verse)
get through a week ago? It coincided with a server breakdown, and I got
no response from you all ... so I'm wondering if I should repost.

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Subject: Re: Tushielaw
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:48:34 -0500
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I got the words.  Thanks.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of Jean Lepley
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 9:36 AM
To: [unmask]
Subject: TushielawDid my posting of words to Tushielaw (complete except for last verse)
get through a week ago? It coincided with a server breakdown, and I got
no response from you all ... so I'm wondering if I should repost.

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Subject: Address for Joe Hickerson
From: Adam Miller <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 07:36:35 -0800
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Anybody have a current address for Joe Hickerson?Thanks,
A. Miller
Woodside, CA

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Subject:
From: Carol Burke <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 07:50:14 -0800
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I am putting together a course on imposters and impersonators that will
combine film, literature, and folklore.  I?d welcome fellow folklorists?
favorite picks of traditional stories of tricksters, shape-shifters,
changelings, and other characters whose identities are similarly
ambiguous.  I?d also appreciate any recommendations of in-print paperback
collections of such tales.  Many thanks.Carol Burke
Department of English
University of California, Irvine

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Subject: Re: rewards and fairies
From: Elizabeth Hummel <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:21:44 -0500
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Favorite:  Thomas the Rhymer... a documented historical figure said to have the "sight".  Katharine Briggs "Encyclopedia of Fairies" has an entry on this Englishman, but a quick check in the anthology "Bonny Bunch of Roses" sets the scene much more clearly with a 20-some verse ballad version of Thomas' kidnapping by the fairies.  Lovely melody too.Also see cran's recording ( off the "lover's ghost" album) of the Stolen Bride- straight out of classic English fairy lore- another kidnapping, a verse on fairy food, complete with a complicated ritual needed to release the captured woman form the underground prison.So many good ones here, but these two come to mind first.Keep us posted on this one!LizIn New Hampshire where the snow comes every three days.-----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of Carol Burke
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 10:50 AM
To: [unmask]
Subject: I am putting together a course on imposters and impersonators that will
combine film, literature, and folklore.  I'd welcome fellow folklorists'
favorite picks of traditional stories of tricksters, shape-shifters,
changelings, and other characters whose identities are similarly
ambiguous.  I'd also appreciate any recommendations of in-print paperback
collections of such tales.  Many thanks.Carol Burke
Department of English
University of California, Irvine

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Subject: Re: Address for Joe Hickerson
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:23:31 EST
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Subject: Re: rewards and fairies
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:07:06 -0800
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Carol:I would suggest that no course  that dealt with imposters would be complete without at least a casual look at the folktales) involving "The Bedtrick," for which see Wendy Doniger's book of the same name, a world-wide survey of tales of sex and masquerade.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Elizabeth Hummel <[unmask]>
Date: Monday, March 14, 2005 8:21 am
Subject: Re: rewards and fairies> Favorite:  Thomas the Rhymer... a documented historical figure said
> to have the "sight".  Katharine Briggs "Encyclopedia of Fairies"
> has an entry on this Englishman, but a quick check in the anthology
> "Bonny Bunch of Roses" sets the scene much more clearly with a 20-
> some verse ballad version of Thomas' kidnapping by the fairies.
> Lovely melody too.
>
> Also see cran's recording ( off the "lover's ghost" album) of the
> Stolen Bride- straight out of classic English fairy lore- another
> kidnapping, a verse on fairy food, complete with a complicated
> ritual needed to release the captured woman form the underground
> prison.
> So many good ones here, but these two come to mind first.
>
> Keep us posted on this one!
>
> Liz
>
> In New Hampshire where the snow comes every three days.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Forum for ballad scholars [[unmask]]On
> Behalf Of Carol Burke
> Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 10:50 AM
> To: [unmask]
> Subject:
>
>
> I am putting together a course on imposters and impersonators that
> willcombine film, literature, and folklore.  I'd welcome fellow
> folklorists'favorite picks of traditional stories of tricksters,
> shape-shifters,
> changelings, and other characters whose identities are similarly
> ambiguous.  I'd also appreciate any recommendations of in-print
> paperbackcollections of such tales.  Many thanks.
>
> Carol Burke
> Department of English
> University of California, Irvine
>

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Subject: Re: Address for Joe Hickerson
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:10:08 -0800
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Joe Hickerson
43 Philadelphia Ave.
Takoma Park, Md. 20912301-270-1107Tell him Ed sent you.  And say hello for me.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Adam Miller <[unmask]>
Date: Monday, March 14, 2005 7:36 am
Subject: Address for Joe Hickerson> Anybody have a current address for Joe Hickerson?
>
> Thanks,
> A. Miller
> Woodside, CA
>

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Subject: Re: Address for Joe Hickerson
From: Anne Dhu McLucas <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:22:53 -0800
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43 Philadelphia Avenue, Takoma Park, MD or [unmask]Anne Dhu McLucas, Ph.D.
Professor of Music
Chair of Music History and Ethnomusicology
University of Oregon------------------
> Anybody have a current address for Joe Hickerson?
>
> Thanks,
> A. Miller
> Woodside, CA
>

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Subject: Re: Address for Joe Hickerson
From: Cal Lani Lani Herrmann <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:27:37 -0800
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On Mon, Mar 14, 2005 at 07:36:35AM -0800, Adam Miller wrote:
> Anybody have a current address for Joe Hickerson?
 Yes.  You have but to look at any of his Songfinder
columns in Sing Out! -- Aloha, Lani<||> Lani Herrmann * [unmask] (or: [unmask])
<||> 5621 Sierra Ave. * Richmond, CA 94805 * (510) 237-7360

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Subject: Re: rewards and fairies
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 12:33:55 -0500
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Well, I suppose Thomas the Rhymer is English in the same sense that
Canadians are American.
But he is usually considered Scots.Ewan McVicar, 
84 High Street
Linlithgow, 
West Lothian
Scotland
EH49 7AQtel 01506 847935

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Subject: Re: rewards and fairies
From: Elizabeth Hummel <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 13:29:17 -0500
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My apologies Ewan... Blame an indifferent English Professor on putting that seed in my head.-----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of Ewan McVicar
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 12:34 PM
To: [unmask]
Subject: Re: rewards and fairiesWell, I suppose Thomas the Rhymer is English in the same sense that
Canadians are American.
But he is usually considered Scots.Ewan McVicar, 
84 High Street
Linlithgow, 
West Lothian
Scotland
EH49 7AQtel 01506 847935

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Subject: Follow the Band
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 12:50:39 -0600
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Hi folks:Okay, this isn't a ballad, but this is the crowd that will know the answer
to my question if anyone will. Several years ago I learned a song from Tom
Paley that went:My husband's a mason, a mason
My husband, a mason is he
All day he lays bricks, he lays bricks, he lays bricks
At night he comes home and drinks tea.(ch.:) Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
Follow the band, follow the band
Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
Follow the band.Additional verses:A machinist screws bolts
A jockey rides nags,
A glazier (or glassblower) blows glass,
(or:  A trumpeter blows fanfares),
A farmer plows loam,
A farmhand forks hayEtc. etc., far into the night. My questions:1) Anyone have any idea of the provenance of this song -- published sources
(other than Digital Tradition, which I've already seen), earliest reported
dates?2) My girlfriend reports that her grandfather, when mildly surprised, would
exclaim, "Well, kiss a little pig!" Was it a catch-phrase that got
incorporated into a song? Or did the song supply the catchphrase to the
language?Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: tricksters, imposters, perpetratin' rappers
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 10:57:18 -0800
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Subject: Re: rewards and fairies
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:15:20 -0800
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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:38:03 -0500
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Well, I first learned it in the mid-1940s, as part of my mis=spent youth
on the streets of Brooklyn.dick greenhausPaul Stamler wrote:>Hi folks:
>
>Okay, this isn't a ballad, but this is the crowd that will know the answer
>to my question if anyone will. Several years ago I learned a song from Tom
>Paley that went:
>
>My husband's a mason, a mason
>My husband, a mason is he
>All day he lays bricks, he lays bricks, he lays bricks
>At night he comes home and drinks tea.
>
>(ch.:) Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
>Follow the band, follow the band
>Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
>Follow the band.
>
>Additional verses:
>
>A machinist screws bolts
>A jockey rides nags,
>A glazier (or glassblower) blows glass,
>(or:  A trumpeter blows fanfares),
>A farmer plows loam,
>A farmhand forks hay
>
>Etc. etc., far into the night. My questions:
>
>1) Anyone have any idea of the provenance of this song -- published sources
>(other than Digital Tradition, which I've already seen), earliest reported
>dates?
>
>2) My girlfriend reports that her grandfather, when mildly surprised, would
>exclaim, "Well, kiss a little pig!" Was it a catch-phrase that got
>incorporated into a song? Or did the song supply the catchphrase to the
>language?
>
>Peace,
>Paul
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Subject: "Follow the Band..."
From: Lydia Fish <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:38:50 EST
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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:50:12 -0500
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Could be a pop song from the forties. I have the following floating about
in my head with a tune.
Hey-rig-a-jig, hey-rig-a-jig, follow the band,
follow the band, follow the band,
Hey-rig-a-jig, hey-rig-a-jig, follow the band,
Follow the band all the way.Apart from that there's a version in 'Rugby Songs' Michael green p115 which
has miner, carpenter, taxidermist, trumpeter,And I have a typed version which I ended up with as local repository for
such things which has joiner, printer, taxidermist, jockey.It wasn't in my repertoire of such things though so I can't say how the
tune went.
Has Ed got anything on it?SteveG

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
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Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:53:04 -0800
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Subject: Re: "Follow the Band..."
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:10:01 -0500
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There are variants.
"Hey rig-a-jig
Frig a little pig
Follow the band;
Follow the band
With your prick in your hand...etc."The last verse, as I learned it, was:
"My husband's a tea-taster, a tea-taster,a tea-taster,
My husbnd's a tea-taster, is he.
All day he drinks tea, he drinks tea, he drinks tea
Then comes home at night and fucks me"Lydia Fish wrote:> >Okay, this isn't a ballad, but this is the crowd that will know the
> answer
> >to my question if anyone will. Several years ago I learned a song
> from Tom
> >Paley that went:
>
> A bawdy version of this song is quite common in Air Force tradition,
> where it is usually entitled something like "My Husband's a Captain."
>
> My husband's a captain, a captain, a captain,
> A very fine captain is he.
> All day he fucks up, he fucks up, he fucks up,
> At night he comes home and fucks me.
>
> Drink a little, fuck a little, follow the band
> Follow the band, follow the band.
> Drink a little, fuck a little, follow the band,
> Join in our happy throng.
>
> And so on.
>
> Lydia

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:08:39 -0600
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_The Common Muse_ (1957, Philosophical Library Edition) (purshase
a copy here: http://tinyurl.com/69vnm )  has this on pgs 438-9
but no chorus:       MY HUSBANDMy Husband's a jockey, a jockey, a jockey,
A bloody fine jockey is he.
All day he rides horses, rides horses, rides horses,
At night he comes home and rides me.My husband's a stoker, &c.
A bloody fine stoker is he.
All day he pokes fires, &c.
At night he comes home and pokes me.My husband's a pork-butcher, &c.
A bloody fine pork-butcher is he.
All day he stuffs sausages, &c.
At night he comes home and stuffs me.My husband's a sergeant, &c.
A bloody fine sergeant is he.
All day he f--ks men about, &c.
At night he comes home and f--ks me.----- Original Message -----
From: Jonathan Lighter
To: [unmask]
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 1:53 PM
Subject: Re: Follow the BandA text from WWII appears in Pinto & Rodway's _The Common Muse_
(1957?), but you'll have to find the high-priced edition,
considered too filthy for public consumption.  Also connected
with the British Army in WWII is the bowdlerized stanza sung in
the film "The Long and the Short and the Tall" (1961), based on
the play by Willis Hall.Other texts are scattered all over the Internet. There may be
another in Anthony Hopkins's WWII Canadian collection, _Songs
from the Front and Rear_ (1977). Check also Harry Morgan's _Rugby
Songs_ and _More Rugby Songs_ (1968-69).At Mystic Seaport in 1988, it took little encouragement from a
pair of female performers (their names escape me) to get an
audience of a couple of hundred to break out in song and
contribute stanzas.The finale was,"My husband's a folk singer, folk singer, folk singer, etc....
...comes home and folks me."JLPaul Stamler <[unmask]> wrote:
Hi folks:Okay, this isn't a ballad, but this is the crowd that will know
the answer
to my question if anyone will. Several years ago I learned a song
from Tom
Paley that went:My husband's a mason, a mason
My husband, a mason is he
All day he lays bricks, he lays bricks, he lays bricks
At night he comes home and drinks tea.(ch.:) Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
Follow the band, follow the band
Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
Follow the band.Additional verses:A machinist screws bolts
A jockey rides nags,
A glazier (or glassblower) blows glass,
(or: A trumpeter blows fanfares),
A farmer plows loam,
A farmhand forks hayEtc. etc., far into the night. My questions:1) Anyone have any idea of the provenance of this song --
published sources
(other than! Digital Tradition, which I've already seen),
earliest reported
dates?2) My girlfriend reports that her grandfather, when mildly
surprised, would
exclaim, "Well, kiss a little pig!" Was it a catch-phrase that
got
incorporated into a song? Or did the song supply the catchphrase
to the
language?Peace,
Paul__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:31:50 -0500
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Having followed up a few more leads, 'My Husband' i.e. the same song
without the chorus, is in the common Common Muse p597. I didn't even know
there were different editions.
Also there are much earlier ballads in there which could have inspired this
one, see for instance p440, 'A Ballad of all Trades'.As I suspected it's all in Ed's second edition 1992 The Erotic Muse pp55-61.
Lots of versions but I can't see anything on 'Follow the Band' as a pop songA related English rugby song which I did sing was 'If I were the marrying
kind, which thank the lord I'm not sir, the kind of man that I would marry
would be a rugby scrum half, he'd put it in, we'd put it in, we'd all put
it in together etc ' going through all the team positions.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:46:02 -0500
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Just been looking at a thread on Mudcat website 'Follow the Band' Similar
things turning up. Several suggestions that the clean version was featured
in a film.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:16:58 -0600
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Hey!Are there spam filters on this list?  My first posting of this
email did not go through because of "objectionable" words.      ------------------------------------------
      --------- ORIGINAL POST -----------Dear Paul,I *believe* that the phrase "kiss a little pig" / "f-ck a little
pig" is an old catch phrase but I don't know of any references.There is at least one other song which uses the phrase "f-ck a
little pig" and was known to Air Force pilots in Vietnam:
"Ports of Call"  (text below).If I find out more about "little pig" and the associated songs,
I will post the info to the list.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  SPANISH GUITAR (aka Ports of Call)Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
Where the girls wouldn't shag, but we made 'em.Chorus:       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar, singing:
       Hi-jiggy-jiggy, f-ck a little pig sideways,
       My idea of a woman is a big brown ass  (shit bag)
       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar.The next port of call was London
Where the girls didn't shag, so we bummed 'emThe next port of call we were waiting
So we found us a girl that liked f-llating.The next port of call was Harro
Where the girls would only f-ck in a barrow.The next port of call was Wiggum
Where all the girls had real biggun's.Oh, the next port of call was Lake Como
[falsetto] Where I spent all the night with a homo----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Stamler" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 12:50 PM
Subject: Follow the BandHi folks:Okay, this isn't a ballad, but this is the crowd that will know
the answer
to my question if anyone will. Several years ago I learned a song
from Tom
Paley that went:My husband's a mason, a mason
My husband, a mason is he
All day he lays bricks, he lays bricks, he lays bricks
At night he comes home and drinks tea.(ch.:) Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
Follow the band, follow the band
Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
Follow the band.Additional verses:A machinist screws bolts
A jockey rides nags,
A glazier (or glassblower) blows glass,
(or:  A trumpeter blows fanfares),
A farmer plows loam,
A farmhand forks hayEtc. etc., far into the night. My questions:1) Anyone have any idea of the provenance of this song --
published sources
(other than Digital Tradition, which I've already seen), earliest
reported
dates?2) My girlfriend reports that her grandfather, when mildly
surprised, would
exclaim, "Well, kiss a little pig!" Was it a catch-phrase that
got
incorporated into a song? Or did the song supply the catchphrase
to the
language?Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 13:56:03 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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Dear Paul,I *believe* that the phrase "kiss a little pig" / "fuck a little
pig" is an old catch phrase but I don't know of any references.There is at least one other song which uses the phrase "fuck a
little pig" and was known to Air Force pilots in Vietnam:
"Ports of Call"  (text below).If I find out more about "little pig" and the associated songs,
I will post the info to the list.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  SPANISH GUITAR (aka Ports of Call)Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
Where the girls wouldn't shag, but we made 'em.Chorus:       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar, singing:
       Hi-jiggy-jiggy, fuck a little pig sideways,
       My idea of a woman is a big brown ass  (shit bag)
       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar.The next port of call was London
Where the girls didn't shag, so we bummed 'emThe next next port of call we were waiting
So we found us a girl that liked fellating.The next port of call was Harro
Where the girls would only fuck in a barrow.The next port of call was Wiggum
Where all the girls had real biggun's.Oh, the next port of call was Lake Como
[falsetto] Where I spent all the night with a homo----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Stamler" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 12:50 PM
Subject: Follow the BandHi folks:Okay, this isn't a ballad, but this is the crowd that will know
the answer
to my question if anyone will. Several years ago I learned a song
from Tom
Paley that went:My husband's a mason, a mason
My husband, a mason is he
All day he lays bricks, he lays bricks, he lays bricks
At night he comes home and drinks tea.(ch.:) Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
Follow the band, follow the band
Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
Follow the band.Additional verses:A machinist screws bolts
A jockey rides nags,
A glazier (or glassblower) blows glass,
(or:  A trumpeter blows fanfares),
A farmer plows loam,
A farmhand forks hayEtc. etc., far into the night. My questions:1) Anyone have any idea of the provenance of this song --
published sources
(other than Digital Tradition, which I've already seen), earliest
reported
dates?2) My girlfriend reports that her grandfather, when mildly
surprised, would
exclaim, "Well, kiss a little pig!" Was it a catch-phrase that
got
incorporated into a song? Or did the song supply the catchphrase
to the
language?Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:27:07 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hey!Are there spam filters on this list?  My first and second posting
of this email did not go through because of "objectionable"
words.      ------------------------------------------
      --------- ORIGINAL POST -----------Dear Paul,I *believe* that the phrase "kiss a little pig" / "f-ck a little
pig" is an old catch phrase but I don't know of any references.There is at least one other song which uses the phrase "f-ck a
little pig" and was known to Air Force pilots in Vietnam:
"Ports of Call"  (text below).If I find out more about "little pig" and the associated songs,
I will post the info to the list.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  SPANISH GUITAR (aka Ports of Call)Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
Where the girls wouldn't sh-g, but we made 'em.Chorus:       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar, singing:
       Hi-jiggy-jiggy, f-ck a little pig sideways,
       My idea of a woman is a big brown ass  (sh-t bag)
       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar.The next port of call was London
Where the girls didn't sh-g, so we b-mmed 'emThe next port of call we were waiting
So we found us a girl that liked f-llating.The next port of call was Harro
Where the girls would only f-ck in a barrow.The next port of call was Wiggum
Where all the girls had real biggun's.Oh, the next port of call was Lake Como
[falsetto] Where I spent all the night with a homo

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:29:40 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(77 lines)


Sorry about the duplicative postings.  What is it with Ballad-l
and bawdy words which cause the emails to be delayed?Here is an interesting version of the song from the 1996 edition
of the "Flying Booger" online Hash House Hymnal.  This song is
absent from later editions and is replaced with the standard song
titled "Marriage a la Mode"       THE COUNTRY GENTLEMAN  Chorus:       Singing High Jig-a-Jig, F--k the little pig.
       Follow the band, Follow the band all the way.
       Singing High Jig-a-Jig, F--k a little pig.
       Follow the band, Follow the band all the way!  I took my Missus horse riding, horse riding
  She stuck it as long as she could;
  She stuck it and stuck it until she said, "F--k it,
  My a-se hole is not made of wood."  I took my wife for a ramble, a ramble
  Along a country land
  She caught her left t-t on a bramble, a bramble
  And a-se over buttocks she came.  I asked her if it hurt her, hurt her,
  If she had gone through any pain.
  Before she could answer, could answer
  She was a-se over buttocks again.Here is a version of "Spanish Guitar" from the 2000 Hash Hymnal
but from Air Force provenance:              SPANISH GUITAR
   Melody - same as for "Marriage a la Mode"
   From the songbook of the 44th TFS, Kadena Air Base, Japan  Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
  Where the girls wouldn't f--k, but we made 'em, made 'em,
  Two dollars you pay, for a bang-up each way,
  And a tune on a Spanish guitar, singing:  CHORUS:         Hi-ziggy-ziggy, f--k a little piggy sideways,
                                                         swish,
swish,
         My idea of a woman is a big fat wh--e,
         Sh-t-bang, f--k-stick,
         Two dollars you pay for a bang-up each way,
         And a tune on a Spanish guitar, plink, plink, plink.  Oh, the next port of call was Boston, Boston,
  Where the girls wouldn't f--k, but we forced 'em, forced 'em,
  Two dollars you pay, for a bang-up each way,
  And a tune on a Spanish guitar, singing:  Oh, the next port of call was Malta, Malta,
  Where the girls wouldn't f--k, but oughta, oughta,
  Two dollars you pay, for a bang-up each way,
  And a tune on a Spanish guitar, singing:  Oh, the next port of call was Suwon, Suwon,
  Where the girls would do it for two won, two won,
  Two dollars you pay, for a bang-up each way,
  And a tune on a Spanish guitar, singing:  Oh, the next port of call was Takhli, Takhli,
  Where the girls would do it for free, for free,
  Two dollars you pay, for a bang-up each way,
  And a tune on a Spanish guitar, singing:

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Warren Fahey <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 08:34:46 +1100
Content-Type:text/plain
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John,This phrase comes from its use by musicians for a particular dance tune
popular throughout the English-speaking world.
I am currently collecting such things - like arse-over-anna for the
varsovienna
Circassian Circle ... Circumcissional Circle
Virginia Reel .... Vagina ReelI will attempt to get the exact tune they sing it to.......etcWarren FaheyOn 15/03/2005, at 6:56 AM, John Mehlberg wrote:> Dear Paul,
>
> I *believe* that the phrase "kiss a little pig" / "fuck a little
> pig" is an old catch phrase but I don't know of any references.
>
> There is at least one other song which uses the phrase "fuck a
> little pig" and was known to Air Force pilots in Vietnam:
> "Ports of Call"  (text below).
>
> If I find out more about "little pig" and the associated songs,
> I will post the info to the list.
>
> Yours,
>
> John Mehlberg
> ~
>   SPANISH GUITAR (aka Ports of Call)
>
> Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
> Where the girls wouldn't shag, but we made 'em.
>
> Chorus:
>
>        Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
>        And a tune on my Spanish guitar, singing:
>        Hi-jiggy-jiggy, fuck a little pig sideways,
>        My idea of a woman is a big brown ass  (shit bag)
>        Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
>        And a tune on my Spanish guitar.
>
> The next port of call was London
> Where the girls didn't shag, so we bummed 'em
>
> The next next port of call we were waiting
> So we found us a girl that liked fellating.
>
> The next port of call was Harro
> Where the girls would only fuck in a barrow.
>
> The next port of call was Wiggum
> Where all the girls had real biggun's.
>
> Oh, the next port of call was Lake Como
> [falsetto] Where I spent all the night with a homo
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Stamler" <[unmask]>
> To: <[unmask]>
> Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 12:50 PM
> Subject: Follow the Band
>
>
> Hi folks:
>
> Okay, this isn't a ballad, but this is the crowd that will know
> the answer
> to my question if anyone will. Several years ago I learned a song
> from Tom
> Paley that went:
>
> My husband's a mason, a mason
> My husband, a mason is he
> All day he lays bricks, he lays bricks, he lays bricks
> At night he comes home and drinks tea.
>
> (ch.:) Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
> Follow the band, follow the band
> Hey rig-a-jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band
> Follow the band.
>
> Additional verses:
>
> A machinist screws bolts
> A jockey rides nags,
> A glazier (or glassblower) blows glass,
> (or:  A trumpeter blows fanfares),
> A farmer plows loam,
> A farmhand forks hay
>
> Etc. etc., far into the night. My questions:
>
> 1) Anyone have any idea of the provenance of this song --
> published sources
> (other than Digital Tradition, which I've already seen), earliest
> reported
> dates?
>
> 2) My girlfriend reports that her grandfather, when mildly
> surprised, would
> exclaim, "Well, kiss a little pig!" Was it a catch-phrase that
> got
> incorporated into a song? Or did the song supply the catchphrase
> to the
> language?
>
> Peace,
> Paul
>

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 16:34:28 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(66 lines)


There is no spam filter and no censorship on this list.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of John Mehlberg
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 3:27 PM
To: [unmask]
Subject: Re: Follow the BandHey!Are there spam filters on this list?  My first and second posting
of this email did not go through because of "objectionable"
words.      ------------------------------------------
      --------- ORIGINAL POST -----------Dear Paul,I *believe* that the phrase "kiss a little pig" / "f-ck a little
pig" is an old catch phrase but I don't know of any references.There is at least one other song which uses the phrase "f-ck a
little pig" and was known to Air Force pilots in Vietnam:
"Ports of Call"  (text below).If I find out more about "little pig" and the associated songs,
I will post the info to the list.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  SPANISH GUITAR (aka Ports of Call)Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
Where the girls wouldn't sh-g, but we made 'em.Chorus:       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar, singing:
       Hi-jiggy-jiggy, f-ck a little pig sideways,
       My idea of a woman is a big brown ass  (sh-t bag)
       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar.The next port of call was London
Where the girls didn't sh-g, so we b-mmed 'emThe next port of call we were waiting
So we found us a girl that liked f-llating.The next port of call was Harro
Where the girls would only f-ck in a barrow.The next port of call was Wiggum
Where all the girls had real biggun's.Oh, the next port of call was Lake Como
[falsetto] Where I spent all the night with a homo

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:30:49 -0800
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text/plain(28 lines) , text/html(10 lines)


Sorry, your browser doesn't support iframes.


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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:09:09 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(54 lines)


Hey!Are there spam filters on this list?  My first, second and third
posting of this email did not go through because of
"objectionable" words.  Apparently one must use f--k !      ------------------------------------------
      --------- ORIGINAL POST -----------Dear Paul,I *believe* that the phrase "kiss a little pig" / "f--k a little
pig" is an old catch phrase but I don't know of any references.There is at least one other song which uses the phrase "f--k a
little pig" and was known to Air Force pilots in Vietnam:
"Ports of Call"  (text below).If I find out more about "little pig" and the associated songs,
I will post the info to the list.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  SPANISH GUITAR (aka Ports of Call)Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
Where the girls wouldn't sh-g, but we made 'em.Chorus:       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar, singing:
       Hi-jiggy-jiggy, f--k a little pig sideways,
       My idea of a woman is a big brown ass  (sh-t bag)
       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar.The next port of call was London
Where the girls didn't sh-g, so we b-mmed 'emThe next port of call we were waiting
So we found us a girl that liked f-llating.The next port of call was Harro
Where the girls would only f--k in a barrow.The next port of call was Wiggum
Where all the girls had real biggun's.Oh, the next port of call was Lake Como
[falsetto] Where I spent all the night with a homo

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:59:22 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(66 lines)


That's pretty weird.  I can't imagine that the university would impose such censorship.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of John Mehlberg
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 4:09 PM
To: [unmask]
Subject: Re: Follow the BandHey!Are there spam filters on this list?  My first, second and third
posting of this email did not go through because of
"objectionable" words.  Apparently one must use f--k !      ------------------------------------------
      --------- ORIGINAL POST -----------Dear Paul,I *believe* that the phrase "kiss a little pig" / "f--k a little
pig" is an old catch phrase but I don't know of any references.There is at least one other song which uses the phrase "f--k a
little pig" and was known to Air Force pilots in Vietnam:
"Ports of Call"  (text below).If I find out more about "little pig" and the associated songs,
I will post the info to the list.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  SPANISH GUITAR (aka Ports of Call)Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
Where the girls wouldn't sh-g, but we made 'em.Chorus:       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar, singing:
       Hi-jiggy-jiggy, f--k a little pig sideways,
       My idea of a woman is a big brown ass  (sh-t bag)
       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar.The next port of call was London
Where the girls didn't sh-g, so we b-mmed 'emThe next port of call we were waiting
So we found us a girl that liked f-llating.The next port of call was Harro
Where the girls would only f--k in a barrow.The next port of call was Wiggum
Where all the girls had real biggun's.Oh, the next port of call was Lake Como
[falsetto] Where I spent all the night with a homo

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:59:59 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

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P.S.  I'm pretty sure that others posted the word "fuck."        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of John Mehlberg
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 4:09 PM
To: [unmask]
Subject: Re: Follow the BandHey!Are there spam filters on this list?  My first, second and third
posting of this email did not go through because of
"objectionable" words.  Apparently one must use f--k !      ------------------------------------------
      --------- ORIGINAL POST -----------Dear Paul,I *believe* that the phrase "kiss a little pig" / "f--k a little
pig" is an old catch phrase but I don't know of any references.There is at least one other song which uses the phrase "f--k a
little pig" and was known to Air Force pilots in Vietnam:
"Ports of Call"  (text below).If I find out more about "little pig" and the associated songs,
I will post the info to the list.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  SPANISH GUITAR (aka Ports of Call)Oh, the first port of call was Aden, Aden,
Where the girls wouldn't sh-g, but we made 'em.Chorus:       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar, singing:
       Hi-jiggy-jiggy, f--k a little pig sideways,
       My idea of a woman is a big brown ass  (sh-t bag)
       Ten dollars a day, for a bunk-up each way,
       And a tune on my Spanish guitar.The next port of call was London
Where the girls didn't sh-g, so we b-mmed 'emThe next port of call we were waiting
So we found us a girl that liked f-llating.The next port of call was Harro
Where the girls would only f--k in a barrow.The next port of call was Wiggum
Where all the girls had real biggun's.Oh, the next port of call was Lake Como
[falsetto] Where I spent all the night with a homo

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:08:34 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

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As I said, very strange delays on "objectional" materials."Clean" stuff gets through in 1-3 minutes.Yours,John Mehlberg

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Subject: Those Pesky Filters
From: Cliff Abrams <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:18:18 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

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Some browsers, email programs, etc. have
"child-filters". Check to see if you have one, and
turn it off. AOL is notorious for this. Look in
"Preferences". It may be somewhere else on your hard
drive, depending upon your operating system. Search
for "filter"-- or similar. Good luck.
C.Hey!Are there spam filters on this list?  My first and
second posting
of this email did not go through because of
"objectionable" words

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:19:14 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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I don't know if the university did that or what, but I can look into that.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of John Mehlberg
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 6:09 PM
To: [unmask]
Subject: Re: Follow the BandAs I said, very strange delays on "objectional" materials."Clean" stuff gets through in 1-3 minutes.Yours,John Mehlberg

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: "Lisa - S. H." <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:23:34 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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At 05:08 PM 3/14/2005 -0600, you wrote:
>As I said, very strange delays on "objectional" materials.
>
>"Clean" stuff gets through in 1-3 minutes.
>
>Yours,
>
>John MehlbergThat's because They like to take a little more time carefully perusing the
"objectionable" posts.
Lisa

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Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:25:59 -0500
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I'm almost certain that the filtering wouldn't be at this end.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of Cliff Abrams
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 6:18 PM
To: [unmask]
Subject: Those Pesky FiltersSome browsers, email programs, etc. have
"child-filters". Check to see if you have one, and
turn it off. AOL is notorious for this. Look in
"Preferences". It may be somewhere else on your hard
drive, depending upon your operating system. Search
for "filter"-- or similar. Good luck.
C.Hey!Are there spam filters on this list?  My first and
second posting
of this email did not go through because of
"objectionable" words

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Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters
From: Beth Brooks <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:44:44 -0500
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Oddly enough, all of the Ballad-L messages come through just fine on my
email, which is a K-12 public school webmail service. I just make sure
I'm not reading your messages while I have kids in my room. The links to
"Salty Dick's Sea Shanties" even came through without filtering. These
are the same filters that wouldn't let me research French Lick Indiana
or morel mushrooms.Beth>>> [unmask] 03/14/05 6:25 PM >>>
I'm almost certain that the filtering wouldn't be at this end.

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:05:55 -0500
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On 2005/03/14 at 11:53:04AM -0800, Jonathan Lighter wrote:> A text from WWII appears in Pinto & Rodway's _The Common Muse_
> (1957?), but you'll have to find the high-priced edition, considered too        [ ... ]> At Mystic Seaport in 1988, it took little encouragement from a pair of
> female performers (their names escape me) to get an audience of a couple
> of hundred to break out in song and contribute stanzas.        I don't remember their individual names, but they sang under the
group name of "Compass Rose".  We've got a cassette of them, so I could
perhaps look it up.        And if you were at the same workshop that I was -- the purpose
of the workshop was to get Stan Hugil willing to sing some of the
original versions of the songs which he documented in his books in a
cleaned-up form.        The first song for that purpose was sung by Tom Lewis, after
stating that the Royal Navy had more dirty songs, both in number and
content than the merchant marine ever did (to which Stan replied "I
rather doubt that".  Tom certainly did set the tone, though I don't know
the title to what he sung.> The finale was,
>
> "My husband's a folk singer, folk singer, folk singer, etc....
> ...comes home and folks me."        With a *very* enthusiastic crowd singing along.        And Stan did unwind, including one of the incremental ones (I
placed my hand upon ... ) while using one of the members of Compass Rose
as a demonstration -- and I can say that as a result I have seen "the
blush on the rose". :-)        Enjoy,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Jean Lepley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 16:11:13 -0800
Content-Type:TEXT/PLAIN
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On Mon, 14 Mar 2005, Steve Gardham wrote:> Just been looking at a thread on Mudcat website 'Follow the Band' Similar
> things turning up. Several suggestions that the clean version was featured
> in a film.
> SteveG
>Not that I'm for censorship here, but I actually find the clean version
funnier.  I first heard it on board the wooden schooner Adventuress, with
the captain singing it at the tiller. I was on bow watch at the time, so
heard gales of laughter instead of a good many key words (the bow watch
does not abandon her post) -- still wonder what good verses of Captain
Wayne's I missed..  Along the same lines, of "clean dirty songs" (songs
I could sing to my granddaughter) there's "I Used to Work in Chicago":I used to work in Chicago, in a department store,
I used to work in Chicago, I did, but I don't anymore.
A lady came in and asked for some cake,
I asked her what kind she'd adore --
"Layer," she said, so layer I did.
I don't work there anymore.I wish I could give the (very effective) tune; variations on the store and
what the lady "adores" are legion. The song doesn't seem to be nearly as
widespread as "Follow the Band" though.  Anyone else know it?Jean

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Subject: Folklore Ebay List - 03/14/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:02:40 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hi!        Here is the new folklore list - the first covering a full week.        By the way, if anyone knows of another mailing list which might
be interested in this posting, feel free to pass it on (with proper
attribution of the source). I don't have time to subscribe & follow all
of the lists floating around the Net. :-)        4534313119 - English Fairy Tales by Jacobs, 1967 Dover reprint, $15
(ends Mar-15-05 13:39:39 PST)        4534319822 - Blue Nose Ghost by Creighton, 1994, $1.70 (ends
Mar-15-05 14:09:47 PST)        6950786288 - The Jack Tales by Chase, 1971 edition, $4.99 (ends
Mar-15-05 15:49:34 PST)        4534104583 - Down in the Holler A Gallery of Ozark Folk Speech by
Randolph & Wilson, 1953, $10.49 (ends Mar-15-05 18:45:00 PST)        4534398180 - Irish Folk History: Texts from the North by Glassie,
$9.99 (ends Mar-15-05 20:24:22 PST)        4534593689 - Folklore and the Sea by Beck, 1973, $9.99 (ends
Mar-16-05 15:27:18 PST)        6950936840 - Peasant Customs and Savage Myths by Dorson, 2 volumes,
1968, $10 w/reserve (ends Mar-16-05 19:45:00 PST)        6950962268 - The Folklore of Maine by Beck, 1957, $9.99 (ends
Mar-16-05 20:20:18 PST)        4534647431 - Blue Ridge Folklife by Olson, 1998, $6.25 (ends
Mar-16-05 20:43:41 PST)        4534649856 - 2 books (Irish Sagas & Folk Tales and Treasury of
Irish Folklore), 1982 & 1979, $2.99 (ends Mar-16-05 21:08:14 PST)        4535815113 - Gullah Folktales from the Georgia Coast by Jones,
2000, $3.99 (ends Mar-17-05 11:02:58 PST)        4534916817 - Folklore Matters by Dundes, 1993, $5.99 (ends Mar-17-05
19:47:53 PST)        4534978334 - Tales of Old Essex by Gray, 1987, 1.04 GBP (ends
Mar-18-05 06:15:42 PST)        4535088405 - Irish Folktales by Glassie, 1985, $6.95 (ends Mar-18-05
14:21:40 PST)        4535147077 - Greasy Grimy Gopher Guts by Sherman & Weisskopf, 1995,
$1.99 (ends Mar-18-05 20:45:57 PST)        6950874148 - Folklore from Iowa by Stout, 1936, $14.99 (ends
Mar-19-05 08:56:33 PST)        4535275986 - FOLKLORE OF THE SCOTTISH HIGHLANDS by Ross, 1976,
5.50 GBP (ends Mar-19-05 13:05:25 PST)        4535422118 - FORGOTTEN FOLK-TALES OF THE ENGLISH COUNTIES by
Tongue, 1970, 2.99 GBP (ends Mar-20-05 07:35:16 PST)        4535569754 - Curing the Cross-Eyed Mule Appalachian Mountain Humor
by Jones & Wheeler, 1989, $2.93 (ends Mar-20-05 14:50:08 PST)        6951681799 - New York Folklore Quarterly, Aug. 1946, $2.50 (ends
Mar-21-05 11:56:56 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:12:55 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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CLIFF ABRAMS
Some browsers, email programs, etc. have
"child-filters". Check to see if you have one, and
turn it off. AOL is notorious for this. Look in
"Preferences". It may be somewhere else on your hard
drive, depending upon your operating system. Search
for "filter"-- or similar. Good luck.MEHLBERG
No, there is no filtering on my end.  I own my own my last name
MEHLBERG.COM and there is no filtering on my server.
I often send myself much bawdier material than what I posted to
ballad-l today and there is no delay.As a test, I am sending this email twice with the same text
except the first will contain misspelled bawdy words and the next
sent 5 seconds later will contain spelled out bawdy words.
The delay between the two emails will tell us the "lag time"
of bawdry.fkuc siht mtheorfcukre fkuc tnees gdo dmande
ccoksukcre fkucs wrhoe hosuewvies  btchi.

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Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:13:17 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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CLIFF ABRAMS
Some browsers, email programs, etc. have
"child-filters". Check to see if you have one, and
turn it off. AOL is notorious for this. Look in
"Preferences". It may be somewhere else on your hard
drive, depending upon your operating system. Search
for "filter"-- or similar. Good luck.MEHLBERG
No, there is no filtering on my end.  I own my own my last name
MEHLBERG.COM and there is no filtering on my server.
I often send myself much bawdier material than what I posted to
ballad-l today and there is no delay.As a test, I am sending this email twice with the same text
except the first will contain misspelled bawdy words and the next
sent 5 seconds later will contain spelled out bawdy words.
The delay between the two emails will tell us the "lag time"
of bawdry.fuck shit motherfucker fuck teens god damned
cocksucker fucks whore housewives  bitch.

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: George Madaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:11:44 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Compass Rose also has a CD called Shipmates. Which I can't now find.George
George F Madaus
Professor Emeritus
Boston College
On Mar, 14, 2005, at 7:05 PM, DoN. Nichols wrote:> On 2005/03/14 at 11:53:04AM -0800, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
>
>> A text from WWII appears in Pinto & Rodway's _The Common Muse_
>> (1957?), but you'll have to find the high-priced edition, considered
>> too
>
>         [ ... ]
>
>> At Mystic Seaport in 1988, it took little encouragement from a pair of
>> female performers (their names escape me) to get an audience of a
>> couple
>> of hundred to break out in song and contribute stanzas.
>
>         I don't remember their individual names, but they sang under
> the
> group name of "Compass Rose".  We've got a cassette of them, so I could
> perhaps look it up.
>
>         And if you were at the same workshop that I was -- the purpose
> of the workshop was to get Stan Hugil willing to sing some of the
> original versions of the songs which he documented in his books in a
> cleaned-up form.
>
>         The first song for that purpose was sung by Tom Lewis, after
> stating that the Royal Navy had more dirty songs, both in number and
> content than the merchant marine ever did (to which Stan replied "I
> rather doubt that".  Tom certainly did set the tone, though I don't
> know
> the title to what he sung.
>
>> The finale was,
>>
>> "My husband's a folk singer, folk singer, folk singer, etc....
>> ...comes home and folks me."
>
>         With a *very* enthusiastic crowd singing along.
>
>         And Stan did unwind, including one of the incremental ones (I
> placed my hand upon ... ) while using one of the members of Compass
> Rose
> as a demonstration -- and I can say that as a result I have seen "the
> blush on the rose". :-)
>
>         Enjoy,
>                 DoN.
>
> --
>  Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
>         (too) near Washington D.C. |
> http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
>            --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:04:24 -0800
Content-Type:multipart/alternative
Parts/Attachments:
Parts/Attachments

text/plain(39 lines) , text/html(8 lines)


Sorry, your browser doesn't support iframes.


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Subject: Re: BALLAD-L Digest - 14 Mar 2005 - Special issue (#2005-115)
From: Joe Fineman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:09:24 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Automatic digest processor <[unmask]>, in the
person of Dick Greenhaus, writes:> Well, I first learned it in the mid-1940s, as part of my mis=spent
> youth on the streets of Brooklyn.Have you read _A Drinking Life_ by Pete Hamill?  It seems there were
various ways of misspending one's youth in that time & place, and his
included hearing his daddy sing "Paddy McGinty's Goat" in bars.
--
---  Joe Fineman    [unmask]||:  Beware of single-issue people and multiple-issue  :||
||:  organizations.                                    :||

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Dan Goodman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:29:11 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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Jean Lepley wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005, Steve Gardham wrote:
>
>>Just been looking at a thread on Mudcat website 'Follow the Band' Similar
>>things turning up. Several suggestions that the clean version was featured
>>in a film.
>>
> Not that I'm for censorship here, but I actually find the clean version
> funnier.  I first heard it on board the wooden schooner Adventuress, with
> the captain singing it at the tiller. I was on bow watch at the time, so
> heard gales of laughter instead of a good many key words (the bow watch
> does not abandon her post) -- still wonder what good verses of Captain
> Wayne's I missed..  Along the same lines, of "clean dirty songs" (songs
> I could sing to my granddaughter) there's "I Used to Work in Chicago":
>
> I used to work in Chicago, in a department store,
> I used to work in Chicago, I did, but I don't anymore.
> A lady came in and asked for some cake,
> I asked her what kind she'd adore --
> "Layer," she said, so layer I did.
> I don't work there anymore.
>
> I wish I could give the (very effective) tune; variations on the store and
> what the lady "adores" are legion. The song doesn't seem to be nearly as
> widespread as "Follow the Band" though.  Anyone else know it?I learned it in NYC in the mid-1960s.I used to work in Chicago, in a department store.
I used to work in Chicago, but now I don't live there no more.Lady came down to the hardware department,
Asked her what she'd have.
"Screw" she said, screw her I did,
And now I don't work there no more.--
Dan Goodman
Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.

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Subject: Re: BALLAD-L Digest - 14 Mar 2005 - Special issue (#2005-115)
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:40:25 -0800
Content-Type:multipart/alternative
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Parts/Attachments

text/plain(26 lines) , text/html(7 lines)


Sorry, your browser doesn't support iframes.


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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Jean Lepley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:54:41 -0800
Content-Type:TEXT/PLAIN
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PS  I learned the chorus as:Hey rig a jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band,
Follow the band, with your tool in your hand,
Hey rig a jig, kiss a little pig, follow the band,
Follow, follow the band.Which makes the clean version (if your mind is so inclined) slightly
dirtier?

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Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:56:26 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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On 2005/03/14 at 06:13:17PM -0600, John Mehlberg wrote:        [ ... ]> Received: (qmail 18021 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2005 00:14:12 -0000> Received: from listserv-prod.iu.edu (129.79.1.115)
>   by cadeau.d-and-d.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2005 00:14:12 -0000> Received: from iu-mssg-lstsv01 (listserv.indiana.edu) by
        listserv-prod.iu.edu (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1b) with SMTP id
        <[unmask]>; Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:13:19 -0500> Received: from LISTSERV.INDIANA.EDU by LISTSERV.INDIANA.EDU (LISTSERV-TCP/IP
>           release 1.8e) with spool id 10013992 for
>           [unmask]; Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:13:19 -0500> Received: from smtp819.mail.sc5.yahoo.com by listserv-prod.iu.edu (LSMTP for
>           Windows NT v1.1b) with SMTP id <[unmask]>;
>           Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:13:19 -0500> Received: from unknown (HELO 3146473883A) ([unmask]@69.155.191.101
>           with login) by smtp819.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2005
>           00:13:18 -0000> Date:         Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:13:17 -0600> As a test, I am sending this email twice with the same text
> except the first will contain misspelled bawdy words and the next
> sent 5 seconds later will contain spelled out bawdy words.
> The delay between the two emails will tell us the "lag time"
> of bawdry.        This one was the one with correct spelling, and (according to
the headers) I received it all of 54 seconds after the first system
received it from you -- or 55 seconds after you mailed it.        Note that headers are arranged in reverse order of action (that
is, new "Received: " headers are added at the top.        Also note that the first system to handle yours, and my system
are both recording the time in terms of GMT (-0000), while others are
recording the time in terms of local time (-0500 or -0600 being central
and mountain time, IIRC -- at least when DST is not in effect, as -0400
is Eastern Standard Time.)        So -- it would seem that there has been very little delay in
your message with all the supposed trigger words.        However -- sometimes mail servers can be temporarily overloaded,
and so a transfer is delayed an hour or two -- without human or filter
intervention.        And this timing covers from your system to mine, but *not* into
my mailbox, as that is delayed by some filtering on *this* end, which
looks for spam patterns, not "offensive" words.  As such, the
incorrectly spelled words are more "spam-like" than the correctly
spelled ones as they are trying to avoid fixed filters, not filters
which learn from other spam.        Enjoy,
                DoN.P.S.    I now remember the name under which the "Follow the band" song
        was introduced.  It was called _Tools of the Trade_.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: I Used To Work In Chicago
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:57:13 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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Here is a recording of "I Used To Work In Chicago":                  http://tinyurl.com/4z3dlThis song is *performed* as typed out below.       I USED TO WORK IN CHICAGOChorus (everyone):     I used to work in Chicago in an old department store
     I used to work in Chicago. I don't work there any more.Individual:  Oh, a lady came in for a chicken
Everyone:  A chicken from the store...
Individual:  A chicken she wanted; my cock she got.
Everyone:  I don't work there anymore.Chorus.Individual:   Oh, a lady came in for some cheddar
Everyone:  Some cheddar from the store.
Individual:   Some cheddar she wanted; blue vein (?) she got.
Everyone:  I don't work there anymore.Chorus.Individual:  Oh, a lady came in for some dentures.
Everyone:   Some dentures from the store.
Individual:  Lowers she wanted; up her I got.
Everyone:   I don't work there anymore.Chorus.Individual:  Oh, a lady came in for a camel.
Everyone:  A camel from the store.
Individual:  A camel she wanted; a hump she got.
Everyone:   I don't work there anymore.Chorus.Individual:  Oh, a lady came in for a carpet.
Everyone:   A carpet from the store.
Individual:  A carpet she wanted; laid she got.
Everyone:   I don't work there anymore.Chorus.Individual:  Oh, a lady came in for a flag.
Everyone:   A flag from the store.
Individual:  A flag she wanted; my pole she got.
Everyone:   I don't work there anymore.

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Roy Berkeley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:57:19 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Also:I used to work in Chicago in a department store
I used to work in Chicago -- I did, but I don't anymore...
A lady came in for some dresses; I asked her what kind she's adore;
"Jumper" she said; jump'er I did.
I did, but I don't anymore.----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 8:29 PM
Subject: Re: Follow the Band> Jean Lepley wrote:
>> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005, Steve Gardham wrote:
>>
>>>Just been looking at a thread on Mudcat website 'Follow the Band' Similar
>>>things turning up. Several suggestions that the clean version was
>>>featured
>>>in a film.
>>>
>> Not that I'm for censorship here, but I actually find the clean version
>> funnier.  I first heard it on board the wooden schooner Adventuress, with
>> the captain singing it at the tiller. I was on bow watch at the time, so
>> heard gales of laughter instead of a good many key words (the bow watch
>> does not abandon her post) -- still wonder what good verses of Captain
>> Wayne's I missed..  Along the same lines, of "clean dirty songs" (songs
>> I could sing to my granddaughter) there's "I Used to Work in Chicago":
>>
>> I used to work in Chicago, in a department store,
>> I used to work in Chicago, I did, but I don't anymore.
>> A lady came in and asked for some cake,
>> I asked her what kind she'd adore --
>> "Layer," she said, so layer I did.
>> I don't work there anymore.
>>
>> I wish I could give the (very effective) tune; variations on the store
>> and
>> what the lady "adores" are legion. The song doesn't seem to be nearly as
>> widespread as "Follow the Band" though.  Anyone else know it?
>
> I learned it in NYC in the mid-1960s.
>
> I used to work in Chicago, in a department store.
> I used to work in Chicago, but now I don't live there no more.
>
> Lady came down to the hardware department,
> Asked her what she'd have.
> "Screw" she said, screw her I did,
> And now I don't work there no more.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Dan Goodman
> Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
> Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
> Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
> All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
> John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.
>

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Subject: Re: rewards and fairies
From: Murray Shoolbraid <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:20:21 -0800
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Please, Liz! Thomas the Rhymer was Scots - Thomas of Ercildoune, documented,
as you say. - As for imposters, surely all those ballads of lovers in
disguise, girls dressing as sailors to join their true-loves, etc., etc.,
are relevant.
Murray Shoolbraid

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Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:12:11 -0800
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John:Oddly, I got both the version en clair, and the scrambled text at the end of  this email.  Trust me when I say that the university would never censor "fuck" even though it  might see your email originally as spam -- and THEN would encode/scramble it.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Date: Monday, March 14, 2005 4:12 pm
Subject: Re: Those Pesky Filters> CLIFF ABRAMS
> Some browsers, email programs, etc. have
> "child-filters". Check to see if you have one, and
> turn it off. AOL is notorious for this. Look in
> "Preferences". It may be somewhere else on your hard
> drive, depending upon your operating system. Search
> for "filter"-- or similar. Good luck.
>
> MEHLBERG
> No, there is no filtering on my end.  I own my own my last name
> MEHLBERG.COM and there is no filtering on my server.
> I often send myself much bawdier material than what I posted to
> ballad-l today and there is no delay.
>
> As a test, I am sending this email twice with the same text
> except the first will contain misspelled bawdy words and the next
> sent 5 seconds later will contain spelled out bawdy words.
> The delay between the two emails will tell us the "lag time"
> of bawdry.
>
> fkuc siht mtheorfcukre fkuc tnees gdo dmande
> ccoksukcre fkucs wrhoe hosuewvies  btchi
>
>
>
> .
>

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Subject: Stout's Iowa
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:16:00 -0800
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Folks:Dolores' trolling has turned up the following important and rare book:        6950874148 - Folklore from Iowa by Stout, 1936, $14.99 (ends
Mar-19-05 08:56:33 PST)There are  no fewer than 112 folksongs in this volume -- including Child ballads, American ballads, etc. -- collected prior to 1930.Ed

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 01:48:11 -0600
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<<This phrase comes from its use by musicians for a particular dance tune
popular throughout the English-speaking world.I am currently collecting such things - like arse-over-anna for the
varsovienna
Circassian Circle ... Circumcissional Circle
Virginia Reel .... Vagina Reel>>Sheebeg Shemore ... She Begged for More
Banish Misfortune ... Vanish Me Foreskin<<I will attempt to get the exact tune they sing it to.......>>Do, please!Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: Follow the Band
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 02:17:54 -0600
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> I used to work in Chicago, in a department store,
> I used to work in Chicago, I did, but I don't anymore.
> A lady came in and asked for some cake,
> I asked her what kind she'd adore --
> "Layer," she said, so layer I did.
> I don't work there anymore.It was recorded in the late 1940s by Larry Vincent, proprietor of Pearl
Records. He said he wrote it, but John Mehlberg has pointed out collections
well before his publication of the disc.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Going No Mail?
From: Debra Cowan <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:08:45 -0500
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Hey Kidz,Any way to go no mail on this list? Can I just send an email that says:set ballad-l nomailEnquiring minds want to know.Debra--******************************
Debra Cowan - Singer
website: http://www.DebraCowan.com
USA BOOKINGS: (508) 662-9746,
SNAIL-MAIL: P.O. Box 1335, Westborough, MA 01581
UK BOOKINGS: Vivienne Bloomfield   http://www.otheragency.co.uk
RECORDINGS/SALES: Falling Mountain Music (540) 877-2505
http://www.fallingmountain.com
******************************

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Subject: Re: Going No Mail?
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:14:39 -0500
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That should work.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]On
Behalf Of Debra Cowan
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 9:09 AM
To: [unmask]
Subject: Going No Mail?Hey Kidz,Any way to go no mail on this list? Can I just send an email that says:set ballad-l nomailEnquiring minds want to know.Debra--******************************
Debra Cowan - Singer
website: http://www.DebraCowan.com
USA BOOKINGS: (508) 662-9746,
SNAIL-MAIL: P.O. Box 1335, Westborough, MA 01581
UK BOOKINGS: Vivienne Bloomfield   http://www.otheragency.co.uk
RECORDINGS/SALES: Falling Mountain Music (540) 877-2505
http://www.fallingmountain.com
******************************

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Subject: Notes and Queries in Gutenberg Project
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
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Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 15:26:40 EST
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Subject: Re: Notes and Queries in Gutenberg Project
From: Steve Roud <[unmask]>
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Subject: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Educational CyberPlayGround <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 22:46:47 -0500
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Hi,Can anyone recommend someone who
can be an expert on the subject of camp songs?There is a reporter on KQED who would like to know.Please send the info directly to me.thanks for any help,Karen Ellis
Educational CyberPlayGround<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
The Educational CyberPlayGround
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/National Children's Folksong Repository
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/NCFR/Hot List of Schools Online and
Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/7 Hot Site Awards
New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/15/05 (Ballads & Folk Songs)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 15 Mar 2005 22:47:52 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hi!        Here is the regular list. There doesn't seem to be as much on
Ebay this week as sometimes.        SONGSTERS        6951796269 - The Diamond Songster containing the most approved
Sentiment IRISH SONGS, 1812, $1 (ends Mar-22-05 09:38:07 PST)        MISCELLANEOUS        4709791750 - North Carolina Ballads and Folk Songs by Moser, LP,
$5 (ends Mar-19-05 18:28:16 PST)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        6951198223 - Folk Songs of the Southern Appalachians by Ritchie,
1965, $0.99 (ends Mar-16-05 11:01:51 PST)        6950914292 - A Book Of Nursery Songs And Rhymes by Baring-Gould,
1895, 12 GBP (ends Mar-16-05 13:08:44 PST)        7306958983 - Songs From The Hills Of Vermont by Sturgis, $9.99
(ends Mar-16-05 16:07:03 PST)        6951005717 - English Minstrelsie by Baring-Gould, 1895, 1.04 GBP
(ends Mar-17-05 06:29:17 PST)        4534705801 - TALES & SONGS OF SOUTHERN ILLINOIS by Neely, 1998
reprint, $12.50 (ends Mar-17-05 06:32:45 PST)        6950707125 - JACOBITE SONGS AND BALLADS by MacQuoid, 1887, 7 GBP
(ends Mar-18-05 07:01:50 PST)        4535105012 - Steamboatin' Days: Folk Songs of the River Packet Era
by Wheeler, 1969, $9.99 (ends Mar-18-05 16:00:40 PST)        7307456300 - Songs of PENNSYLVANIA by Whitefield, 1949, $2.49 (ends
Mar-18-05 17:42:08 PST)        7307456936 - Songs of CALIFORNIA by Whitefield, 1949, $2.49 (ends
Mar-18-05 17:46:06 PST)        7307457473 - Songs of OHIO by Whitefield, 1949, $2.49 (ends
Mar-18-05 17:50:09 PST)        4535308268 - Songs of American Sailormen by Colcord, 1938, $9.99
(ends Mar-19-05 16:21:54 PST)        4535485106 - Marrow Bones: English Folk Songs from the Hammond and
Gardiner Mss by Purslow, 1965, 1.99 GBP (ends Mar-20-05 10:48:46 PST)        6951350748 -  OLD BALLADS HISTORICAL AND NARRATIVE by Evans, 4
volumes, 1810, 10.50 GBP (ends Mar-20-05 13:00:00 PST)        7500159162 - The Seeds of Love by Sedley, 1967, 4.99 GBP (ends
Mar-21-05 12:00:00 PST)        4535895620 - Anglo-American Folksong Style by Abrahams & Foss,
1968, $2.93 (ends Mar-21-05 16:10:03 PST)        4535924606 - Larry Gorman: The Man Who Made the Songs by Ives, 1993,
$3.99 (ends Mar-21-05 18:17:32 PST)        6951750759 - Folk Songs of American Negro by Work, 1907, $8.50
(ends Mar-22-05 00:12:32 PST)        4710683873 - American Folklore Society Biliography, volume 4, jazz,
1954, $8.95 (ends Mar-22-05 11:13:27 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 05:25:13 EST
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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: [unmask]
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Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 14:20:45 EST
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To reply to Fred McCormick.Moses Asch, the genial creator and PresidEnt of Folkways, Inc . not long
before his death contributed all of his Folkways record masters to the Smithsonian
Institution  in Washington, DC. The Smithsonian has promised that none of the
reords will be allowed to go "out of print, but will always be available for
purchase in tape form.   You'll find a complete listing (including four of my
records made 50 years ago) at
< http://www folkways  si,edu/search >.I hope you'll find what you wanted.Sam

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Subject: ha-ha
From: Andy Rouse <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:27:50 +0100
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You might all enjoy this.My mother-in-law is a 75-year-old chain smoker who prefers lighters but
occasionally buys a box of matches. My band usually practices at the
in-laws, and a couple of weeks ago there was a box of Hungarian-made
matches on the table with a photograph of the Hungarian music educator
Zolt? Kod?y on the top, with the legend beneath, "Keep away from
children!"Cheers,
Andy

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:35:45 -0500
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At the risk of over-self-promotion, I'd like to point out that
Smithsonian will provide /either /custom cassettes or cuastom CDs of any
recordings in their inventory. And you can obtain any of these CDs from
CAMSCO Music (800/548-FOLK <3655>) for four bucks less than the $20 that
SF charges.dick greenhaus[unmask] wrote:>To reply to Fred McCormick.
>
>Moses Asch, the genial creator and PresidEnt of Folkways, Inc . not long
>before his death contributed all of his Folkways record masters to the Smithsonian
>Institution  in Washington, DC. The Smithsonian has promised that none of the
>reords will be allowed to go "out of print, but will always be available for
>purchase in tape form.   You'll find a complete listing (including four of my
>records made 50 years ago) at
>< http://www folkways  si,edu/search >.
>
>I hope you'll find what you wanted.
>
>Sam
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Roy Berkeley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 18:42:07 -0500
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Back in the 70s there was a young woman named Patricia Averill who used to
deliver papers at AFS meetings on that very topic...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Educational CyberPlayGround" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 10:46 PM
Subject: Question re: Camp Songs> Hi,
>
> Can anyone recommend someone who
> can be an expert on the subject of camp songs?
>
> There is a reporter on KQED who would like to know.
>
> Please send the info directly to me.
>
> thanks for any help,
>
>
> Karen Ellis
> Educational CyberPlayGround
>
> <>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
> The Educational CyberPlayGround
> http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/
>
> National Children's Folksong Repository
> http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/NCFR/
>
> Hot List of Schools Online and
> Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
> http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/
>
> 7 Hot Site Awards
> New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
> USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
> <>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
>

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Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Dan Goodman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:21:52 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(37 lines)


I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood FlowerI need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
"Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".I'm wondering if the song he has uses the word "lyder" as a perversion =
of "leader" (or possibly vice versa with etymology!), but I can find no
reliable proof.  Also, what is the earliest version of this song?  I =
only found the 1860 and 1920s versions--and none with an explanation of
why the "pale aronatus" reference was later replaced with the (less
logical) "leader".Any help is appreciated because I'M curious, too!My guess:  The word doesn't mean anything.  It was what one singer who
transmitted it thought he/she heard.--
Dan Goodman
Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Jon Bartlett <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 19:54:24 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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I knew it as 'amanita' but I suspect the whole song is full of such
mondegreens.
Jon Bartlett
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 7:21 PM
Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower> I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:
>
> Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
> From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
> Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
> I need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
> from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
> would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
> etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
> have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
> "Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
> red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
> dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"
>
> I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
> pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".
>
> I'm wondering if the song he has uses the word "lyder" as a perversion =
> of "leader" (or possibly vice versa with etymology!), but I can find no
> reliable proof.  Also, what is the earliest version of this song?  I =
> only found the 1860 and 1920s versions--and none with an explanation of
> why the "pale aronatus" reference was later replaced with the (less
> logical) "leader".
>
> Any help is appreciated because I'M curious, too!
>
> My guess:  The word doesn't mean anything.  It was what one singer who
> transmitted it thought he/she heard.
>
> --
> Dan Goodman
> Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
> Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
> Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
> All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
> John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.
>

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Jon Bartlett <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 20:07:07 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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Sorry - 'pale Amanita and Iris so blue'.Jon Bartlett----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 7:21 PM
Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower> I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:
>
> Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
> From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
> Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
> I need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
> from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
> would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
> etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
> have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
> "Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
> red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
> dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"
>
> I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
> pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".
>
> I'm wondering if the song he has uses the word "lyder" as a perversion =
> of "leader" (or possibly vice versa with etymology!), but I can find no
> reliable proof.  Also, what is the earliest version of this song?  I =
> only found the 1860 and 1920s versions--and none with an explanation of
> why the "pale aronatus" reference was later replaced with the (less
> logical) "leader".
>
> Any help is appreciated because I'M curious, too!
>
> My guess:  The word doesn't mean anything.  It was what one singer who
> transmitted it thought he/she heard.
>
> --
> Dan Goodman
> Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
> Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
> Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
> All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
> John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.
>

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Sammy Rich <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:11:13 -0500
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Pale amanita and eye-slip so blue is they way I was taght it.SRich
>
> From: Jon Bartlett <[unmask]>
> Date: 2005/03/16 Wed PM 11:07:07 EST
> To: [unmask]
> Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
> Sorry - 'pale Amanita and Iris so blue'.
>
> Jon Bartlett
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
> To: <[unmask]>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 7:21 PM
> Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
>
> > I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:
> >
> > Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
> > From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
> > Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
> >
> > I need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
> > from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
> > would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
> > etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
> > have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
> > "Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
> > red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
> > dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"
> >
> > I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
> > pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".
> >
> > I'm wondering if the song he has uses the word "lyder" as a perversion =
> > of "leader" (or possibly vice versa with etymology!), but I can find no
> > reliable proof.  Also, what is the earliest version of this song?  I =
> > only found the 1860 and 1920s versions--and none with an explanation of
> > why the "pale aronatus" reference was later replaced with the (less
> > logical) "leader".
> >
> > Any help is appreciated because I'M curious, too!
> >
> > My guess:  The word doesn't mean anything.  It was what one singer who
> > transmitted it thought he/she heard.
> >
> > --
> > Dan Goodman
> > Journal http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
> > Decluttering: http://decluttering.blogspot.com
> > Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
> > All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
> > John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.
> >
>

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:15:40 EST
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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Malcolm Douglas <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 05:43:08 -0000
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Goodman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: 17 March 2005 03:21
Subject: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower> I'm passing on this Stumpers query to the Ballad-L list:
>
> Date:    Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:00:57 -0500
> From:    Sarah Cody <[unmask]>
> Subject: Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
>
> I need help finding the meaning of a word for a patron.  He has a lyric
> from the old song "Wildwood Flower" that uses the word "lyder," and he
> would like to know the meaning of that word.  None of our dictionary or
> etymology sources have that word listed.  Through a Google search, I =
> have found that the lyric in question typically is written as follows:
> "Oh, I'll twine with my mingles and waving black hair/With the roses so
> red and the lilies so fair/And the myrtles so bright with emerald =
> dew/The pale and the leader and eyes look like blue"
>
> I also found a version dated 1860 that lists the last line as:  "And the
> pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue".------------The 1860 "version" appears to be the original song, "I'll twine 'mid the ringlets", written by Maud
Irving and J P  Webster. A mutation of "pale aronatus with eyes of bright blue" into "pale and the
leader and eyes look like blue" wouldn't be very surprising or unusual, particularly as so few
people are likely to know what "aronatus" is.I expect that some poking around in indexes would provide publication details.Re Heather's comment on amanita, I gather that the impressive effects described by Graves are more
usually experienced as nausea and vomiting. Gunther Grass (I think) mentioned a technique that I
believe I've heard of elsewhere, which involved first processing the fungi through a horse in order
to remove the toxins while leaving the active ingredients intact. There may be some sort of analogy
involving folk music to be had there.Malcolm

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Subject: Re: ha-ha
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:18:38 -0800
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Andy:Now if you hjad said it was a picture of Bela Bartok  holding the third book of "Microkosmos" I would have beliueved you.  But Kodaly, composer of the genial  "Hary Janos"?  Never.Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Rouse <[unmask]>
Date: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 12:27 pm
Subject: ha-ha> You might all enjoy this.
> 
> My mother-in-law is a 75-year-old chain smoker who prefers lighters 
> butoccasionally buys a box of matches. My band usually practices at 
> thein-laws, and a couple of weeks ago there was a box of Hungarian-
> madematches on the table with a photograph of the Hungarian music 
> educatorZolt? Kod?y on the top, with the legend beneath, "Keep 
> away from
> children!"
> 
> Cheers,
> Andy
>

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Subject: Mushrooms
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:25:10 -0800
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Heather wrote:  "Amanita is a toadstool. Amanita Muscaria is the red-with-white-spots one eaten by Bacchus and his maenads, per Robert Graves' White Goddess, p. 45: "[it] gives them enormous muscular strength, erotic power, delirious visions, and the gift of prophecy."Which prompts me to ask, where do I buy this toadstool?Ed

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 01:37:18 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Sammy Rich" <[unmask]><<Pale amanita and eye-slip so blue is they way I was taght it.>>Unfortunately, "amanita" is a family of mushrooms, mostly poisonous, hardly
an attractive image. They are, however, pale.I've always heard it as "amelita", a word which is not in my dictionary.
Neither is "eye-slip", but "Islip" is a town in New York. Still doesn't fit
too well.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: ha-ha
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
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Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 05:08:26 EST
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Subject: Re: Mushrooms
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
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Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 05:12:26 -0800
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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: "Cohen, Ronald" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:27:57 -0500
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Here are some suggestions. Some of the songs in Marcia and Jon Pankake, A PRARIE HOME COMPANION FOLK SONG BOOK might be in the realm of camp songs. More to the point, the Cooperative Recreation Service issued a number of songbooks designed for children, at camp or otherwise. It was organized by Lynn Rohrbough in 1930, and published over 600 songbooks. A diss. was written by Larry Holcomb in 1972 at the Univ. of Michigan, "A History of the Cooperative Recreation Service." It includes a listing of the songbooks, many published for specific organizations. There are many camp songbooks, religious and otherwise. Ronald CohenSubject:        Question re: Camp SongsHi,Can anyone recommend someone who
can be an expert on the subject of camp songs?There is a reporter on KQED who would like to know.Please send the info directly to me.thanks for any help,Karen Ellis
Educational CyberPlayGround<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
The Educational CyberPlayGround
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/National Children's Folksong Repository
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/NCFR/Hot List of Schools Online and
Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/7 Hot Site Awards
New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:48:22 -0500
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Sing Out 3 p3 has 'Pale emanita and eyes look like blue'
Silverman various pub. has 'Pale emanita and eyslip so blue'
Henry (Beech Mountain) has 'Pale Emneta with eyes of dark blue'
Brown (North carolina Folklore) has 'Pale Armeta with eyes of dark blue'
I have a vague recollection of 'Pale Carmelita with eyes of pale blue'
possibly Baez.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:53:04 -0500
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I just Googled 'emanita' and apart from Emanita being a female Spanish
Christian name it threw out this whole speculation on a multiplicity of
sites.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Cal Lani Lani Herrmann <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:25:17 -0800
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On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 09:27:57AM -0500, Cohen, Ronald wrote:
> Here are some suggestions. Some of the songs in Marcia and Jon Pankake, A PRARIE HOME COMPANION FOLK SONG BOOK might be in the realm of camp songs. More to the point, the Cooperative Recreation Service issued a number of songbooks designed for children, at camp or otherwise. It was organized by Lynn Rohrbough in 1930, and published over 600 songbooks. A diss. was written by Larry Holcomb in 1972 at the Univ. of Michigan, "A History of the Cooperative Recreation Service." It includes a listing of the songbooks, many published for specific organizations. There are many camp songbooks, religious and otherwise. Ronald Cohen
>
I have added in past discussions that The Coop Rec Service was
sold by the Rohrbaughs and now resides in Burnsville NC as World
Around Songs.  Last time I looked (last year) they still have a
website, worldaroundsongs.com, and are in basically the same
business, selling inexpensive pocket-sized books of songs (many
of them 'folk') as well as producing custom collections for
affinity groups such as schools and church clubs.  Thanks for
the added info and for the added encouragement to me for making
a list.  I think Lynn Wolz at Indiana initiated the last exchange
a year or so ago.  -- Aloha, Lani<||> Lani Herrmann * [unmask] (or: [unmask])
<||> 5621 Sierra Ave. * Richmond, CA 94805 * (510) 237-7360

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:26:16 -0500
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Somewhere in Kentucky, I heard it sung "...pale esmeralita.."
dick greenhaus
Paul Stamler wrote:>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Sammy Rich" <[unmask]>
>
><<Pale amanita and eye-slip so blue is they way I was taght it.>>
>
>Unfortunately, "amanita" is a family of mushrooms, mostly poisonous, hardly
>an attractive image. They are, however, pale.
>
>I've always heard it as "amelita", a word which is not in my dictionary.
>Neither is "eye-slip", but "Islip" is a town in New York. Still doesn't fit
>too well.
>
>Peace,
>Paul
>
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:46:14 -0600
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Hi folks:This is a very interesting and useful discussion, but may I remind folks
that the original poster was looking for someone who is an *expert* on camp
songs, to be interviewed by a television reporter doing a story on the
subject? So far I've seen lots of suggestions on where to find the songs,
but only one mention of someone who could be interviewed.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:53:04 EST
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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: Mary Cliff <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 13:02:27 -0500
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Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]> writes:
> looking for someone who is an *expert* on camp
>songs, to be interviewed by a television reporter doing a story on the
>subject
I answered her directly, as others might have.Mary Cliff, TRADITIONS
WETA Radio

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Subject: Re: ? Word lyder and song Wildwood Flower
From: Kathy Kaiser <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:42:23 -0600
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Subject: Re: Question re: Camp Songs
From: scott utley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 18 Mar 2005 08:41:32 -0500
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Subject: Blue Grass Roy
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 19 Mar 2005 07:07:29 EST
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Subject: Ebay List - 03/19/05 (Songsters)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 19 Mar 2005 22:09:45 -0500
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Hi!        It looks like 3 separate lists this week - songsters tonight,
general folklore tomorrow night and ballads/songs on Monday night.        SONGSTERS        6951857788 - The Comic Songster, 1880?, $9.99 (ends Mar-20-05
17:51:24 PST)        7308456308 - BROWN & LYN'S CIRCUS & COLORED MINSTRELS SONGSTER,
1928, $9 (ends Mar-22-05 18:47:55 PST)        6951971226 - Martha Washington Temperance Songster, $14.99 (ends
Mar-23-05 14:59:45 PST)        3965433224 - Gorton's Original New Orleans Minstrels And Gold
Band Songster, 1880?, $9.99 (ends Mar-25-05 14:38:28 PST)        6951752636 - Rough and Ready Songster, 1848, 500 GBP (ends
Mar-25-05 15:15:00 PST)        3965403421 - Bonnie Runnell's Great Barnum and London Circus
Dutch Burlesque Clown Songster, 1882, $9 (ends Mar-28-05 17:42:00 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Folklore Ebay List - 03/20/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 20 Mar 2005 20:50:52 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hi!        As promised, here is list #2 - folklore books & journals.        4535893122 - Folklore on the American Land by Emrich, 1972, $6.50
(ends Mar-21-05 15:55:20 PST)        4535895752 - Like We Say Back Home by Syatt, 1990, $2.93 (ends
Mar-21-05 16:10:55 PST)        4535899334 - The Science of Folklore by Krappe, 1964, $3.93 (ends
Mar-21-05 16:28:20 PST)        4535899393 - A Guide for Field Workers in Folklore by Goldstein,
1964, $2.93 (ends Mar-21-05 16:28:40 PST)        4536129488 - An Ornery Bunch, 1999, $2.99 (ends Mar-22-05 14:59:05
PST)        6951494205 - HUMANIORA by Hand, 1960, $24.95 (ends Mar-13-05
10:45:48 PST)        5176047486 - The Australian Yarns Legends Ballads by Wannan, 1979,
$2 AU (ends Mar-24-05 04:41:38 PST)        4536462472 - Folklore of Canada by Fowke, 1976, $9.99 (ends
Mar-24-05 06:14:58 PST)        4536489923 - Stiff As a Poker: A Collection of Ozark Folk Tales by
Randolph, 1993, $6.50 (ends Mar-24-05 08:14:48 PST)        4535803776 - YORKSHIRE TALES AND LEGENDS by Scott, 1990, 0.99 GBP
(ends Mar-24-05 10:26:22 PST)        4536632306 - Ozark Magic and Folklore by Randolph, 1964 Dover
edition, $7 (ends Mar-24-05 16:42:26 PST)        6952184378 - LORE OF FAITH & FOLLY by Cheney, Fife & Brooks, $5
(ends Mar-24-05 20:46:54 PST)        4537068046 - PISSING IN THE SNOW-AND OTHER OZARK FOLKTALES by
Randolph, 1977, $3.99 (ends Mar-26-05 13:47:48 PST)        6952402985 - California Folklore Quarterly, 16 issues, 1941-44,
$9.95 (ends Mar-26-05 14:14:15 PST)        4533761299 - The Talking Turtle and other Ozark Folk Tales by
Randolph, 1957, $4 (ends Apr-05-05 16:06:47 PDT)        4534739334 - Folk Culture on St. Helena Island South Carolina by
Johnson, 1968, $45 (ends Jul-08-05 09:53:48 PDT)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: earworms
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 21 Mar 2005 09:19:45 EST
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 Can't Get It Out of My Head Mar 20, 2005 2:51 pm US/Eastern
Have you ever had one of those days when you can’t get a song out of your 
head? What part of the brain controls this and can we use this to our advantage? 
Researchers at Dartmouth decided to take a look and write about it in the 
journal Nature. They looked at spontaneous forms of sound imagery that occur in 
everyday life. In the study, participants’ brains were monitored while they 
listened to excerpts from familiar and unfamiliar songs. Sections of music were 
removed at different points during the soundtracks and replaced with silent 
gaps. The researchers found that gaps in familiar songs led to more neural 
activity in parts of the brain that control the way we hear things. The area hit is 
called the primary auditory cortex. Knowing what parts of the brain are 
affected may lead researchers to figure out the way we remember things and aid with 
learning. 

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/22/05 (Songbooks, etc.)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 22 Mar 2005 22:08:24 -0500
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Hi!        Here is the list of songbooks and related miscellaneous items.
It includes a couple of biographies/autobiographies which I could have
put in the general folklore. Any opinions?        MISCELLANEOUS        4711698697 - smoky mountain ballads, 5 78 records, $48 (ends
Mar-23-05 17:59:59 PST)        6951909727 - English Folk Dance & Song, 7 issues, 1950-62, 4.99
GBP (ends Mar-26-05 07:00:54 PST)        4536243038 - Folk Music Journal, EFDSS, 1974, 2.99 GBP (ends
Mar-26-05 07:01:11 PST)        4536255829 - Essex Review, 1955, 1.99 GBP (ends Mar-26-05 08:11:34
PST)        7309293771 - Gentleman's Magazine, April 1739, $65 (ends Mar-26-05
10:19:33 PST)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        4536649098 - Folksingers & Folksongs of America by Lawless, $1.25
(ends Mar-24-05 17:51:22 PST)        7308956662 - A Catalogue of an Unique collection of Ancient English
Broadside Ballads printed entirely in the Black Letter, 1856, $22 (ends
Mar-24-05 18:46:29 PST)        4536693890 - Old-Time Songs and Poetry of Newfoundland by Doyle,
1966 edition, $29.95 (ends Mar-24-05 21:03:30 PST)        4536845484 - Bush Ballads of Australia, 1985, $15 (ends Mar-25-05
13:36:28 PST)        4537407735 - Lithuanian Folksongs in America by Balys, 1958,
$24.95 (ends Mar-25-05 21:51:35 PST)        4712540567 - Fifty Folk Songs by Sharp, 1 GBP (ends Mar-26-05
07:59:59 PST)        4537069668 - Norwegian Emigrant Songs and Ballads by Blegen & Ruud,
1979 reprint, $9.99 (ends Mar-26-05 13:56:45 PST)        4537097314 - Songs of Miramichi by Manny & Wilson, 1968, $12.99
(ends Mar-26-05 16:54:06 PST)        4537109062 - HELEN CREIGHTON: A LIFE IN FOLKLORE by Creighton,
1975, $9.99 (ends Mar-26-05 18:10:10 PST)        4537162217 - FANNIE HARDY ECKSTORM. A DESCRIPTIVE BIBLIOGRAPHy by
Whitten, 1975, $6 (ends Mar-27-05 03:49:19 PST)        4537842771 - Living Country Blues by Oster, 1969, $19.99 (ends
Mar-27-05 06:06:56 PST)        6952476215 - Ballads & Songs Of Lancashire by Harland, 1882, 9.99
GBP (ends Mar-27-05 06:29:57 PST)        7502224516 - BASCOM LAMAR LUNSFORD Minstrel of the Appalachians,
1966, $8.99 (ends Mar-27-05 10:11:12 PST)        4537302483 - First Book of Irish Ballads by O'Keefe, 1955, $9 (ends
Mar-27-05 14:38:09 PST)        4537351874 - 2 books (Folk Songs and Singing Games of the Ilinois
Ozarks by McIntosh, 1974 and Southern Folk Ballads by McNeil, 1987, $1.99
(ends Mar-27-05 17:43:48 PST)        7309676171 - WALTER PETERSON MOUNTAIN BALLADS and OLD TIME SONGS,
1927, $12.99 (ends Mar-27-05 19:15:13 PST)        7308967949 - Sea Songs & Shanties by Whall, 1974 reprint, $0.99
(ends Mar-27-05 19:21:25 PST)        7310032888 - SONGS OF THE SAILOR AND LUMBERMAN by Doerflinger,
1972 edition, $14.95 (ends Mar-28-05 12:52:10 PST)        7310110857 - REILLY'S DAUGHTER, 1968, $6.95 (ends Mar-28-05 15:31:35
PST)        7310113024 - SONGS SUNG IN SUFFOLK by Howson, 1992, $19.95 (ends
Mar-28-05 15:43:48 PST)        7502912122 - Folk Songs of the Caribbean by Morse, $1.99 (ends
Mar-28-05 23:08:46 PST)        4537561686 - Pennsylvania Songs and Legends by Korson, 1949, $1.99
(ends Mar-29-05 08:45:00 PST)        7310268183 - 2 books of cowboy songs (The Happy Cowboy & Songs of
the Roaming Range), 1934-5, $7 (ends Mar-29-05 10:33:42 PST)        4537010219 - Early To Rise: A Sussex Boyhood by Copper, 1976, 4.99
GBP (ends Mar-29-05 14:00:00 PST)        6952402976 - Legend of the Blind Beggar's Daughter of Bednal-Green
by Vale, 1933, 4.99 GBP (ends Mar-29-05 14:14:11 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 25 Mar 2005 14:01:04 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(15 lines)


Hello everyone,For those interested in such things, here are two _Merry Muses of
Caledonia_ one is an openly (?) printed edition from 1905 (6.6MB)
and the other is a complete copy of the infamous "1827" edition
(4.6MB).http://immortalia.com/1905-the-merry-muses-waverly-company.ziphttp://immortalia.com/1872-merry-muses-complete.zipEnjoy.John Mehlberg

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Subject: Re: My order
From: Thomas Stern <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 25 Mar 2005 17:37:48 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hello David Kleiman,
  Still have not received my order!
  Please let me know what is going on.
Thomas Stern.----- Original Message -----
From: "David Kleiman" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 12:08 PM
Subject: Re: My orderDear Ballad Fellows,We cannot (and will not) normally (some do slip through) answer support and
ordering messages received through public forums.  I don't get to check the
Ballad-L that frequently and the staff do not have Ballad-L accounts.  Also,
I assume that those of you ordering do not want to broadcast your credit
card info to a public list-serve.Please make sure that support and/or ordering queries intended for Heritage
Muse, ESPB Publishing, or me are emailed directly to one of the following:[unmask]
[unmask]
[unmask]Thank you all.David M. Kleiman
President & CEO
Heritage Muse, Inc. & ESPB Publishing, Ltd.

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 25 Mar 2005 19:05:42 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(26 lines)


Thanx much, John
dick greenhausJohn Mehlberg wrote:>Hello everyone,
>
>For those interested in such things, here are two _Merry Muses of
>Caledonia_ one is an openly (?) printed edition from 1905 (6.6MB)
>and the other is a complete copy of the infamous "1827" edition
>(4.6MB).
>
>http://immortalia.com/1905-the-merry-muses-waverly-company.zip
>
>http://immortalia.com/1872-merry-muses-complete.zip
>
>
>Enjoy.
>
>John Mehlberg
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: My order
From: Mike Luster <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 25 Mar 2005 19:23:09 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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David,Perhaps you could post a general statement on the English and Scottish Popular Ballads electronic edition and its current status. I've been waiting myself since October 2003.
--
Mike Luster
KEDM FM
611A Roselawn Ave.
Monroe, LA  71201Creole Statement/AmericanaRama
airs Saturdays 7-11PM CST
archived programs available at:
http://kedm.org/creolestatement/real.htm
http://kedm.org/americanarama/real.htm
KEDM.org
[unmask]
318-342-5565 studio line
318-324-1665 voice or fax"The music choices and opinions on these programs are my own and not those of KEDM, its management, or the University of Louisiana at Monroe."

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/26/05 (Songsters)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 15:41:38 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(38 lines)


Hi!        Time for my weekly interruption of agoing threads (although
there doesn't seem to be much this week). The folklore list will follow
later today and the ballads/songs list tomorrow.        6520223266 - The Popular Songster, 1869, $16.50 (ends Mar-27-05
15:58:49 PST)        6952584917 - The Grant Songster, For the Campaign of 1868, $9.99
(ends Mar-27-05 16:55:48 PST)        7143751155 - Merchant's Gargling Oil Songsters, 1888, $7.99
(ends Mar-27-05 20:12:48 PST)        6164947283 - MERCHANTS GARGLING OIL Songster, 1890, $5 (ends
Mar-28-05 11:28:39 PST)        3966365329 - Great Circus Songster, 1899, $19.99 (ends Mar-28-05
18:51:57 PST)        7310234876 - The Prohibition Songster, 1885, $6 (ends Mar-29-05
07:48:07 PST)        6165453261 - 2 booklets inc. The Funny Clown Songster, 1893,
$4.95 (ends Mar-30-05 04:03:34 PST)        7310530612 - Cole & Lockwood All New United Shows 1894 Up To
Date Songster, 1894, $11.50 (ends Mar-30-05 13:01:06 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 16:22:29 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hi, I have a Panther paperback 1970 by Barke and Smith.
Does anyone know if there is anything interesting in the originals
mentioned that isn't in the paperback?
Twill save me much searching possibly to come up with nothing.
Thanks.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 14:00:06 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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Steve:I'm no help.  I have the original hardcover, but not the Panther reprint.  However, I would guess they are one and the same in contents.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Date: Saturday, March 26, 2005 1:22 pm
Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs> Hi, I have a Panther paperback 1970 by Barke and Smith.
> Does anyone know if there is anything interesting in the originals
> mentioned that isn't in the paperback?
> Twill save me much searching possibly to come up with nothing.
> Thanks.
> SteveG
>

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 16:29:31 -0600
Content-Type:text/plain
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Dear Steve,All _Merry Muses of Caledonia_ have differing content (see
Legman's 1964 _Merry Muses_).   The Barke & Smith edition
contains songs not found in the 1st edition (two known copies).Legman's 1964 version of _The Merry Muses_ is a type-facsimille
of the one, then known, copy of the 1st edition and there is G.
Ross Roy's 2000 photo-facsimille edition from the later
discovered copy of the 1st edition.   Legman's bibliography of
the various editions and his listing of the songs which are added
& removed is important and Legman's addition of the Cunningham
manuscript is also important.   So everyone should own a copy of
Legman's _Merry Muses of Caledonia_.I don't have time to OCR the various _Merry Muses_ in my
collection.  But if anyone wants to work on them, please feel
free as the PDFs on my website contain 600DPI black & white page
images.Yours,John Mehlberg
~
My, mostly traditional, bawdy songs, toasts and recitations
website: www.immortalia.com----- Original Message -----
From: "edward cray" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 4:00 PM
Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFsSteve:I'm no help.  I have the original hardcover, but not the Panther
reprint.  However, I would guess they are one and the same in
contents.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Date: Saturday, March 26, 2005 1:22 pm
Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs> Hi, I have a Panther paperback 1970 by Barke and Smith.
> Does anyone know if there is anything interesting in the
> originals
> mentioned that isn't in the paperback?
> Twill save me much searching possibly to come up with nothing.
> Thanks.
> SteveG
>

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Subject: Folklore Ebay List - 03/26/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 26 Mar 2005 19:47:24 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
Parts/Attachments:

text/plain(52 lines)


Hi!        Ok - here is the second installment. :-) See you tomorrow!        6521224383 - American Gas Station : History and Folklore of Gas
Stations in America by Witzel, $24.95 (ends Mar-27-05 11:31:04 PST)        4537633992 - Discovering The Folklore of Plants by Baker, 1975,
1.50 GBP (ends Mar-28-05 11:44:32 PST)        4538353840 - Myths and Folk-Lore of Ireland by Curtin, 1975, $5
(ends Mar-29-05 06:37:25 PST)        4537862816 - The Golden Log, Texas Folklore Society, 1962, $3.99
(ends Mar-29-05 07:54:38 PST)        4537982984 - Stiff As A Poker by Randolph, 1993 edition, $8.99
(ends Mar-29-05 17:27:29 PST)        4538340337 - Body, Boots & Britches by Thompson, 1940 edition,
$7.95 (ends Mar-31-05 04:57:32 PST)        4537682521 - PREHISTORIC MONUMENTS OF GUERNSEY AND ASSOCIATED
FOLKLORE by Cox, 1982, 2.99 GBP (ends Mar-31-05 13:02:42 PST)        7964259134 - The Classic Fairy Tales by Opie, 1994, $7.99 (ends
Apr-01-05 10:01:23 PST)        4538725101 - The Spirit of Folk Art by Glassie, 1989, $5.95 (ends
Apr-01-05 16:17:59 PST)        4538842497 - Listen For A Lonesome Drum by Carmer, 1936, $8 (ends
Apr-02-05 05:04:44 PST)        3967178417 - Stars Fell on Alabama by Carmer, 1934, $19.99 (ends
Apr-02-05 07:53:44 PST)        4538424584 - the Folklore of Somerset by Palmer, 1976, 4.99 GBP
(ends Apr-03-05 12:35:53 PDT)        4538466406 - YORKSHIRE TALES AND LEGENDS by Scott, 1990, 0.99 GBP
(ends Apr-03-05 15:09:04 PDT)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: Two _Merry Muses_ PDFs
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sun, 27 Mar 2005 15:29:59 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Thanks, John, Ed,
The simplest answer must be to start by comparing lists of contents.
SteveG

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Subject: FW: LISTSERV Unavailable Wednesday, March 30th, 5-9pm
From: "Steiner, Margaret" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 28 Mar 2005 15:53:10 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Just want to let you know that the list will be unavalable on Wednesday, March 30th, from five P.M. to nine P.M.Peace.        Marge -----Original Message-----
From: LSTMAINT 
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 3:10 PM
To: [unmask]
Subject: LISTSERV Unavailable Wednesday, March 30th, 5-9pmDO NOT REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE.  Please direct your responses/queries to
[unmask]LISTSERV will be unavailable Wednesday, March 30th, 5-9pm for an upgrade
to version 14.3. The web management page will also be unavailable during
this time.  For information about some of the new features please see
this Knowledge Base article, http://kb.indiana.edu/data/aqqg.html.During the upgrade, messages to lists will be spooled on the mail relay
machines and they will be delivered once the service comes back online.Thank you,IU LISTSERV Administration
UITS Messaging Team
Indiana University

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/28/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Mon, 28 Mar 2005 18:53:58 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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text/plain(90 lines)


Hi!        Here is the 3rd installment for this week. :-) See you in few
days.        MISCELLANEOUS        4714217964 - A Treasury of Field Recordings, volume 1, LP, 1962,
$6.99 (ends Mar-31-05 16:33:19 PST)        5568490537 - AMERICANA ILLUSTRATED, magazine, Oct. 1940, $9.50
(ends Apr-03-05 18:11:43 PDT)        6953745764 - EIGHTEENTH-CENTURY IRELAND, journal, 1989, $24.99
(ends Apr-03-05 20:26:06 PDT)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        7310331217 - Lonesome Tunes Folk Songs From the Kentucky Mountains
by Wyman, 1944, $12 (ends Mar-29-05 14:47:26 PST)        6953121798 - Folk singers and Folksongs in America by Lawless,
1960, $9.95 (ends Mar-30-05 07:36:42 PST)        7310487144 - Carson J Robison's Folio of Hill Country Songs and
Ballads, 1928, $4.99 (ends Mar-30-05 10:08:33 PST)        6953167791 - English Songs and Ballads by Crosland, 1927, 0.99 GBP
(ends Mar-30-05 13:17:16 PST)        6953174407 - SOUTH CAROLINA BALLADS by Smith, 1928, $85 (ends
Mar-30-05 14:10:01 PST)        4538464427 - Folk Songs of Canada by Fowke, 1970, $5 (ends
Mar-31-05 14:00:18 PST)        7310773140 - The Jolly Herring, 3.99 GBP (ends Mar-31-05 14:15:59
PST)        4538540351 - The Erotic Muse by Cray, 1992 edition, $9.99 (ends
Mar-31-05 20:23:19 PST)        4538635174 - SONGS OF IRELAND, 1910?, $15 (ends Apr-01-05 09:00:04
PST)        4538635444 - SONGS OF THE GAEL by Breathnach, 1915, $19 (ends
Apr-01-05 09:00:45 PST)        6953408951 - ENGLISH FOLK SONGS FROM SOUTHERN APPALACHIANS by
Sharp, 2 volumes in 1, 1960, $49 (ends Apr-01-05 09:37:50 PST)        7310997086 - Songs of Work and Freedom by Fowke & Glazer, 1960,
$9.99 (ends Apr-01-05 14:36:58 PST)        7311028825 - Irish Street Ballads by Lochlainn, 1960, $5 (ends
Apr-01-05 18:16:07 PST)        7311225932 - The Vauxhall Comic Song - Book, 1850?, $9.99 (ends
Apr-02-05 19:15:13 PST)        7311256107 - Real Sailor Songs by Ashton, 1973 reprint, 12.99 GBP
(ends Apr-03-05 01:53:51 PST)        7311323873 - Folk Songs of Massachusetts by Whitefield, 1948,
$1.59 (ends Apr-03-05 10:49:07 PDT)        4538403416 - Folk Songs of the Americas by Lloyd, 1966, 5.69 GBP
(ends Apr-03-05 11:09:25 PDT)        4538406283 - A Ballad History of England by Palmer, 1979, 3.50
GBP (ends Apr-03-05 11:22:19 PDT)        4538443504 - EVERYMAN'S BOOK OF SEA SONGS by Baker & Miall, 1982,
4.99 GBP (ends Apr-03-05 13:45:37 PDT)        6953829609 - Robin Hood. A Collection of All the Ancient Poems,
Songs and Ballads by Ritson, 2 volumes, 1887 edition, 8 GBP (ends
Apr-04-05 12:14:47 PDT)        6953449929 - English Folk-song Some Conclusions by Sharp, 1907,
2.99 GBP (ends Apr-04-05 16:34:44 PDT)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Blue Grass Roy
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:24:51 EST
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Subject: Eddie Lenihan on Radio 4
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:37:32 EST
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Subject: Eddie Lenihan on Radio 4
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 05:10:27 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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I shared a performance once with Eddie at a storytelling festival in Milton
Keynes - he blew me off the stage. Also, he successfully championed the
non-removal of a bush on the grounds that it was a known stop-over place
for the Wee Folk on their journeys.
Highly recommended.Ewan McVicar

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Subject: Re: Eddie Lenihan on Radio 4
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 06:07:08 EST
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Subject: Re: Eddie Lenihan on Radio 4
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 06:49:54 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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My lack of clarity, Fred.The gig was in MK, the bush is in the midst of Ireland - well, I recall
reading recently someone burned it down! Are fairies known to be careless
with matches?Ewan McVicar

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Subject: It beggars belief
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 07:49:30 EST
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Subject: Re: Blue Grass Roy
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 08:01:29 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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Fred:Ron is still a subscriber.  He may not be at home or picking up email.  I forwarded your message to him.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Date: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 1:24 am
Subject: Blue Grass Roy> A couple of weeks ago, I posted a message saying that someone on
> this list
> had asked me to copy an LP of Blue Grass Roy, and that I had lost
> the name and
> address of the person in question.
>
> Nobody has yet contacted me, but I had a sudden recollection
> yesterday that
> the person in question might be Ron Cohen.
>
> Does anybody know whether he still contributes to this list and, if
> not,does anybody know how I can get in touch with him ?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Fred McCormick.
>

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Subject: Re: Blue Grass Roy
From: "Cohen, Ronald" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 12:11:24 -0500
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Fred: Yes, I guess I did mention wanting a copy of Blue Grass Roy, sorry not to have responded before. I am at:Ronald Cohen
Dept. of History
Indiana University Northwest
Gary, IN 46408-1197
 
Thanks! ron> A couple of weeks ago, I posted a message saying that someone on this list had asked me to copy an LP of Blue Grass Roy, and that I had lost the name and address of the person in question.
>  
> Nobody has yet contacted me, but I had a sudden recollection yesterday that the person in question might be Ron Cohen.
>  
> Does anybody know whether he still contributes to this list and, if not, does anybody know how I can get in touch with him ?
>  
> Cheers,
>  
> Fred McCormick.
> 

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Subject: Re: Blue Grass Roy
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 29 Mar 2005 12:27:47 EST
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Subject: Re: BALLAD-L Digest - 28 Feb 2005 (#2005-93): Earworms
From: Joe Fineman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 08:25:14 -0500
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Automatic digest processor <[unmask]>, in the
person of Heather Wood, writes:> does anyone know how to get rid of an ear-worm (the tune that gets
> into your head and stays there)?
>
> I've got those dam' puffer-trains ...and it's a REALLY STUPID tuneDeliberately switch to a suitably edifying tune, such as that of a
hymn or patriotic anthem.  I generally use The Star-Spangled Banner.
--
---  Joe Fineman    [unmask]||:  Whatever you live is life.  :||

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Subject: Puffer Billies
From: Lydia Fish <[unmask]>
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Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:38:34 EST
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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:49:46 -0500
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Yes I remember singing it in the fifties.
Just a guess but it sounds to me like the product of a 20s/30s children's
radio programme, something like 'Listen With Mother' British radio that is.Heather
Earworms can be very infectious, I'd watch out. Listening to the radio
about a year ago I caught part of foreign female singer singing a very
haunting song which was also familiar from my 50s childhood. Before I
eventually found out what it was I managed to infect 100s of my associates
and family with the annoying nagging desire to find out what the familiar
tune was. I eventually tracked it down. It was 'Coimbra'/ 'April in
Portugal' by Amalia Rodrigues that wonderful Fado singer, and I'm now a big
Fado fan.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Beth Brooks <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:50:35 -0500
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I read somewhere (I think our local newsrag) that the two best ways to
get rid of earworms is to play them on your instrument or share them
with someone else. I've subjected my husband to them over the years, and
it almost always goes away when I've given it to someone else.Beth Brooks>>Earworms can be very infectious, I'd watch out.

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Steve Gardham <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 13:05:05 -0500
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Thanks, Beth,
It certainly helped me sharing the earworm, but I don't think it endeared
me to those on the receiving end.
SteveG

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Simon Furey <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 18:16:52 -0000
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I agree with Beth. My technique is simply to sing the damn thing. The
mistake is not to let it out, or it just runs round in your head forever.Another trick might be to try and play it on an instrument one is totally
incompetent with, always assuming you happen to have such an instrument
lying around, of course. Then you get one of three results: your brain gives
up, you learn an interesting instrument or your neighbours kill you. Anyone
for "Puffer-Billies" on, say, the Uillean Pipes? ;oDCheers
Simon-----Original Message-----
From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]] On
Behalf Of Beth Brooks
Sent: 01 March 2005 16:51
To: [unmask]
Subject: Re: PufferbilliesI read somewhere (I think our local newsrag) that the two best ways to
get rid of earworms is to play them on your instrument or share them
with someone else. I've subjected my husband to them over the years, and
it almost always goes away when I've given it to someone else.Beth Brooks>>Earworms can be very infectious, I'd watch out.__________ NOD32 1.1015 (20050301) Information __________This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
http://www.nod32.com

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Adam Miller <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:24:25 -0800
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Dear Simon,Wait until you hear the soon-to-be-released CD "Sam Hinton - Master of
the Diatonic Harmonica," which comes out on June 4th.Sam plays "Pufferbillies" on the ten-hole diatonic harmonica, as a
round, by himself.  It's pretty amazing and entertaining.The album contains over 120 songs and stories on two CDs: Folksongs,
reels, jigs, double jigs, gospel songs, fiddle tunes, Yiddish ditties,
hoedowns and hornpipes  And it's all solo harmonica.  Many people don't
know that Sam is the greatest living non-blues, first position solo
harmonica player.-Adam Miller
Woodside, CAOn Mar 1, 2005, at 10:16 AM, Simon Furey wrote:> I agree with Beth. My technique is simply to sing the damn thing. The
> mistake is not to let it out, or it just runs round in your head
> forever.
>
> Another trick might be to try and play it on an instrument one is
> totally
> incompetent with, always assuming you happen to have such an instrument
> lying around, of course. Then you get one of three results: your brain
> gives
> up, you learn an interesting instrument or your neighbours kill you.
> Anyone
> for "Puffer-Billies" on, say, the Uillean Pipes? ;oD
>
> Cheers
> Simon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Forum for ballad scholars [mailto:[unmask]]
> On
> Behalf Of Beth Brooks
> Sent: 01 March 2005 16:51
> To: [unmask]
> Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
>
> I read somewhere (I think our local newsrag) that the two best ways to
> get rid of earworms is to play them on your instrument or share them
> with someone else. I've subjected my husband to them over the years,
> and
> it almost always goes away when I've given it to someone else.
>
> Beth Brooks
>
>>> Earworms can be very infectious, I'd watch out.
>
>
> __________ NOD32 1.1015 (20050301) Information __________
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.nod32.com
>

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:16:48 -0500
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>Dear Simon,
>
>Wait until you hear the soon-to-be-released CD "Sam Hinton - Master of
>the Diatonic Harmonica," which comes out on June 4th.
>
>Sam plays "Pufferbillies" on the ten-hole diatonic harmonica, as a
>round, by himself.  It's pretty amazing and entertaining.
>
>The album contains over 120 songs and stories on two CDs: Folksongs,
>reels, jigs, double jigs, gospel songs, fiddle tunes, Yiddish ditties,
>hoedowns and hornpipes  And it's all solo harmonica.  Many people don't
>know that Sam is the greatest living non-blues, first position solo
>harmonica player.I recall an Eddie Condon obituary: "one of jazz's great left-handed
rhythm guitar players" (or something like that).Thanks for the heads-up.  I really look forward to Sam's CD.>-Adam Miller
>Woodside, CA
--
john garst    [unmask]

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: Norm Cohen <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:31:42 -0800
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I saw Sam play harmonica (and other instruments) years ago several times.
He blew me away (so to speak)
Norm> >Dear Simon,
> >
> >Wait until you hear the soon-to-be-released CD "Sam Hinton - Master of
> >the Diatonic Harmonica," which comes out on June 4th.
> >
> >Sam plays "Pufferbillies" on the ten-hole diatonic harmonica, as a
> >round, by himself.  It's pretty amazing and entertaining.
> >
> >The album contains over 120 songs and stories on two CDs: Folksongs,
> >reels, jigs, double jigs, gospel songs, fiddle tunes, Yiddish ditties,
> >hoedowns and hornpipes  And it's all solo harmonica.  Many people don't
> >know that Sam is the greatest living non-blues, first position solo
> >harmonica player.
>
>

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Subject: Re: Pufferbillies
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:52:51 -0500
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>Does anyone know the history of Pufferbillies?  Is it an American song?
>  When did it first appear in print?
>...
>-Adam MillerHas anyone answered Adam's questions?Are far as I can tell, we have pushed it back to ca 1935 and had some
speculation that it was a '20s-'30s British song.John

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Subject: Ear-worms
From: Cal Lani Lani Herrmann <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:07:40 -0800
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Or another approach: blast it out of your head with
a worse (=more 'memorable,' invasive) one.  I find
that humming a few bars of, say, "Mairzy Doats" usually
works.  Of course, that leaves you with the dregs to
take care of -- Aloha, Lani<||> Lani Herrmann * [unmask] (or: [unmask])
<||> 5621 Sierra Ave. * Richmond, CA 94805 * (510) 237-7360

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Subject: Re: Ear-worms
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Tue, 1 Mar 2005 23:07:38 EST
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In a message dated 03/01/05 3:07:59 PM, [unmask] writes:<<  Lani Herrmann * [unmask] (or: [unmask])
<||> 5621 Sierra Ave. * Richmond, CA 94805 * (510) 237-7360
 >>

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Subject: New cd out- Rayna Gellert & Susie Goehring
From: "Lisa - S. H." <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 2 Mar 2005 20:59:43 -0500
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Friends,
I am passing the word about the release of Rayna Gellert & Susie'
Goehring's CD, "Starch and Iron".  Rayna plays oldtime fiddle to Susie's
guitar, and they both sing some great oldtime songs and ballads.  There is
a nice mix between instrumental fiddle tunes and songs.
Rayna's fiddling is truly impressive (as always), and the two women do some
beautiful harmony singing together.   -Susie does a particularly delectable
solo a cappella ballad Addie Graham used to sing, called Sister Thou Art
Mild and Lovely (my personal most favorite track, Susie's voice being so
true and pure, both strong and gentle at the same time).  Here's the
website for the cd,  -there are several MP3 sample cuts you can listen to
there:
http://starchandiron.utopiandesign.com/
(Standard disclaimer: I don't profit from any of this, nor was I asked to
post anything..... I just happen to admire Susie Goehring to pieces and
have loved her music and her voice for years.)      ;)Lisa Johnson

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Subject: New? Kids folklore
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 2 Mar 2005 22:57:37 -0500
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Ballad-listers,        This is not really ballad related, but still folklore related.        I've noticed that recently the television station news
broadcasts in the Washington DC area have discovered kids' folklore --
at least on one particular vein.        They've recently (after our relatively late snows for the area)
interviewed some small kids -- probably 6-8 years old -- about what they
do to make sure that it snows and school is thus closed for the day.        The two which I have noticed mentioned are:1)      Go to bed with your pajamas inside-out.2)      Flush some ice cubes down the toilet.        At least one interviewee did both to be sure.        So -- I have two questions relating to this:1)      Are TV stations in other areas "discovering" this?2)      Are there any other kid's folk beliefs which I have not mentioned
        to cause snow?        Thanks,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:13:41 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
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Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:27:04 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:30:45 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:36:31 EST
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Fred McCormick <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:36:36 EST
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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:03:41 -0800
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Subject: Starch&Iron
From: Cliff Abrams <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:05:08 -0800
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Bought the CD while listening to MP3-- The Girl I left
Behind Me. Their site takes you right to PayPal, so by
the time the tune was done-- so was the order. Very
good stuff.C.

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Beth Brooks <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 08:41:36 -0500
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I've never heard of my elementary students doing anything of the sort,
but I know the teachers are inclined to do a "snow dance" the week
before Christmas break!The ritualistic/superstitious inverted pyjamas and ice cubes down the
toilet come, I suspect, from some child-centered mass media, either the
movie "Snow Day" (which I've not seen) or from some episode of a
cartoon, now that cartoons are available on demand at any hour of any
day.Beth Brooks
>>> [unmask] 03/03/05 8:03 AM >>>
I never heard anything like these when I was in grade school in the US
northeast (1950s). In fact, we didn't even have the term "snow day."
When the snow was bad enough, we had a "day off from school."
/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: Kids' folklore
From: Joe Fineman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 08:43:43 -0500
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Automatic digest processor <[unmask]>, in the
person of DoN. Nichols, writes:>         They've recently (after our relatively late snows for the area)
> interviewed some small kids -- probably 6-8 years old -- about what
> they do to make sure that it snows and school is thus closed for the
> day.I spent part of my childhood in southern California, where it would
have taken very strong magic to make that happen, and part in Vermont,
where it would have taken a hell of a lot of snow.  Presumably such
folklore is confined to a climatic belt in between; perhaps
folklorists will someday come up with a map of it.
--
---  Joe Fineman    [unmask]||:  It's not who you know, it's whom.  :||

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: "Lisa - S. H." <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 09:04:05 -0500
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Amusingly, my email filter put this message in the SPAM box along with the
Viagra offers, yet totally ignored all the "Lady from France" posts.   ;)
LisaAt 05:36 AM 3/3/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>Hether,
>
> >is "repubication" when you get your balls back?<
>
>I wouldn't know. I've never lost mine.
>
>Fred
>

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Clifford J OCHELTREE <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 10:13:04 -0600
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Grew up in Chicago during the 50s and early 60s. We used the term "snow
days" but never had them. Chalk it up to Mayor Daley keeping the streets
[and alleys] clear at all costs. The first time a "snow day" was
declared came shortly after his death as the political machine began to
come apart.Speaking of Chicago, are any of you familiar with Slim Brundage's
daughter Dorothy? She passed away several years ago but I'm interested
in contacting her children.

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 11:26:57 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Clifford J OCHELTREE" <[unmask]><<Grew up in Chicago during the 50s and early 60s. We used the term "snow
days" but never had them. Chalk it up to Mayor Daley keeping the streets
[and alleys] clear at all costs. The first time a "snow day" was
declared came shortly after his death as the political machine began to
come apart.>>Not quite; January of '67, when we got 21" of snow in about 12 hours,
managed to shut the city down. I stayed on the U of C campus to see Judy
Collins do a concert at Mandel Hall (there were about 50 of us in the
audience), and never made it home.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 12:55:10 -0500
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Isn't the wearing of clothing inside out supposed to give
some form of protection from the fairy world? I know I've
read that in several stories.
I grew up in southern Cal, Hawaii, and south Texas. I don't
know who did what form of dance but I remember one winter day
getting snow in Texas. Two inches (maybe) and all the schools
closed. I saved some for my Dad who grew up in Worcester,
Mass. He was not terribly impressed.
Kathleen---- Original message ----
>Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 05:03:41 -0800
>From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
>Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
>To: [unmask]>   In my childhood, clothing (like socks or underwear)
>   inadvertently worn inside out was regarded as a
>   bringer of good luck - but it had to be done
>   inadvertently to work.

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 13:46:23 -0500
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On 2005/03/03 at 12:55:10PM -0500, [unmask] wrote:> Isn't the wearing of clothing inside out supposed to give
> some form of protection from the fairy world? I know I've
> read that in several stories.        That sounds like a reasonable origin for that part, at least.
And ice cubes down the toilet would be "sympathetic magic".> I grew up in southern Cal, Hawaii, and south Texas. I don't
> know who did what form of dance but I remember one winter day
> getting snow in Texas.        Hmm ... What part of South Texas?  I was in a town called
Cotulla -- about two thirds of the way from San Antonio to Laredo on
Highway 81.>                        Two inches (maybe) and all the schools
> closed.        And I remember once getting perhaps 1/4" to 1/2" of snow, and
they closed the schools for *two* days.  Someone had told them that it
was dangerous to drive on that stuff.  I remember that I had an Army
surplus pup tent set up, and the appearance of the snow on the ground
just outside the tent's entrance.  At a guess, this would have been
about 1952 or so.>         I saved some for my Dad who grew up in Worcester,
> Mass. He was not terribly impressed.        Nor would mine have been impressed, as he grew up in Boston
Mass.  But he was not there to see it, as I was living with my
grandparents because of rather severe asthma.        Enjoy,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 11:44:29 -0800
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Heather:Okay, I looked up this valuable resource, typed in "ballad" while searching _Gentleman's Magazine,_ got three hits including this from Vol. 5 (February, 1735), p. 93:"The scandalous practice of ballad singing is the bane of all good manners and morals, a nursery for idlers, whores and pickpockets, a School for Scandal, smut and debauchery and ought to be entirely suppressed, or reduced under p[roper restriction..."  There is more.  It is signed, ironically, "Democritis."Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Date: Thursday, March 3, 2005 2:27 am
Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication> In a message dated 3/3/2005 5:13:55 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> [unmask] writes:
> An unrivalled document of the cultural history of the era, the
> entire run of
> the magazine, 1731 to 1745,
> Interesting that the Internet Library of Early Journals at
> http://www.bodley.ox.ac.uk/ilej/ lists Gentleman's Magazine through
> 1750 (20 vols in all).
>
> For any who don't know this site, it holds the following journals
> (not all
> complete)
> Annual Register
> Blackwood's Edinburgh Magazine
> Gentleman's Magazine
> Notes and Queries
> Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society
> The Builder
>
> in pdf form. "Browse" is just an index of holdings, vols, issues.
> "Search" is
> somewhat unreliable--they haven't fully digitized the text. I have
> sometimesfound that the "next page" button will produce "File Not
> Found" -- way round
> this is to go to the last good page and manually type the required
> page number
> into the end of the URL. Also found that using Norton's Internet
> Securitysometimes prevents the images from displaying. Otherwise a
> great and useful
> website. Notes and Queries is particulary fab.
>
> Heather
>

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
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Subject: EAR-WORMS
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:07:00 EST
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So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the ear-worm
(although I don't believe he used that term)  about the handling of street-car
tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair"  which was seen as a poem
in a newspaper.  Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached a funeral
oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding their heads in
rhythm.  The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will kill me!"
to which the new widow, mistaking  the  cause of his agony, replied "Bless you
sir, for those kind words!"  Twain's advice, given after he had quoted the
entire  offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines, shun them as
you would the plague! "My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie,  was a country lawyer living in Beaumont,
Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and 'Dearie", his wife
and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's.  (We lived 700 miles
north of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.)  Dearie and Judge owned, among other
treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and reread) volumes,
and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."Sam Hinton
La Jolla, CAlifornia

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Subject: Vera Johnson
From: Andy Rouse <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 22:32:33 +0100
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I'd be grateful if anyone could supply the lyrics to Vera Johnson's
"Pierre Trudeau" song, especially if it was sent to [unmask]
within the next 14 hours! But anyhow!Andy

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:36:20 -0500
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>the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and reread) volumes,
>and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."
>
>Sam HintonWe hd it, and I recall it.John

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Norm Cohen <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 14:00:17 -0800
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Punch, brothers, punch,
Punch with care,
Punch in the presence of the passenjair.
A blue trip slip for a six cent fare,
A pink trip slip for a ten cent fare,
Punch brothers...  etc.
Is what echoes in my mind's ear.
Norm----- Original Message -----
From: <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:07 PM
Subject: EAR-WORMS> So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the
ear-worm
> (although I don't believe he used that term)  about the handling of
street-car
> tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair"  which was seen as a
poem
> in a newspaper.  Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached a
funeral
> oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding their
heads in
> rhythm.  The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will kill
me!"
> to which the new widow, mistaking  the  cause of his agony, replied "Bless
you
> sir, for those kind words!"  Twain's advice, given after he had quoted the
> entire  offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines, shun
them as
> you would the plague! "
>
> My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie,  was a country lawyer living in
Beaumont,
> Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and 'Dearie", his
wife
> and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's.  (We lived 700 miles
> north of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.)  Dearie and Judge owned, among other
> treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and
reread) volumes,
> and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."
>
> Sam Hinton
> La Jolla, CAlifornia
>

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:21:13 -0500
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>Punch, brothers, punch,
>Punch with care,
>Punch in the presence of the passenjair.
>A blue trip slip for a six cent fare,
>A pink trip slip for a ten cent fare,
>Punch brothers...  etc.
>Is what echoes in my mind's ear.
>NormI recallPunch, brothers, punch with care,
Punch in the presence of the passenjair....John

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Clifford J OCHELTREE <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:28:42 -0600
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True, I had forgotten. Unfortunately I was in a private HS by that time
and while the public schools were closed we were expected to attend class.Paul Stamler wrote:>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Clifford J OCHELTREE" <[unmask]>
>
><<Grew up in Chicago during the 50s and early 60s. We used the term "snow
>days" but never had them. Chalk it up to Mayor Daley keeping the streets
>[and alleys] clear at all costs. The first time a "snow day" was
>declared came shortly after his death as the political machine began to
>come apart.>>
>
>Not quite; January of '67, when we got 21" of snow in about 12 hours,
>managed to shut the city down. I stayed on the U of C campus to see Judy
>Collins do a concert at Mandel Hall (there were about 50 of us in the
>audience), and never made it home.
>
>Peace,
>Paul
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Clifford J OCHELTREE <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:30:58 -0600
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My only cousins were reared in Alaska. I recall asking them about "snow
days" and was advised that they did not have them. They were expected to
attend unless the temperature dropped below minus 50 degrees, no one
could be sure the busses would start![unmask] wrote:>Isn't the wearing of clothing inside out supposed to give
>some form of protection from the fairy world? I know I've
>read that in several stories.
>I grew up in southern Cal, Hawaii, and south Texas. I don't
>know who did what form of dance but I remember one winter day
>getting snow in Texas. Two inches (maybe) and all the schools
>closed. I saved some for my Dad who grew up in Worcester,
>Mass. He was not terribly impressed.
>Kathleen
>

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/03/05 (Songsters)
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:23:12 -0500
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Hi!        No earworms to report at the moment but perhaps we can find some
bookworms instead. :-) The main list will follow tomorrow.        SONGSTERS        6949318768 - 5 songster, recitations, song and joke book, and
songster catalogue, 1905-10, $4.99 (ends Mar-04-05 11:17:59 PST)        3878147874 - Henshaw & Ten Broeck The Nabobs Songster, 1892,
$9.50 (ends Mar-06-05 14:46:17 PST)        3962112952 - The Gormans' Minstrels Musical Album, 1891-2, $75
(ends Mar-09-05 18:17:24 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine republication
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:39:39 -0500
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The ILEJ project is an excellent start, but it should be borne in mind that it includes only a small selection of Gentleman's Mag. and Notes & Queries:
GM ran from 1745 - 1868 (224 volumes), so ILEJ has only 10%
NQ started in 1849 and is still going, and heaven knows what volume number they're up to now. They're both excellent sources, and they include oodles of folklore material, but there's no avoiding the slog of reading most of them in the original.
The 15 vols (plus index) of GM on offer from Postscript are quality cloth bindings, but the reproduction of some of the pages is rather muddy, as some of the early originals were.
They take up a whole shelf and look really smart, but they ain't worth ?700.
Steve Roud--
Message sent with Supanet E-mail-----Original Message-----
From:     Heather Wood <[unmask]>
To:       [unmask]
Subject:  Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication> In a message dated 3/3/2005 5:13:55 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> [unmask] writes:
> An unrivalled document of the cultural history of the era, the entire run of
> the magazine, 1731 to 1745,
> Interesting that the Internet Library of Early Journals at
> http://www.bodley.ox.ac.uk/ilej/ lists Gentleman's Magazine through 1750 (20 vols in all).
>
> For any who don't know this site, it holds the following journals (not all
> complete)
> Annual Register
> Blackwood's Edinburgh Magazine
> Gentleman's Magazine
> Notes and Queries
> Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society
> The Builder
>
> in pdf form. "Browse" is just an index of holdings, vols, issues. "Search" is
> somewhat unreliable--they haven't fully digitized the text. I have sometimes
> found that the "next page" button will produce "File Not Found" -- way round
> this is to go to the last good page and manually type the required page number
> into the end of the URL. Also found that using Norton's Internet Security
> sometimes prevents the images from displaying. Otherwise a great and useful
> website. Notes and Queries is particulary fab.
>
> HeatherSignup to supanet at https://signup.supanet.com/cgi-bin/signup?_origin=sigwebmail

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 14:55:53 -0800
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 15:26:17 -0800
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 18:37:45 EST
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 15:48:58 -0800
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Mary Cliff <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 18:55:33 -0500
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A recent recording by Canada's James Gordon is entitled "Endomusia."
Here's a definition from the web:>endomusia
>silent recall of a melody; endomusia often appears as a type of obsessive
>thought [Psychiatric Dictionary, 4th ed., Hinsie and Campbell]
ear-worm, no?Mary Cliff, TRADITIONS
WETA Radio

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 16:36:05 -0800
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Jonathan:One of the smarter folks who subscribe to ballad-l translated the German word for this common irritation.Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Date: Thursday, March 3, 2005 3:26 pm
Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS> "Ear-worm" in this sense isn't in the OED.  Did somebody just
> invent it, or is there a neat story behind it?
>
> JL
>
> [unmask] wrote:
> So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the
> ear-worm
> (although I don't believe he used that term) about the handling of
> street-car
> tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair" which was seen
> as a poem
> in a newspaper. Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached
> a funeral
> oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding
> their heads in
> rhythm. The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will
> kill me!"
> to which the new widow, mistaking the cause of his agony, replied
> "Bless you
> sir, for those kind words!" Twain's advice, given after he had
> quoted the
> entire offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines,
> shun them as
> you would the plague! "
>
> My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie, was a country lawyer living in
> Beaumont,Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and
> 'Dearie", his wife
> and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's. (We lived 700
> milesnorth of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.) Dearie and Judge owned,
> among other
> treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red
> (and reread) volumes,
> and that's where I found the story about "Punch, Brothers."
>
> Sam Hinton
> La Jolla, CAlifornia
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday!
> Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web
>

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: dick greenhaus <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 20:58:37 -0500
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Or, to move it up into Sci-Fi of the mid 20th Century:
"Tenser," said the tensor
"Tenser," said the tensor
Tension apprehension and dissension have begun...Norm Cohen wrote:>Punch, brothers, punch,
>Punch with care,
>Punch in the presence of the passenjair.
>A blue trip slip for a six cent fare,
>A pink trip slip for a ten cent fare,
>Punch brothers...  etc.
>Is what echoes in my mind's ear.
>Norm
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <[unmask]>
>To: <[unmask]>
>Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:07 PM
>Subject: EAR-WORMS
>
>
>
>
>>So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the
>>
>>
>ear-worm
>
>
>>(although I don't believe he used that term)  about the handling of
>>
>>
>street-car
>
>
>>tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair"  which was seen as a
>>
>>
>poem
>
>
>>in a newspaper.  Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached a
>>
>>
>funeral
>
>
>>oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding their
>>
>>
>heads in
>
>
>>rhythm.  The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will kill
>>
>>
>me!"
>
>
>>to which the new widow, mistaking  the  cause of his agony, replied "Bless
>>
>>
>you
>
>
>>sir, for those kind words!"  Twain's advice, given after he had quoted the
>>entire  offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines, shun
>>
>>
>them as
>
>
>>you would the plague! "
>>
>>My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie,  was a country lawyer living in
>>
>>
>Beaumont,
>
>
>>Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and 'Dearie", his
>>
>>
>wife
>
>
>>and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's.  (We lived 700 miles
>>north of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.)  Dearie and Judge owned, among other
>>treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and
>>
>>
>reread) volumes,
>
>
>>and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."
>>
>>Sam Hinton
>>La Jolla, CAlifornia
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Heather Wood <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 21:11:03 EST
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Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS
From: Jon Bartlett <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Thu, 3 Mar 2005 18:34:19 -0800
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Dick's 'tensor' line is from Alfred Bester, The Demolished Man:  here's
VonnegutTENT RENTALS
Rented a tent, a tent, a tent,
Rented a tent, a tent, a tent,
Rented a tent!
Rented a tent!
Rented a, rented a tent.- snare drum on Mars, from The Sirens of Titan.----- Original Message -----
From: "dick greenhaus" <[unmask]>
To: <[unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 5:58 PM
Subject: Re: EAR-WORMS> Or, to move it up into Sci-Fi of the mid 20th Century:
> "Tenser," said the tensor
> "Tenser," said the tensor
> Tension apprehension and dissension have begun...
>
>
>
> Norm Cohen wrote:
>
>>Punch, brothers, punch,
>>Punch with care,
>>Punch in the presence of the passenjair.
>>A blue trip slip for a six cent fare,
>>A pink trip slip for a ten cent fare,
>>Punch brothers...  etc.
>>Is what echoes in my mind's ear.
>>Norm
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: <[unmask]>
>>To: <[unmask]>
>>Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:07 PM
>>Subject: EAR-WORMS
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>So far, nobody has mentioned Mark Twain's wonderful account of the
>>>
>>>
>>ear-worm
>>
>>
>>>(although I don't believe he used that term)  about the handling of
>>>
>>>
>>street-car
>>
>>
>>>tickets, "Punch In the Presence of the Passenjair"  which was seen as a
>>>
>>>
>>poem
>>
>>
>>>in a newspaper.  Mark Twain unloaded it to a preacher, who preached a
>>>
>>>
>>funeral
>>
>>
>>>oration that had all the mourners tapping their toes and nodding their
>>>
>>>
>>heads in
>>
>>
>>>rhythm.  The preacher at one point burst out "Oh! This misery will kill
>>>
>>>
>>me!"
>>
>>
>>>to which the new widow, mistaking  the  cause of his agony, replied
>>>"Bless
>>>
>>>
>>you
>>
>>
>>>sir, for those kind words!"  Twain's advice, given after he had quoted
>>>the
>>>entire  offending poem, was "Reader, if you ever see these lines, shun
>>>
>>>
>>them as
>>
>>
>>>you would the plague! "
>>>
>>>My mother's father, "Judge" Duffie,  was a country lawyer living in
>>>
>>>
>>Beaumont,
>>
>>
>>>Texas. I used to spend my summers there with "Judge" and 'Dearie", his
>>>
>>>
>>wife
>>
>>
>>>and my maternal grandmother) 'way back in the 1920's.  (We lived 700
>>>miles
>>>north of there, in Tulsa, Oklahoma.)  Dearie and Judge owned, among other
>>>treasures, the Complete Works of Mark Twain in a set of many red (and
>>>
>>>
>>reread) volumes,
>>
>>
>>>and that's where I found the story about  "Punch, Brothers."
>>>
>>>Sam Hinton
>>>La Jolla, CAlifornia
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
From: Jack Campin <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:21:01 +0000
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> Has anyone know this very melodic ballad?  It has a recurring verse
> of "She's the earl of March's daughter/ and the flooer of ---/ but
> the humble squire of Tushielaw/ has ta'en her heart awa'"If you look at http://www.folktrax.com/bus001.htm you will see the
Tasmanian group Tantallon attributing it to Lionel McClelland and
saying they heard him sing it at Nitten Folk Club (in this village).
He'll have been doing a floor spot.Now I have heard Tantallon at Nitten Folk Club, they've been twice,
and I may have been there when they heard that.  I have certainly
heard it sung often enough around here.  But can I remember who
Lionel McClelland is?...I will ask somebody who might know on Thursday.Google suggests it's been a hit for Aoife Clancy who I haven't
knowingly heard.  At guess she got it from the Tantallon CD.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760
<http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack>     *     food intolerance data & recipes,
Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files, and my CD-ROM "Embro, Embro".
---> off-list mail to "j-c" rather than "ballad-l" at this site, please. <---

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
From: Jack Campin <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 10:12:38 +0000
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> Has anyone know this very melodic ballad?  It has a recurring
> verse of "She's the earl of March's daughterFurther to my previous reply: Lionel McClelland, who wrote it,
is half of Black-Eyed Biddy, who don't appear to have a website.
There's a review of one of their CDs at
   <http://www.folkmusic.net/htmfiles/webrevs/cdtrax056.htm>
but they don't seem to have recorded this song.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760
<http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack>     *     food intolerance data & recipes,
Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files, and my CD-ROM "Embro, Embro".
---> off-list mail to "j-c" rather than "ballad-l" at this site, please. <---

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Subject: Re: The Gentleman's Magazine repubication
From: Conrad Bladey Peasant <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 06:29:41 -0500
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Some things should perhaps not be digtized  :)CBJonathan Lighter wrote:> Thank you, Heather. You and Ed have done us all a service !
>
> JL
>
> Heather Wood <[unmask]> wrote:
>
>     For those who would like to flagellate themselves with the whole
>     article:
>
>
>     Grubstreet Journal, Feb 27 No. 276.
>
>     Of Ballad-singing.
>
>     The Scandalous Practice of Ballad-singing, is the Bane of all good
>     Manners and Morals, a Nursery for Idlers. Whores and Pickpockets, a
>     School for Scandal, Smut and Debauchery, and ought to be entirely
>     suppressed, or reduced under proper Restriction. If Ballads do not,
>     yet they ought to come under the Stamp Act, and the Law looks on
>     Ballad-singers as Vagrants. This brings to my Mind the ill Conduct
>     of many of our middling Gentry, who suffer their Children,
>     particularly their daughters, to frequent the Kitchen, be familiar
>     with the Servants, and so learn their Manners. One Part of their
>     Conversation turns upon frightful Stories of Witches, Apparitions,
>     &c. which serve to keep Miss in Awe, and in their interest.
>
>     Her Delight in the Kitchen-Conversation increases with her Years;
>     now is flattered, taught to shew Tricks upon Cards, and play at
>     Romps; ~ which soon makes her forget htt Birth, and think herself on
>     a level with them. Well! Miss is now out of her Hanging Sleeves, and
>     every one, especially the Footman, tells her how pretty she is. Now
>     Ballads and Love Songs are daily presented her, and vouched for
>     Truth: One tells, "How a Footman died for Love of a young Lady, and
>     how she was haunted by his Ghost, and died for Grief. Another, How
>     the Coachman run away with his young Mistress, took to Hedging and
>     Ditching, and she to Knitting and Spinning, and lived vast Happy,
>     and in great Plenty. And a third, How the young ’Squire,
>     Master’s eldest Son, fell in Love with the Chambermaid, married
>     her at the Fleet, was turn’d out of Doors, kept an Inn, got Money
>     as fast as Hops, till the old Gentleman died suddenly without a
>     Will, and then his Son got all, kept a Coach, and made his Wife a
>     great Lady, who bore him Twins for 12 years together, who all lived
>     to be Justices of the Peace, &c. By such foolish Stories Miss is
>     deluded; sighs, pities, and at last loves; and so too often undone
>     without Remedy
>
>     § A Female Correspondent, who signs Virtuous, complains of the many
>     ruinous Marriages that are every Year practiced in the Fleet, by a
>     Set of drunken swearing Parsons, with their Myrmidons that wear
>     black Coats, and pretend to. be Clerks and Registers to the Fleet,
>     plying about Ludgate-hill, pulling and forcing People to some
>     pedling Alehouse or Brandyshop to be married, even on Sunday,
>     stopping them as they go to the Church.
>
>     Not long since, a young Lady was deluded and forced from her
>     Friends, and by the Assistance of a very wicked swearing Parson,
>     married to an atheistical Wretch, whose Life is a continual Practice
>     of all Manner of Vice and Debauchery.—Another young Lady was
>     decoyed to a House in the confines of the Fleet by a pretended
>     Gentleman. Dr. Wryneck immediately appear'd, and swore she should be
>     married; or if she would not, he would have his Fee, and register
>     the Marriage from that Night. The Lady, to recover her Liberty, left
>     her Ring as a Pledge that she would meet h im the morrow Night.
>
>
>
>     Gentleman’s Magazine, Vol. 5 Feb 1735, p. 93
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>--
@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@#@@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@
Looking through my bedroom window, out into the moonlight and the
uneding smoke-colored snow,
I could see the lights in the windows of all the other houses on our
hill and hear the music rising from them
up the long, steadily falling night. I turned the gas down, I got into
bed. I said some words to the
close and holy darkness, and then I slept!-Dylan Thomas
####################################################################

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Subject: Re: BALLAD-L Digest - 3 Mar 2005 (#2005-99): Earworms
From: Joe Fineman <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 08:54:26 -0500
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Automatic digest processor <[unmask]>, in the
person of Dick Greenhaus, writes:> Or, to move it up into Sci-Fi of the mid 20th Century:
> "Tenser," said the tensor
> "Tenser," said the tensor
> Tension apprehension and dissension have begun...IIRC, Mark 2ain's "Punch, brothers" was quoted in that very story by
Alfred Bester (whose title has succumbed to my senility -- ah, no, not
quite: "The Demolished Man").  8, sir, 7, sir, 6, sir, 5, sir,
  4, sir, 3, sir, 2, sir, 1.
--
---  Joe Fineman    [unmask]||:  When scared of the dark, it may help to close your eyes.  :||

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Subject: Earworm
From: Educational CyberPlayGround <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 10:40:54 -0500
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FYI: Exactly what an earworm is.
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Culdesac/Stars/funkbrothersCulture.htmlKaren Ellis
Educational CyberPlayGround<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>
The Educational CyberPlayGround
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/National Children's Folksong Repository
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/NCFR/Hot List of Schools Online and
Net Happenings, K12 Newsletters, Network Newsletters
http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/Community/7 Hot Site Awards
New York Times, USA Today , MSNBC, Earthlink,
USA Today Best Bets For Educators, Macworld Top Fifty
<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>~~~~~<>

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Subject: Rochelle's Recovery
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 08:38:38 -0800
Content-Type:text/plain
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Folks:This good report about Rochelle Goldstein, Ken's widow, comes from daughter Rhoda Goldstein.  A few more get-well emails might  boost Rochelle's return to action.Ed
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear friends,
    I just wanted to let you all know that my mom is doing much better and
will be going home tomorrow to her own apt.  She's come a very long way in a
relatively short time. While she is still weak , she has great range of
motion in her upper body and can walk with a walker, which hopefully soon
she will be able to throw away! She gets stronger everyday. Her physical
therapist told her she has the spirit and drive of a 20 year old, not a 73
year-old.  She'll continue to get physical therapy at home, and for the next
few weeks either I, Scott or Diane will be with her to help her out.  Thank
you to everyone who has sent her good wishes.  She has thrived on the cards,
emails, visits and calls she has received.
Warm wishes and thanks,
Rhoda Goldstein

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Subject: Vera Johnson, Pierre Trudeau, Justin Thyme
From: Barry O'Neill <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 11:51:52 -0500
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Years ago someone on this list to whom I am grateful send me thisPierre Trudeau is very astute
Not only that, he really is cute
He's got ideas, and get up and go
That's why we like Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, un homme savant
Et quelquefois, un homme charmant
Il boit seulement du lait et de l'eau
Il est gentil, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, he comes from Quebec
But doesn't think like Rene' Levesque
He wants to see our Canada grow.
Both strong and free, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, il parle bien
Avec candeur, sans peur de rien
"Les Liberaus sont idiots."
Il dit cela, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau has positive views
Cast totems down and break the taboos
Forget the past, the old status quo
Try something new, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, c'est vrai qu'il est riche
Mais pour l'argent, il dit "Je m'en fiche"
Il demeure seul dans un grand chateau
Tout simplement, Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, he doesn't conform
In thought or dress, to what is the norm
He is unique, we want you to know
There's no one like Pierre TrudeauPierre Trudeau, c'est l'homme pour moi
Il veut garder, proteger nos droits
Et quand il parle, j'ecoute ses mots
Car il est sage, Pierre Trudeau.

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:15:03 -0500
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---- Original message ----
>Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 13:46:23 -0500
>From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
>Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore>>  I remember one winter day getting snow in Texas.
>
>        Hmm ... What part of South Texas?Corpus Christi, on the Gulf coast way down towards the tip.
My dad being in the Navy we didn't live there long, but we
did live there twice. Birth to 2 I don't remember much; the
snow incident would have been between 5-7 years... around
1963-66.
It was while in Corpus Christi that I was introduced to girl
scouts from which venerable organization I learned many fine
rounds... including the recently discussed "Rose,Rose,Rose".
I learned it with the same version of words that Ghost
posted. Though I cut my eye teeth on Sea Shanties as a baby
(Dad may never have sailed in square riggers but that didn't
stop him from singing as if he had) the first ballad type
song I ever learned was also through Girl Scouts, "The Cruel
War is Raging". Never have figured out if it's truly a
traditional song?Aha! Back to the topic of Ballads. Sort of.
Kathleen

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Subject: Missing Email address
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 14:46:08 -0800
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Folks:I doubt many of you have Rhoda Goldstein's address.  So if yoy wish to send her encouraging greetings, do it through:Rhoda Goldstein <[unmask]>Ed

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Subject: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Mehlberg <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 17:30:08 -0600
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Hello everyone,Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
US...Yours,John Mehlberg
~
  UNCLE BUD   (Recording: http://tinyurl.com/3mcoe )  Uncle Bud's fine; Uncle Bud is keen.
  Uncle Bud's got plenty of gasoline.        Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud.  Uncle Bud's got this; Uncle Bud's got that.
  Uncle Bud's got a dick like a baseball bat.        Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud.]  Uncle Bud's got a wife.  She's big and fat.
  She's got a cunt like a Stetson hat.    Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud, Uncle Bud.  Notes: This is transcribed from the LP "Unexpurgated Folk Songs
of Men" by Mack McCormick.

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Subject: Ebay List - 03/04/05
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 20:21:45 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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Hi!        As promised, here are the remaining bookworms for this week.        MISCELLANEOUS        4526273000 - Virginia Folk Legends by Barden, 1991, $4.99 (ends
Mar-06-05 14:30:00 PST)        4705823647 - Ontario Ballads & Folksongs, LP, $8 (ends Mar-06-05
18:19:17 PST)        SONGBOOKS, ETC.        6949209213 - The Singin' Gatherin' by Thomas & Leeder, 1939, $9.99
(ends Mar-05-05 18:52:47 PST)        7303326418 - A Ballad History of England by Palmer, 1979, 9.99 GBP
(ends Mar-05-05 22:54:05 PST)        6949270018 - FOLK SONGS, CHANTEYS, AND SINGING GAMES by Sharp &
Farnsworth, 1909, $4.49 (ends Mar-06-05 07:25:17 PST)        4531730654 - Irish Street Ballads by O'Lochlainn, 1960, $17 (ends
Mar-06-05 15:02:17 PST)        6947346494 - Frontier Ballads by Finger, 1927, $19.99 (ends
Mar-06-05 18:00:00 PST)        3961560840 - A BALLAD HISTORY of IRELAND by MacHale, 1906, $9.95
(ends Mar-06-05 19:58:51 PST)        4705985097 - Cold Snap by MacColl & Seeger, LP, 1977, 4.99 GBP
(ends Mar-07-05 11:00:27 PST)        6949546302 - THE OXFORD NURSERY RHYME BOOK by Opie, 1963 edition,
$0.39 (ends Mar-07-05 19:06:44 PST)        6949553504 - Folk Songs of the American Negro by Work, $6 (ends
Mar-07-05 20:05:02 PST)        7304895880 - 2 books (American Mountain Songs & Buckaroo Ballads),
$5.99 (ends Mar-08-05 07:30:54 PST)        7304967703 - TIP TOP ALBUM OF CARSON J. ROBINSON SONGS, 1931, $6
(ends Mar-08-05 12:25:40 PST)        4531475946 - Ballad Hunter by Lomax, 1947, $10.50 (ends Mar-08-05
14:13:15 PST)        6515975810 - Salt and Peanuts, Our Favorite Comdey Songs and
Ballads, 1931, $9.99 (ends Mar-09-05 08:38:24 PST)        6949374738 - Traditional Tunes of the Child Ballads by Bronson,
complete set (4 volumes), 1962-72, $202.50 AU (ends Mar-09-05 16:37:27 PST)        4532671458 - AIRMAN'S SONG BOOK by Ward-Jackson & Lucas, 1967,
4.99 GBP (ends Mar-10-05 04:30:04 PST)        4532783455 - One Singer One Song by McVicar, 1990, 4.99 GBP (ends
Mar-10-05 11:43:16 PST)        3878799607 - EVERYMANS BOOK OF ENGLISH COUNTRY SONGS by Palmer,
1979, 4.99 GBP (ends Mar-12-05 09:16:11 PST)        4532515975 - A Scottish Ballad Book by Buchan, 1973, 1 GBP (ends
Mar-12-05 13:25:18 PST)        6949929168 - Ballads Migrant in New England by Flanders & Olney,
1953, $10 (ends Mar-13-05 07:43:22 PST)                                Happy Bidding!
                                Dolores--
Dolores Nichols                 |
D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 21:19:54 -0500
Content-Type:text/plain
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On 2005/03/04 at 04:15:03PM -0500, [unmask] wrote:> >From: "DoN. Nichols" <[unmask]>> >>  I remember one winter day getting snow in Texas.
> >
> >        Hmm ... What part of South Texas?
>
> Corpus Christi, on the Gulf coast way down towards the tip.        O.K.  That would have had more humidity, so it would be more
likely to actually get snow from time to time.  In Cotulla, the virtual
snowfalls were separated by about the traditional "seven long years". :-)
We were lacking in both cold and humidity most of the year.
(Occasionally, it would get cold enough so above-ground water faucets
would be left trickling, and the vertical pipes wrapped in old
newspaper.> My dad being in the Navy we didn't live there long, but we
> did live there twice. Birth to 2 I don't remember much; the
> snow incident would have been between 5-7 years... around
> 1963-66.        O.K.  You sound like a kid from a Navy family.        [ ... ]> posted. Though I cut my eye teeth on Sea Shanties as a baby
> (Dad may never have sailed in square riggers but that didn't
> stop him from singing as if he had)        Hmm ... my father was partial to Shanties as well.  I wasn't old
enough to have any critical sense of the quality of his singing at that
age, and he had quit by the time I acquired said sense.        I only managed to get one nautical recitation from him on tape
some years before he passed on.  I don't know if it had an official
title, but I knew it as "Ci-vil-e-tie".>                                     the first ballad type
> song I ever learned was also through Girl Scouts, "The Cruel
> War is Raging". Never have figured out if it's truly a
> traditional song?        I believe that it is traditional.  I'm sure that someone will
fill us in with chapter and verse on that soon enough.        I see that I missed something by not becoming a scout.  I was
more tempted (at the time) by things like building your own crystal
radio (in an area where the signal strength was far too weak for a
crystal radio to be practical. About the only thing which I would have
been likely to get is the private airport mechanically broadcasting
it's identifier "COT" (_._. ___ _ in Morse code) very slowly. :-)        Enjoy,
                DoN.--
 Email:   <[unmask]>   | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
        (too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
           --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Jonathan Lighter <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 18:24:38 -0800
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Subject: _The Shaughraun_ by Boucicault and the tune to Harvey Duff
From: bennett schwartz <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:50:05 -0500
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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Fri, 4 Mar 2005 23:28:07 EST
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As a kid, I knew only one verse of "Uncle Bud;"  I was a "good boy," and
didn't seek furhther verses, although I knew there were some.    "Old Uncle Bud is the jelly-roll king;
    Got a hump in his back from a-shakin' that thing."Sam Hinton
La Jolla, CA

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 00:16:49 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: <[unmask]><<Though I cut my eye teeth on Sea Shanties as a baby
(Dad may never have sailed in square riggers but that didn't
stop him from singing as if he had) the first ballad type
song I ever learned was also through Girl Scouts, "The Cruel
War is Raging". Never have figured out if it's truly a
traditional song?>>It is; Laws lists it as O33, under the title of "The Girl Volunteer".
Earliest citation in the Traditional Ballad Index is 1914 (Brown), but it's
certainly older than that.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: Paul Stamler <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 00:25:48 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: "John Mehlberg" <[unmask]><<Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
US...>>A cleanish version was recorded by Gid Tanner & his Skillet Lickers in 1928.
For other information, see the entry in the Traditional Ballad Index.Peace,
Paul

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Subject: Self Congratulations
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 04:45:10 -0500
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Hurray!
A book I wrote appears in sainted Dolores Nichols' current Ebay list.
I shall have a drink tonight to celebrate.
The price of ?4.99 quoted is what it still sells for in the shops.EwanEwan McVicar, 
84 High Street
Linlithgow, 
West Lothian
Scotland
EH49 7AQtel 01506 847935

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: Beth Brooks <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 07:43:58 -0500
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It appears so, at least here in the Hoosier state. I polled 3 classes of
5th graders and one class of undergrads and they had never heard
anything of the sort (although my 5th graders were willing to give it a
try!).Beth Brooks>>> [unmask] 03/04/05 9:24 PM >>>
So the consensus - no, the unanimous decision - is that snow-day
superstitions are new. Or at least newly applied to "snow days."JL

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw
From: Jean Lepley <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 05:14:28 -0800
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On Mon, 28 Feb 2005, Murray Shoolbraid wrote:> Jean - it would help a great deal if you posted the words you can make out.
>
> Murray Shoolbraid
>
I would if I hadn't already got my answer from Malcolm Douglas (and his
lead to a record with Garrick Macpherson singing "the earl of March's
daughter").  Thanks all!

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Subject: Re: Self Congratulations
From: Conrad Bladey Peasant <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:11:43 -0500
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Congratulations!Not long ago I found one of my books on Abe at 300% of original value!
And.....it was soon sold!Watch for a hand painted hubcap from my artcar Handy on ebay- signed!
and with an autographed portrait of myself and the car!- who knows I may
include my song about artcars-http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Vines/5863/artcaranthem.htmlThe midi must be played to truly understand!~
LITTLE     PlAIN      CARS
An Artcar Anthem!         Adapted  from Malvina Reynolds ?Little Boxes?
         To Play Midi sound click here
         For Notation click here
         For ABC Notation click here         Little plain cars on the car lots,
         Little plain cars  made of  status quo-a-stuff
         Little plain cars on the high-a-ways,
         Little plain cars all the same,
         There's a black one and a brown one
         And a blue one and a red one
         And they're all made out of status quo-a-stuff
         And they all look just the same.         And the people in the plain cars
         All went to the university
         Where they were put in plain cars
         And they came out all the same
         And there's doctors and lawyers
         And street rod-od-ers
         And they're all made out of status quo-a-stuff
         And they all look just the same.         And they all play on the golf course
         And drink their hand-crafted beer
         And they all have pretty children
         And the children go to school,
         And the children go to summer camp
         And then to the university
         Where they are all  put in plain cars
         And they drive out all the same.         And the boys go into business
         And marry and raise a family
         Drive in  plain cars made of status quo-a-stuff
         And they all look just the same,
         There's a green one and a grey one
         And a blue one and a yellow one
         And they're all made out of status quo-a-stuff
         And they all look just the same.         But the one child  he?s an ar-tist
         And knows that his freedom?s real
         Tired of plain cars made of status quo-a-stuff
         That all look just the same,
         Now there?s glued ones and there are painted ones
         And a carved one and a magnet one
         And they?re all made out of  joy and smiles
         And they all are all the rage!         (alt last verse or add on - And they all the world will change!)Back to chasing Guy Fawkes!ConradEwan McVicar wrote:
> Hurray!
> A book I wrote appears in sainted Dolores Nichols' current Ebay list.
> I shall have a drink tonight to celebrate.
> The price of ?4.99 quoted is what it still sells for in the shops.
>
> Ewan
>
>
> Ewan McVicar,
> 84 High Street
> Linlithgow,
> West Lothian
> Scotland
> EH49 7AQ
>
> tel 01506 847935
>--
@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@##@#@#@#@#@#@@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@#@
Looking through my bedroom window, out into the moonlight and the
uneding smoke-colored snow,
I could see the lights in the windows of all the other houses on our
hill and hear the music rising from them
up the long, steadily falling night. I turned the gas down, I got into
bed. I said some words to the
close and holy darkness, and then I slept!-Dylan Thomas
####################################################################

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Subject: Little Boxes parodies - was Self Congratulations
From: [unmask]
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Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 11:04:22 EST
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Subject: Re: Self Congratulations
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 08:17:48 -0800
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Ewan:Take heart!  When my books turn up on ebay or in used book stores, they are listed at a fraction of their cost.  The worst was a 50-cent price for a book I spent four years on.  That sent me to drink too.Ah, capitalism.Ed----- Original Message -----
From: Ewan McVicar <[unmask]>
Date: Saturday, March 5, 2005 1:45 am
Subject: Self Congratulations> Hurray!
> A book I wrote appears in sainted Dolores Nichols' current Ebay list.
> I shall have a drink tonight to celebrate.
> The price of ?4.99 quoted is what it still sells for in the shops.
> 
> Ewan
> 
> 
> Ewan McVicar, 
> 84 High Street
> Linlithgow, 
> West Lothian
> Scotland
> EH49 7AQ
> 
> tel 01506 847935
>

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 12:47:34 -0500
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I checked with my 12 yr old niece (who lives in NH). She had
indeed heard of the inside out PJs, and she had a further
ritual. You say "no school" backwards five times and then go
straight to bed. Preferably with those inside out jammies on.
That's "loohcs on" for those of you wiling to try it.
Kathleen>>>> [unmask] 03/04/05 9:24 PM >>>
>So the consensus - no, the unanimous decision - is that snow-
day
>superstitions are new. Or at least newly applied to "snow
days."
>
>JL

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 12:53:38 -0500
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>>----- Original Message -----
>From: <[unmask]>
>"The Cruel War is Raging". Never have figured out if it's
truly a traditional song?>>
>
>It is; Laws lists it as O33, under the title of "The Girl
Volunteer".
>Earliest citation in the Traditional Ballad Index is 1914
(Brown), but it's
>certainly older than that.
>
>Peace,
>PaulAs I've learned more, and heard more, traditional ballad and
song, I've started to recognize some of the themes and motifs
in that song. Especially the ever popular "I'll cut off my
hair and dress in Men's clothes" idea. But having learned it
from a guitar playing teenager in the midst of the 60's folk
revival I always suspected it. Good to know it's got a older
pedigree.
I learn so much from this list! Thank you.
Kathleen

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Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
From: [unmask]
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 13:07:23 -0500
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Aoife Clancy is a member of the Clancy Brother's family (a
daughter of one of the brothers?). She's been the vocalist
for the Irish music group Cherish the Ladies for a few years
now. She has a lovely voice.
Kathleen---- Original message ----
>Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:21:01 +0000
>From: Jack Campin <[unmask]>
>Subject: Re: ballad of Tushielaw (sp?)
>To: [unmask]>>Google suggests it's been a hit for Aoife Clancy who I
haven't
>knowingly heard.

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Subject: Re: Ebay List - 03/04/05
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:42:43 -0800
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Dolores:I note that your "search engine" for eBay picked up the Barden folk legends volume.  I wonder if you could rewrite that "engine" -- perhaps posting to ballad-l in a separate listing -- to pick up more folklore, tale, belief, etc., books.Such a supplement would, first of all, complement the song and ballad listings; and, second, would enhance the already considerable value of your work on our behalf.Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: Dolores Nichols <[unmask]>
Date: Friday, March 4, 2005 5:21 pm
Subject: Ebay List - 03/04/05> Hi!
>
>        As promised, here are the remaining bookworms for this week.
>
>        MISCELLANEOUS
>
>        4526273000 - Virginia Folk Legends by Barden, 1991, $4.99
> (endsMar-06-05 14:30:00 PST)
>
>        4705823647 - Ontario Ballads & Folksongs, LP, $8 (ends Mar-
> 06-05
> 18:19:17 PST)
>
>        SONGBOOKS, ETC.
>
>        6949209213 - The Singin' Gatherin' by Thomas & Leeder,
> 1939, $9.99
> (ends Mar-05-05 18:52:47 PST)
>
>        7303326418 - A Ballad History of England by Palmer, 1979,
> 9.99 GBP
> (ends Mar-05-05 22:54:05 PST)
>
>        6949270018 - FOLK SONGS, CHANTEYS, AND SINGING GAMES by
> Sharp &
> Farnsworth, 1909, $4.49 (ends Mar-06-05 07:25:17 PST)
>
>        4531730654 - Irish Street Ballads by O'Lochlainn, 1960, $17
> (endsMar-06-05 15:02:17 PST)
>
>        6947346494 - Frontier Ballads by Finger, 1927, $19.99 (ends
> Mar-06-05 18:00:00 PST)
>
>        3961560840 - A BALLAD HISTORY of IRELAND by MacHale, 1906,
> $9.95(ends Mar-06-05 19:58:51 PST)
>
>        4705985097 - Cold Snap by MacColl & Seeger, LP, 1977, 4.99 GBP
> (ends Mar-07-05 11:00:27 PST)
>
>        6949546302 - THE OXFORD NURSERY RHYME BOOK by Opie, 1963
> edition,$0.39 (ends Mar-07-05 19:06:44 PST)
>
>        6949553504 - Folk Songs of the American Negro by Work, $6
> (endsMar-07-05 20:05:02 PST)
>
>        7304895880 - 2 books (American Mountain Songs & Buckaroo
> Ballads),$5.99 (ends Mar-08-05 07:30:54 PST)
>
>        7304967703 - TIP TOP ALBUM OF CARSON J. ROBINSON SONGS,
> 1931, $6
> (ends Mar-08-05 12:25:40 PST)
>
>        4531475946 - Ballad Hunter by Lomax, 1947, $10.50 (ends Mar-
> 08-05
> 14:13:15 PST)
>
>        6515975810 - Salt and Peanuts, Our Favorite Comdey Songs and
> Ballads, 1931, $9.99 (ends Mar-09-05 08:38:24 PST)
>
>        6949374738 - Traditional Tunes of the Child Ballads by
> Bronson,complete set (4 volumes), 1962-72, $202.50 AU (ends Mar-09-
> 05 16:37:27 PST)
>
>        4532671458 - AIRMAN'S SONG BOOK by Ward-Jackson & Lucas, 1967,
> 4.99 GBP (ends Mar-10-05 04:30:04 PST)
>
>        4532783455 - One Singer One Song by McVicar, 1990, 4.99 GBP
> (endsMar-10-05 11:43:16 PST)
>
>        3878799607 - EVERYMANS BOOK OF ENGLISH COUNTRY SONGS by
> Palmer,1979, 4.99 GBP (ends Mar-12-05 09:16:11 PST)
>
>        4532515975 - A Scottish Ballad Book by Buchan, 1973, 1 GBP
> (endsMar-12-05 13:25:18 PST)
>
>        6949929168 - Ballads Migrant in New England by Flanders &
> Olney,1953, $10 (ends Mar-13-05 07:43:22 PST)
>
>                                Happy Bidding!
>                                Dolores
>
> --
> Dolores Nichols                 |
> D&D Data                        | Voice :       (703) 938-4564
> Disclaimer: from here - None    | Email:     <[unmask]>
>        --- .sig? ----- .what?  Who me?
>

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Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore
From: edward cray <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:54:00 -0800
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Folks:My old professor Wayland Hand would be busy writing all these down.  They are interesting inversions of the widely held belief that putting on or wearing clothes (outwear to underwear) backwards brings BAD luck., or in Utah "invites all evil."Ed----- Original Message -----
From: [unmask]
Date: Saturday, March 5, 2005 9:47 am
Subject: Re: New? Kids folklore> I checked with my 12 yr old niece (who lives in NH). She had
> indeed heard of the inside out PJs, and she had a further
> ritual. You say "no school" backwards five times and then go
> straight to bed. Preferably with those inside out jammies on.
> That's "loohcs on" for those of you wiling to try it.
> Kathleen
>
> >>>> [unmask] 03/04/05 9:24 PM >>>
> >So the consensus - no, the unanimous decision - is that snow-
> day
> >superstitions are new. Or at least newly applied to "snow
> days."
> >
> >JL
>

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Subject: Re: "Uncle Bud" song
From: John Garst <[unmask]>
Reply-To:Forum for ballad scholars <[unmask]>
Date:Sat, 5 Mar 2005 14:17:23 -0500
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>----- Original Message -----
>From: "John Mehlberg" <[unmask]>
>
><<Does anyone remember reading any info on the bawdy song
>"Uncle Bud"?    This song used to be widespread in the southern
>US...>>
>
>A cleanish version was recorded by Gid Tanner & his Skillet Lickers in 1928.
>For other information, see the entry in the Traditional Ballad Index.
>
>Peace,
>PaulZora Neale Hurston, Mules and Men?, something on-line at LOC's American Memory?John--
john garst    [unmask]

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